The longer the depression takes, the harder it is to fix it?

Presented here



I find it quite convincing that there is pervasive corruption. Healy still prescribes meds, incidentally.

- vital

How you get the words "pervasive corruption" out of that talk is beyond me. It would suggest corruption runs rampant through the whole field.

He suggests that "pharmaceutical companies create the you that you think is you" huh???

He says that "nervousness and depression are real, and biology is involved, and that pharmaceutical companies didn't create these problems." Well thats good to know.

But then he goes on to imply that the APA wrote the DSM 3 to redefine and come up with disorders tailor made to fit big pharmas drugs. Like panic disorder and benzodiazapines. He implies that OCD and PTSD are not real disorders. Just make them up so that we can get Paxil approved for OCD. Cmon? Have you ever watched the show hoarders? If you don't think OCD is real watch that show. Talk to a woman who has been repeatedly raped and beaten about PTSD. I am not being extremist, he is suggesting these things are made up. Social anxiety is just being shy.

Of course if someone walks in and says I am shy and get a little nervous in crowds they should not be given a benzo. Marketing campaigns that try to influence us and docs to buy their meds is nothing knew. I don't think there are a ton of people who really want to go on psyche meds if they don't have a real problem just cuz they saw it on tv. Although I agree docs hand them out way to easy when it isn't warranted.

I guess the old freudian way of looking at all disorders under the label neurotic that were somehow caused by sexual fantasies about our mothers was serving us well. Cmon? Freud had his place but we certainly needed more precise definitions because we have a better understanding than Freud.

It is certainly true that big pharma withheld info from the FDA and influenced the FDA on what studies got published and what didn't. And tried to influence experts into putting their names on papers reviewing those studies. I think he gave two examples. One of which he was involved with. Hardly pervasive evidence of corruption of a whole field. This isn't new news. There have been many law suits. There are black box suicide warnings. Many papers written on withdrawal. Patent laws haven't changed in their favor. If anything there has been a crack down on them in recent years.

So big pharma markets their products. True. I think TV ads should be illegal but they are legal.

They have influenced the APA to make up stuff in the DSM for their benefit. Make up some new anxiety disorders. I don't buy it. He said they wanted to market SSRI's as anti anxiety meds but because benzos had a bad rap they did it as anti depressants. Actually SSRI's were developed as anti depressants. Most anyone here will tell you they are useless for anxiety. They were actually a big break through in psyche meds because it was the first time one was rationally designed to act by a specific mechanism at a specific site and they are just as effective as TCA's but without the side effects those had. Previous to that they were all discovered by accident.

They aren't even players in anxiety and depression anymore. The last anti anxiety med, Buspar, was approved in 1986. The benzo's have been around since the 60's. Nothing new since. Not really a novel anti depressant since Prozac except Wellbutrin.

If you look at the history of prescription medications in all areas, most of them were discovered totally by accident. A company may spend a billion dollars in research in animal models and initial human clinical trials to get it approved but really very little is known about it until it has been on the market for ten years. The initial clinical trials are short and small even if they are expensive. We don't really know until it gets out there in the real world and many follow up studies are done. This is the way it has always been. It is not nearly as much that way in other areas of medicine in recent years because of huge advancements. It is still that way with psyche meds.

All this stuff is old news. I am interested in the latest and greatest cutting edge research by good reputable researchers. Stanford is one example.

http://www.benzo.org.uk/librium.htm
http://www.preskorn.com/books/ssri_s2.html

Heroin, cocaine, opium, bromides, barbiturates, thorazine, librium.......trial and error.

In my experience and with many people I have known when it come to emotional and mental health issues we are taught by our families, our culture, and society we are just supposed to suck it up, get over it, and maintain. If not we are a failure. I had to be in dire straights before I reached out for that kind of help. I have never known anyone who took seeing a psychiatrist or therapist lightly. That's something you don't want anyone knowing.

Agree with zinco. I waited way too long. All of this has been debated before. The bottom line is pretty simple - anti depressants have their problems but using them is the most effective thing I have tried.

Every depression? As in every person with depression? I don't know and I really doubt that anyone else does. I've been told by doctors that some people seem to have depression in their genetic makeup. I think that may be true. I don't think it is constant and debilitating even in those people. I have been aware of depression since I was a child. It varied in degree and in the length of time that it was debilitating. I've had periods when I was pretty much non-functional and I've had periods where I muddled through with a semi-normal life and then I've had periods when I was able to go out and fulfill some of my dreams. There is a member here who has these quotes as her signature: I lot of people would agree with those thoughts. I do. We have a pretty screwed up society if you think about it. Considering the amazing amount of suffering, injustice, and misery in our world, I wonder about people who don't have at least a trace of something like depression.

Sometimes it determined biologically and meds are the best recourse. As soon as my schizophrenia hit it came with other comorbidities like depression. It's biological in my case. I can't just cure it by faking it, trust me Ive tried so hard. I hate my anti depressant but there Is no better alternative for me.