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  #26  
Old Jul 05, 2017, 12:45 PM
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SaharaSon SaharaSon is offline
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Oatter, maybe if we learned helplessness we can unlearn it. I have a strong duality about my existence that I am dealing with at the moment. I am hardwired to be a fighter, it's in my DNA, but on the other hand, enviromental experiences have ballooned and thrust this unwanted ether known as helplessness and hopelessness upon me. It didn't really register with me how big a deal it was at this point in my life, until recently. I just want it to go away, because I really really don't like it and it really is against my nature. It comes from my long experiences in Sahara. Trace and I have talked about it and we both know that it (hopelessness/helplessness) is a very big deal that needs to be overcome for good mental health. I certainly am not there yet, but at least I know now I have to do battle with it.. Shalom.
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  #27  
Old Aug 07, 2017, 12:30 PM
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awhellnaw awhellnaw is offline
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The dynamic of learned helplessness in my family was complex.

My codependent hypochondriac mother used her aches and pains as an emotional club to control the house via guilt trips and pity parties. I was raised to be an enmeshed "friend" she could unload on in our mentally and physically isolated situation but that meant I had to stay sick, injured, and emotionally hobbled in order to keep my membership card active. She would have had to give up this manipulation in order to let me grow stronger or grow stronger, herself, but learned helplessness was like the water in her fish tank. It was so natural and ubiquitous, I wonder if she could even fathom its existence. From the email I received this morning, I'd say no.

My covert narcissist father relied on my mother's weakness (and mine) to shore up his ego as the strong one and keep a convenient narcissistic supply pouring in. He imposed this same hierarchy on everyone in his social sphere. You were allowed to succeed, but not more than him, be smart, but not smarter than him, do well, but not earn more than he did and if you slipped up and managed to exceed his perceived position in life it had to be in a field he could brag about and gain status from or, even better, take credit for: "They got the idea from me; I inspired them; our family are all experts in XYZ." Learned helplessness was a natural byproduct of growing up in this enforced bureaucracy.

The punchline? Both my parents are psychologists. It was like living in a Far Side cartoon.

​I figured out recently that my strange lack of courage and motivation around career was an instinctual braking system still operating to maintain approval and standing in our family. I say strange because my core personality is a witty, vivacious, sensation-seeking extrovert who can focus the room with a single quip. But I feel like a show pony who got trotted out when it served my parents' purposes and locked up in a dark stable all the rest of my days. I am only now comprehending the depth of my rage about this. I'm mourning a self-abnegated life; learned helplessness was the bulimia of my personal achievement.

My therapy technique has been to meditate on what I truly want, imagining myself as already being and having all the things learned helplessness previously prevented. Then, I notice the feelings that surface in this new identity. It's usually dread fear and panic that can be traced back to the threat of abandonment my parents held over my head on a daily basis and impostor syndrome and intimacy issues because I freeze at the notion of getting close enough to anyone to have to explain why an overachiever has lived so poorly for so long.

I am reprogramming my thoughts and beliefs to factor external validation out of the equation by using priming, reframing, focus, and going as grey rock and no contact as possible. I'm also giving myself permission to enjoy engaging in creative projects. I'm trying out this forum as a living journal to validate my voice.
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Thanks for this!
pachyderm, SaharaSon
  #28  
Old Aug 07, 2017, 07:13 PM
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SaharaSon SaharaSon is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by awhellnaw View Post
The dynamic of learned helplessness in my family was complex.

My codependent hypochondriac mother used her aches and pains as an emotional club to control the house via guilt trips and pity parties. I was raised to be an enmeshed "friend" she could unload on in our mentally and physically isolated situation but that meant I had to stay sick, injured, and emotionally hobbled in order to keep my membership card active. She would have had to give up this manipulation in order to let me grow stronger or grow stronger, herself, but learned helplessness was like the water in her fish tank. It was so natural and ubiquitous, I wonder if she could even fathom its existence. From the email I received this morning, I'd say no.

My covert narcissist father relied on my mother's weakness (and mine) to shore up his ego as the strong one and keep a convenient narcissistic supply pouring in. He imposed this same hierarchy on everyone in his social sphere. You were allowed to succeed, but not more than him, be smart, but not smarter than him, do well, but not earn more than he did and if you slipped up and managed to exceed his perceived position in life it had to be in a field he could brag about and gain status from or, even better, take credit for: "They got the idea from me; I inspired them; our family are all experts in XYZ." Learned helplessness was a natural byproduct of growing up in this enforced bureaucracy.

The punchline? Both my parents are psychologists. It was like living in a Far Side cartoon.

​I figured out recently that my strange lack of courage and motivation around career was an instinctual braking system still operating to maintain approval and standing in our family. I say strange because my core personality is a witty, vivacious, sensation-seeking extrovert who can focus the room with a single quip. But I feel like a show pony who got trotted out when it served my parents' purposes and locked up in a dark stable all the rest of my days. I am only now comprehending the depth of my rage about this. I'm mourning a self-abnegated life; learned helplessness was the bulimia of my personal achievement.

My therapy technique has been to meditate on what I truly want, imagining myself as already being and having all the things learned helplessness previously prevented. Then, I notice the feelings that surface in this new identity. It's usually dread fear and panic that can be traced back to the threat of abandonment my parents held over my head on a daily basis and impostor syndrome and intimacy issues because I freeze at the notion of getting close enough to anyone to have to explain why an overachiever has lived so poorly for so long.

