[flockpride]

HI all,
I think I saw a thread in the last few days by a person who felt not a match to this forum, but it seems gone. I had wanted to respond because I have had similar feelings. I'll write anyway.

This person spoke about not relating to "drama." I can understand. We all do this DID thing differently. I have extremely cerebral parts who do not relate to personal emotional sharing online or anywhere else. Sometimes on this forum, I have hoped for more conversation about DID and less sharing about what's happening in people's lives. Let me say that differently. Not less sharing, but definitely more conversation that references recent research, history of the condition, ideas.

I would still like to see that. Like the writer whose post I cannot find, I am an older person. Perhaps that makes a difference.

We struggle with definitions, terms, jargon, but can still learn from each other.
We do not need to conform to DSM definitions in our online communication to do this. We do not need to adhere to diagnostic requirements to share our experience.

If a person says, something is happening to them, that should be validated. If they are asking, "Oh god, is this DID?" I doubt they're seeking a diagnosis from a forum. It seems more a rhetorical remark. So we don't need to stress that a forum cannot render a diagnosis.

But we do need to "listen" and validate people's experience.

Whether I call myself "host" or "original person" or "part" or "alter" shouldn't be an impediment to communication on this forum. I use the terms my therapist uses.

And I think the new diagnostic criteria ICD-10, finally implemented last fall, include self reporting of parts, so this is something we need to be open to on the forum.

Folks come here because there aren't other places to "talk" about DID. Let's be open and flexible to what people are seeking. Let's offer hospitality and inclusion.

[finding_my_way]

that post is still here and ongoing.

i feel it's also important to make note that the forumeel is for ALL dissociative disorders, not just DID.

i have experienced variations of depersonalization, derealization, and DID, so i feel it's important to mention that it's a general forum since others might not have DID but have other dissociative issues.

[flockpride]

Originally Posted by finding_my_way

that post is still here and ongoing.

i feel it's also important to make note that the forumeel is for ALL dissociative disorders, not just DID.

i have experienced variations of depersonalization, derealization, and DID, so i feel it's important to mention that it's a general forum since others might not have DID but have other dissociative issues.

I guess I couldn't find it.

Yes, the forum is for all dissociative disorders, I'm sorry for not stating that explicitly.
People have a variety of experiences along the way. I sure have!

[finding_my_way]

i think it's the one just under this one at the moment if you haven't found it yet.

[-jimi-]

Unfortunately this non inclusion harsh attitude has been in this part of the forum for more than half a decade. I really don't expect it to change. I don't have DID, and I don't have trauma induced dissociation, but I feel like you have to have both to be allowed to post here. Or you will get slapped with the DSM.

Sorry to be this negative to a very good and positive OP, but even with good intentions, I don't see this changing.

[finding_my_way]

Originally Posted by -jimi-

Unfortunately this non inclusion harsh attitude has been in this part of the forum for more than half a decade. I really don't expect it to change. I don't have DID, and I don't have trauma induced dissociation, but I feel like you have to have both to be allowed to post here. Or you will get slapped with the DSM.

Sorry to be this negative to a very good and positive OP, but even with good intentions, I don't see this changing.

i struggled with dissociation since a young age. at the same time, even though mine was trauma induced and developed into DID/the spectrum, derealization and depersonalization also co exist and interwine depending for me, so i understand generally how it is to have those types.

i would think my experiences are still a mix of those last two, but i have a hard time figuring out which since they can be really intense for me.

i know that even just anxiety for me can cause derealization though. it's too bad more don't feel they are able to share on this forum because regardless if they have DID or not, other dissociative disorders are still experienced by ALL of us no matter which one, so we can all relate to varying degrees and still can help others.

[flockpride]

Originally Posted by -jimi-

Unfortunately this non inclusion harsh attitude has been in this part of the forum for more than half a decade. I really don't expect it to change. I don't have DID, and I don't have trauma induced dissociation, but I feel like you have to have both to be allowed to post here. Or you will get slapped with the DSM.

