There are a few of us who have either been in Prison or have a family member or friend who is in or has been in prison and I wondered if there could be a forum for it.

[pachyderm]

Originally Posted by Tishie

There are a few of us who have either been in Prison or have a family member or friend who is in or has been in prison and I wondered if there could be a forum for it.

Interesting thought. I have not, but there is another population without much support in the general society. I would be interested in reading.

[pegasus]

Just my opinion.

I'm pretty sure that it says in the community guidelines that these forums are more geared towards victims of abuse and not for offenders. I know there has been some exceptions to that rule.

I don't know how safe the forums would feel having a place for offenders, or people who are or have been in prison to talk. I wouldn't be happy with it. Not my decision of course but I feel many people would be unhappy with that. It does say in the guidelines that people who have abused another indiviual whether emotionally, physically or sexually are not welcomed here.

I'd like to see the forums kept safe and as it is.

[pachyderm]

Originally Posted by pegasus

Just my opinion.

I'm pretty sure that it says in the community guidelines that these forums are more geared towards victims of abuse and not for offenders. I know there has been some exceptions to that rule.

I don't know how safe the forums would feel having a place for offenders, or people who are or have been in prison to talk. I wouldn't be happy with it. Not my decision of course but I feel many people would be unhappy with that. It does say in the guidelines that people who have abused another indiviual whether emotionally, physically or sexually are not welcomed here.

I'd like to see the forums kept safe and as it is.

There may be some who have been in prison, or who have relatives in prison, who are not sexual offenders, or other kinds who have abused people like us?

[(JD)]

I agree with Pegasus in how I read the guidelines, but I could be wrong.

It's a sticky area because of course those who have reformed may need support ... but for members of those who are convicts, I think the "relationships" forum would give the outlet needed.

[MandiePoo]

Having been in relationships with those who were incarcerated for OTHER issues than abuse of someone(not my examples, but could be, theft, shoplifting, driving under the influence, robbery, or tax fraud, or alot of things which are not about abuse of a person, at least physically) I think that this could be a valid subfora of relationships.

Especially with mental health issues, at least some of them - it can sometimes lead to behaviors which could land someone in jail.(Example: Someone with severe police phobia is arrested on something fairly benign, however has severe panic attack and lashes out - getting themselves a resisting arrest and assault on an officer charge).

I DO think it would have to be done on a trial basis with stringent rules to follow. (Those who have abused another either real or imagined convicted or not, are not welcome as this site focuses on victims. You are welcome to talk about YOUR problems and issues, however we do not provide support for issues where you have abused another) This way you could provide someone an area to get support for the issues which caused them to land in jail in the first place - WITHOUT necessarily going into detail about the charge and whatnot. Someone could easily say "my anger issues landed me in jail" and that would be enough to gain support without having to go into the situation" I was afraid and lashed out assaulting an officer".

I think this is very doable but needs to be discussed further.

Adding more:

In regards to those with relatives in prison, much as the wives of people on duty in the military, a place to meet with others in the same position would be very supportive and I can't see it being a bad thing for the most part. It would again need structuring and a close eye kept on it during the test phase.

Regarding the wish of those who don't wish this to happen due to the abuse rule, while I can see that point of veiw, I don't think it necessarily would be as much of an issue in that regard if some rules were set down. There is always the option to not visit the forum, much as it was for some others. Any of the forums(i think, but am not sure if it still works since the move to new software) can be hidden for those who find them triggering.

All of this is of course just my opinion and I strongly feel for sure it needs to be talked about and structured carefully at the least. Sometimes its so difficult to balance support for victims and those who have not necessarily abused another, but are offenders themselves.

American prisons and jails held 2,304,115 inmates in 2008.[7] Approximately one in every 18 men in the United States is behind bars or being monitored. A significantly greater percentage of the American population is in some form of correctional control even though crime rates have declined by about 25 percent from 1988-2008.[13] 70% of prisoners in the United States are non-whites.[14] In recent decades the U.S. has experienced a surge in its prison population, quadrupling since 1980, partially as a result of mandated sentences that came about during the "war on drugs." Violent crime and property crime have declined since the early 1990s.[15]
As of 2004, the three states with the lowest ratio of imprisoned to civilian population are Maine (148 per 100,000), Minnesota (171 per 100,000), and Rhode Island (175 per 100,000). The three states with the highest ratio are Louisiana (816 per 100,000), Texas (694 per 100,000), and Mississippi (669 per 100,000).[16]
Nearly one million of those incarcerated in state and federal prisons, as well as local jails, are serving time for committing non-violent crimes.[17]
In 2002, 93.2% of prisoners were male. About 10.4% of all black males in the United States between the ages of 25 and 29 were sentenced and in prison, compared to 2.4% of Hispanic males and 1.3% of white males.[18]
In 2005, about 1 out of every 136 U.S. residents was incarcerated either in prison or jail.[19] The total amount being 2,320,359, with 1,446,269 in state and federal prisons and 747,529 in local jails.[20]
A 2005 report estimated that 27% of federal prison inmates are noncitizens, convicted of crimes while in the country legally or illegally.[21] However, federal prison inmates are only six percent of the total incarcerated population; noncitizen populations in state and local prisons are more difficult to establish. The World Prison Brief puts the total number of foreign prisoners in all federal, state and local facilities at 5.9%.[1]

I thought I would throw that up for some perspective on how many people actually go into jail every year - I used the USA since that seems to be the most common member base here at this point in time. If others are interested I could find it for their country too, just let me know.