I am reprogramming my thoughts and beliefs to factor external validation out of the equation by using priming, reframing, focus, and going as grey rock and no contact as possible. I'm also giving myself permission to enjoy engaging in creative projects. I'm trying out this forum as a living journal to validate my voice.
Awhellnaw, yep, narcissim is a scorpion. Someone close to me has it coming out his methane generator. It is amazing to me, how they have to try to take credit for anything of value. To the point of stealing someone else's thunder. It really is quite shocking when you see it clearly in an adult. That is a real sickness of major proportions. I personally think that when it goes that far, the person is dissociated from reality. They are definitely sick puppies that need serious psycological help. They are incredibly manipulative. I don't trust them as far as I can spit. They can't have any core values to behave the way they do. They are the ultimate "users" of other people. I think the empathy part of their brain has been seriously damaged or destroyed. Really disturbing to me. Shalom.

Last edited by SaharaSon; Aug 07, 2017 at 10:50 PM. Reason: missing word, nine years of college and I can't spell!
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TrailRunner14
  #29  
Old Aug 07, 2017, 09:53 PM
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awhellnaw awhellnaw is offline
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Originally Posted by SaharaSon View Post
coming out his methane generator.
This cheered me up in two seconds, thanks for the great line.

PS: Nice dromedary.
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SaharaSon
  #30  
Old Aug 07, 2017, 10:38 PM
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SaharaSon SaharaSon is offline
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Thanks awhellnaw, I was a Sahara Desert dweller for 12 years. I am real familiar with camels, scorpions and vipers. Hottest damn place on earth. Lots of wars, violence, sand and oil. Shalom.
  #31  
Old Aug 07, 2017, 11:22 PM
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TrailRunner14 TrailRunner14 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaharaSon View Post
Awhellnaw, yep, narcissim is a scorpion. Someone close to me has it coming out his methane generator. It is amazing to me, how they have to try to take credit for anything of value. To the point of stealing someone else's thunder. It really is quite shocking when you see it clearly in an adult. That is a real sickness of major proportions. I personally think that when it goes that far, the person is dissociated from reality. They are definitely sick puppies that need serious psycological help. They are incredibly manipulative. I don't trust them as far as I can spit. They can't have any core values to behave the way they do. They are the ultimate "users" of other people. I think the empathy part of their brain has been seriously damaged or destroyed. Really disturbing to me. Shalom.


I agree.
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  #32  
Old Aug 08, 2017, 06:56 AM
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awhellnaw awhellnaw is offline
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Originally Posted by SaharaSon View Post
camels, scorpions and vipers
I grew up with two vipers. Camels aren't nearly as cute as the alpacas we have all over the place but I hear they spit just as well. There are scorpions up on our closest volcano and I've like to see one someday. From a few feet away. In the daylight. With camera ready.
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  #33  
Old Aug 08, 2017, 07:05 AM
TishaBuv TishaBuv is offline
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Originally Posted by SaharaSon View Post
Thanks awhellnaw, I was a Sahara Desert dweller for 12 years. I am real familiar with camels, scorpions and vipers. Hottest damn place on earth. Lots of wars, violence, sand and oil. Shalom.
And now you're in FL . #sameasiteverwas lol
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  #34  
Old Aug 08, 2017, 07:06 AM
TishaBuv TishaBuv is offline
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I'm stuck due to learned helplessness, too.
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. About Me--T
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  #35  
Old Aug 08, 2017, 02:13 PM
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SaharaSon SaharaSon is offline
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And now you're in FL . #sameasiteverwas lol
Yea, but it's a wet heat! It rarely gets over 96-97 degrees here, piece of cake. There it gets over 120-125 + degrees. And please don't tell me "Yea, but its a dry heat." You will bake like a fritanga, in very short order, in that desert.
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  #36  
Old Aug 08, 2017, 02:28 PM
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SaharaSon SaharaSon is offline
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Originally Posted by awhellnaw View Post
I grew up with two vipers. Camels aren't nearly as cute as the alpacas we have all over the place but I hear they spit just as well. There are scorpions up on our closest volcano and I've like to see one someday. From a few feet away. In the daylight. With camera ready.
Don't worry, your scorpions are cute like your alpacas. The scorpions I'm used to will send you to Valhalla with one little whip of thier tail. And there ain't no docs out there 300 hundred miles in the desert to pull you back from the brink. All there is, is more scorpions!
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pachyderm
  #37  
Old Aug 08, 2017, 03:41 PM
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SaharaSon SaharaSon is offline
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I'm stuck due to learned helplessness, too.
Visualize that you are, who you want to be. Fix it in your mind. Then for the time being, pretend that you are on the way to being that person, knowing that at the moment, you are pretending. Start doing things to get yourself there. It doesn't matter what your detractors say. If something brings you down, just close your eyes, imagine again you are who you wish you were. Start doing things, like studying and hanging around those special kinds of people, to get yourself there. Every day when you wake up, keep doing it. Just smile, and be kind to your detractors. Be calm and self confident in yourself and in reaching your goal(s), but be the definition of what it means to be relentless, not aggressive, but relentless, there is a difference. You will have fun while doing this. You don't have to explain yourself to anybody else. Most of them will not understand, unfortunately. You will no longer be stuck, you will no longer be helpless, and one day you will be, what you visualize yourself to be. Check out the movie Groundhog Day. At its core it has a very, very important message. We can all be better human beings than we think we can be. We just have to believe.Shalom.
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