Sorry to be this negative to a very good and positive OP, but even with good intentions, I don't see this changing.

Do you experience dissociation in any way?
I believe we can help each other by "listening" and sharing. Sometimes it seems there is way more sharing than listening, for sure.
As for getting slapped with DSM, I think the forum is for the support of people experiencing dissociative disorders. If a person suspects they might, this could be a place to get support and develop the courage to look into it with a professional.

Sometimes people refer to the DSM as a way to say they cannot render a diagnosis. But please don't be put off by this.

Of course there is a difference between therapy and a peer support group. Of course the peer support group cannot diagnose or treat.

But the peer support is invaluable in giving a sense of companionship on an often perplexing and lonely journey. We need peer support. Nothing can replace the experience of another person saying, "I understand what you said and are going through because I also live it."

[-jimi-]

I don't so much these days, I used to have depersonalization-derealization. I have some other things connected to mild dissociation too which is big part of my life like what they call daydreaming (I think it is a bad name) and being extremely fluid in my self identity (I don't think that even has a proper name).

I have three friends with dissociation, two long term online and one offline although the last one I sort of lost touch with after many years. So it has been in my life quite a bit. Those are things I'd want to talk about but I know mentioning the friend that actually HAS a DID diagnosis (full, the others might not have DID but half way to it, I don't know), some years ago, I immediately got told DID does not "work" like that. So... I'm still gonna be very careful.

[1976kitchenfloor]

Originally Posted by flockpride

HI all,
I think I saw a thread in the last few days by a person who felt not a match to this forum, but it seems gone. I had wanted to respond because I have had similar feelings. I'll write anyway.

This person spoke about not relating to "drama." I can understand. We all do this DID thing differently. I have extremely cerebral parts who do not relate to personal emotional sharing online or anywhere else. Sometimes on this forum, I have hoped for more conversation about DID and less sharing about what's happening in people's lives. Let me say that differently. Not less sharing, but definitely more conversation that references recent research, history of the condition, ideas.

I would still like to see that. Like the writer whose post I cannot find, I am an older person. Perhaps that makes a difference.

We struggle with definitions, terms, jargon, but can still learn from each other.
We do not need to conform to DSM definitions in our online communication to do this. We do not need to adhere to diagnostic requirements to share our experience.

If a person says, something is happening to them, that should be validated. If they are asking, "Oh god, is this DID?" I doubt they're seeking a diagnosis from a forum. It seems more a rhetorical remark. So we don't need to stress that a forum cannot render a diagnosis.

But we do need to "listen" and validate people's experience.

Whether I call myself "host" or "original person" or "part" or "alter" shouldn't be an impediment to communication on this forum. I use the terms my therapist uses.

And I think the new diagnostic criteria ICD-10, finally implemented last fall, include self reporting of parts, so this is something we need to be open to on the forum.

Folks come here because there aren't other places to "talk" about DID. Let's be open and flexible to what people are seeking. Let's offer hospitality and inclusion.

Hello, and thank you. I beleive you are referring to me and a post I made when I was still quite new to this forum and found some things here overwhelming. I have since avoided reading these kinds of posts .

Also, since it is important to be able to understand and effectively communicate, I have asked people posting here what it is they mean in their use of certain word/words.

I am very appreciative of all those here who listen and share and give their own personal insights on dissociation and DID.

thank you so much for your posts.

[amandalouise]

Originally Posted by 1976kitchenfloor

Hello, and thank you. I beleive you are referring to me and a post I made when I was still quite new to this forum and found some things here overwhelming. I have since avoided reading these kinds of posts .

Also, since it is important to be able to understand and effectively communicate, I have asked people posting here what it is they mean in their use of certain word/words.

I am very appreciative of all those here who listen and share and give their own personal insights on dissociation and DID.

thank you so much for your posts.