So if we think that 1 of every 18 males are in jail for something in 1 year, and we have 95000 members the last time I checked which granted has been a while - say half of those are males. If i have my math correctly, thay means over 2000 members have been in jail at some point throughout the year - which is a pretty high number. tHe issue is how many of those are abusers? And is there any way to have quality control of sorts on that?

Again, needs more thinking I think. Im really on the fence on this one.

Just because someone was in prison does NOT mean they abused someone. Lots of people end up in prison because of bad choices.

I have seen members here talk about hitting someone or even worse, but they blamed their mental illness. The guidelines are confusing because it seems some abusers ARE allowed.

I was thinking more along the lines of ....

My son is now 20 and has been in and out of Prison for various crimes of theft to fighting to taking a car without permission.

NOT crimes of a sexual nature.

More a forum for support of the families left outside. Or for people here who have been inside Prison.

[RecoveryInstructor]

Originally Posted by Tishie

I was thinking more along the lines of ....

My son is now 20 and has been in and out of Prison for various crimes of theft to fighting to taking a car without permission.

NOT crimes of a sexual nature.

More a forum for support of the families left outside. Or for people here who have been inside Prison.

As someone who used to work in IT (corporate network support), and as a supporter/instructor who now works with a population that includes recipients who have both mental health challenges and criminal convictions, I see a LOT of them who feel that they're stuck between a rock and a hard place with no supports. How do you feel when you have nowhere to turn and feel like no one cares? Isn't a fun place to be is it?

It's unfortunate that these peers (and yes, they are our peers) are condemned in the present for mistakes that they may have made 10+ years ago. They know the challenges that they face - how can they not? It's constantly brought up time and time again. It affects their jobs, it affects their rights. It is a consequence of decisions made, and according to the laws they must atone for those mistakes. I don't disagree with that, by the way, but each day when I see them shine because they're given the opportunity to learn pertinent job and coping skills, and go past what the pundits said they were limited to...is just amazing.

We face choices every day, and there are consequences for our actions, both positive and negative depending on that choice. How many choices have you made that were illegal at the time, but did them anyway due to manic episodes, impulsive behaviors, or self-medicating? We all do things that are frowned upon by the justice system...but the majority of us didn't get caught doing it and then get sentenced to prison for it.

So a place for them to feel welcome isn't a bad thing, and frankly there's likely more people on this site that have had similar past experiences than we're aware of...afraid to reveal themselves due to the stigma. I admit having challenges with such topics as child-related abuse crimes, but I usually realize that's a prejudice from my past that intensifies that. On the other hand, how can I condemn someone without even knowing them? I don't feel any better judging them. Their problems don't make me better than them, I just was perhaps more fortunate to not get in trouble for the stupidities I committed when I was a youth.

Back to the logistics - if it is a forum, likely it needs to be moderated and closed so that they have a place to go where they're allowed to be free to discuss their own problems, and put it into a controlled environment. Yes, enforce the normal rules that are here or tweak them so they fit...but don't stifle the users it's meant to help. It will take persistent, but gentle moderation just like it does everywhere else, but it can be done. It's not that hard really to make up a trust agreement that defines expectations and consequences, and what is required to keep safe boundaries.

If not here, then provide links to places that will be more accepting. I do think we'd be doing a disservice to others who have been treated like garbage because they weren't understood by the general population. I don't know about you, but I think it sucks having to remain hidden because people treat me like crap; they stereotype those of us with mental illness because not only do they not understand, they're not willing enough to be open-minded to learn more.

For the record, I cringe at the word 'victims'. Something like 'survivors' seems more positive in addressing their experiences. Definitely in expressing my own. But it is up to the individual to describe themselves how they wish.

Maybe this will work, maybe it won't, but don't we owe it to our peers to at least give them a chance to thrive in an environment that accepts them as they are?

-K

Bloody well said !

I agree with Tishie ....recovery....and mandie poo.There are many who have been incarcerated due to mental illness and the behaviors they entail...and those of us who have relatives or friends or experiences of a more personal nature with the justice system....could use an outlet.After all the prisons are now the new mental hospitals since the major closing of mental hospitals.And I don't believe there has been a background check on every or any one here....so why shun someone due to the fact they have erred?There could be a controlled forum.

[RecoveryInstructor]

Originally Posted by wolfsong

I agree with Tishie ....recovery....and mandie poo.There are many who have been incarcerated due to mental illness and the behaviors they entail...and those of us who have relatives or friends or experiences of a more personal nature with the justice system....could use an outlet.After all the prisons are now the new mental hospitals since the major closing of mental hospitals.And I don't believe there has been a background check on every or any one here....so why shun someone due to the fact they have erred?There could be a controlled forum.

There is that too. Or they're incarcerated and not getting the supports/medication they need. Some do, but so many more slip through the cracks.

[DocJohn]

There are a few thriving online support groups for folks in prison and their loved ones, and I would kindly suggest that if you're interested in that topic or would like to chat with others for support, you join one of those communities, such as:

http://www.prisontalk.com/forums/

Because of our existing policy and guidelines, I think this would be unintentionally opening up a can of worms where we would increasingly have to draw lines in the sand that wouldn't make common sense. And while I understand the relationship between prison and mental illness quite well, I just don't think we're as well-equipped to deal with this topic here than other, existing support communities online.

Thank you for the suggestion!

DocJohn

Thank you Doc I have joined the site and posted already ! Its an American site however they have a section for people in Europe .