I love it that you ask for clarification when reading my posts. line in the sand is that each of us posts from our own locations standards of what is and isnt mental disorders , symptoms, definitions, and use the terms used in our own locations. Having so many different locations, countries, cultures on one website means theres bound to be confusions, conflicting information and different wordings. the only way we can be on the same page with each other is by asking another member what they mean.

which is why ....

many of my posts contain statements like Im confused because the poster said this and in my location this means that, is that what you mean.

another standard statement of mine is to consult with the posters own treatment providers.

and I am trying to get the word out that America has changed over to a new diagnostic process and have included links to my posts on these changes in my signature line. my location uses these standards and with out this information other posters can not always understand where my posts are coming from. this way rather than having to search down through pages in the forums to find my threads that will help them figure out why I have posted the way I have (my own locations standards) its readily available. Im glad the word is getting out ( my locations standards of dissociative disorders link now has over 6000, views and my locations standards of America recognized mental disorders now has about 300 views)

(side thought I think it would be great for a sticky in this forum for all the different locations diagnostic manuals criteria for dissociative disorders like the DSM and IDC diagnostics that way those locations that do not use the DSM will have their diagnostic criteria manual information here too)

so thank you kitchenfloor for taking the time to ask questions when you are confused and such about my posts. it really does help when people around the world ask questions. love your posts.

[-jimi-]

Sorry if I'm intruding but I came to think of something that did annoy me in the case of my diagnosed friend not having DID according to some and everything could be "normal".

It was said that in DSM it says you have to have several alters that have jobs. My friend does not have that. He as two different "hims". There are no others. So I actually do read this DSM (again) that is referred so much. And I notice it does not mention abuse, it does not mention alters and it does not mention alters with different jobs. It does not even say you have to have any kind of core personality.

I'm not sure why this is read into the manuals when it clearly does not say that. Undiagnosing my friend because he doesn't live up to DID in DSM, and reading it, he DOES. IDK, but now that I think of it, it tees me off. I was bulldozed over nothing. A lie.

[flockpride]

Two different hims could meet the first criterion: "1. Two or more distinct identities or personality states are present, each with its own relatively enduring pattern of perceiving, relating to and thinking about the environment and self."

Personality states don't need different names. But they're pretty distinct. Who are the people deciding he doesn't have DID? Are they clinicians? It doesn't require and abuse history.

I can understand getting pissed off about someone dismissing his diagnosis. He needs validation, especially if he has shared with someone about getting a diagnosis.

Originally Posted by -jimi-

Sorry if I'm intruding but I came to think of something that did annoy me in the case of my diagnosed friend not having DID according to some and everything could be "normal".

It was said that in DSM it says you have to have several alters that have jobs. My friend does not have that. He as two different "hims". There are no others. So I actually do read this DSM (again) that is referred so much. And I notice it does not mention abuse, it does not mention alters and it does not mention alters with different jobs. It does not even say you have to have any kind of core personality.

I'm not sure why this is read into the manuals when it clearly does not say that. Undiagnosing my friend because he doesn't live up to DID in DSM, and reading it, he DOES. IDK, but now that I think of it, it tees me off. I was bulldozed over nothing. A lie.

Originally Posted by -jimi-

Sorry if I'm intruding but I came to think of something that did annoy me in the case of my diagnosed friend not having DID according to some and everything could be "normal".

It was said that in DSM it says you have to have several alters that have jobs. My friend does not have that. He as two different "hims". There are no others. So I actually do read this DSM (again) that is referred so much. And I notice it does not mention abuse, it does not mention alters and it does not mention alters with different jobs. It does not even say you have to have any kind of core personality.

I'm not sure why this is read into the manuals when it clearly does not say that. Undiagnosing my friend because he doesn't live up to DID in DSM, and reading it, he DOES. IDK, but now that I think of it, it tees me off. I was bulldozed over nothing. A lie.

Sherri: I'm sorry that this all happened to you. DID is so much more misunderstood than say Bipolar is which is more acceptable even though it has its public image issues, also.

Sure the DSM is real specific about its criteria which is the way it needs to be. The problem is to the lay person where it really makes no sense: its vague, clinical and unyielding.

DSM just describes what it needs to be to be considered DID....but what does that really mean? It actually takes a little researching and studying for it to sink in, at least for me it did, like a years worth before I was able to wrap my head around it.

I don't exactly know what you mean that there are "2 hims" - like 2 versions, 2 differing personalities, polar opposites,...?

DSM says 2 or more personality states. These states can have similarities, but they have different tastes, views, ideas, etc. Differing self-images is a clue like gender, age, likes and dislikes, gestures, mannerism, etc. Sometimes its obvious to see these things but they are mostly well hidden because normal people think everyones singular so they miss the obvious or shrug them off as quirks and our whole goal is to blend in and appear normal. We went nameless for all of our life to not be seen.

As for the causes of this condition, I looked into structural dissociation and the root cause was trauma. Abuse is trauma. An unprocessed traumatic memory that the young childs mind can't process causing a memory back up that leads to more unprocessed memories. All these unprocessed memories take on a life of there own.

From what I gather, trauma doesnt have to be abuse: sexual, mental, physical, emotional- its just something a child perceives as horrific like a death, a horrific crash, the mommy/baby bond is broken....the child dissociates from the stuck memory leaving it behind. This dissociation is where a new version emerges to get on with life. This is how alters are created- its their "job" to take over when the previous gets stuck. Some people are more prone to dissociate than others. I dissociate at the blink of an eye which puts me as a candidate for poly-fragmentation in the hundreds.

From what I've learned so far, there is also physical conditions too that may play a factor like a too small hippocampus that gets backed up for the laying down of memories.

The base cause of DID is all the same...the initial unprocessed trauma memory on a young childs brain. From there it grows into its own version of DID because everyones personal experiences are different, but the structure is relativity the same, but to different depths.

The DSM should be and is for the professionals to interpret. There is so much more behind the wording then what's just printed...like years of study in psychology for one, and to be told to just go look there is insane. This is why we hire Ts, for they have the knowledge of the meanings of the definitions and self diagnosing is very unreccomended.

If one does self-diagnosis, they can accidentally start believing that they have DID, then the brain will mimic the symptoms to satisfy the belief causing a false condition which is not good for the patient that leads to confusion, undue stress, embarrassment, unneccessary costs, delusions,.... A world of headaches, actually.

You run into all types of personalities on here or anywhere.... but all we want to do is help.

[-jimi-]

As for who dismissed it on here that strongly I am not going to name names, but here on this forum yes. Although it didn't actually affect him so no harm done, it was just me wondering something I guess, I really don't expect people on the Internet to know about people they don't know... ehh... yea I'm not good with words today, but I hadn't expected to get chewed out either and told he is not diagnosed right.

I'm just a little confused to why it is a mortal sin on this site to suggest a diagnosis, but totally fine to claim someone doesn't have what they are diagnosed with.

Not that he is a part of PC but I've seen it done to PC members as well. I'm just beginning to get some grasp of what DID is, I think it would have helped me a lot with my RL friend if I had dared talking about it on here while all that stuff happened but I didn't because of the dismissing stuff. Realizing she was more than one, after many years friendship was quite shocking.

I don't want to whine too much either because I also see there are so many terrific people on here. But it still doesn't feel like a safe place for me. But you who replied to me, awesome and thanks!!!

I'm guilty of a lot...obviously, but denying one and proclaiming an other...I can assure you
I am not. Luv!

Besides, if I'm a problem (which I can tell That I am (mo drama B))... I'll be gone soon.

[-jimi-]

Nope, you're not guilty. And for the rest... we are who we are. Some are keeping everything to themselves, some are the opposite, some are calm, some are volatile or radiating.

I think no one should set a rule to how you should be!!! I really hate that type of stuff. Why not live and let live if it doesn't hurt anyone?