Autism & Dissociation?

I hope you don't mind me venturing over here..I've just come to ask a question ..


I have autism all my life... but as I was child in the 70's not much was known about autism in girls and nothing about PDA - Pathological Demand Avoidance (now seen as a possible subgroup of autism by some professionals).

I mention this because it specifically mentions the ability to get lost in fantasy and to tend to prefer it over reality particularly in relation to coping with demands (such as having to go to school).


For me personally to cope with this I have what I used to call 'imaginary friends' (as a younger child) and then 'persona's or alter ego's.


In coping with social situations I have constantly had the experience of feeling like I was 'watching myself' or feeling that...'that wasn't me' doing that so I had 'successfully' ...avoided the demand.


Sometimes it was 'me' but I would pretend I was being filmed for a TV program so had to 'do it' (whatever it was...go to some social event or do some work) to show 'how it was done' for the imaginary TV program.


These seem to fit (I think) derealisation and depersonalisation and I wondered if PDA would therefore be classed as a form of dissociative disorder, due to the intense need to either get 'lost in fantasy' or 'disconnect from your 'self' in order to be able to 'get through life'?

I wish I knew the answer to your question but sadly I don't. Hopefully others here will be more enlightened and helpful to you. I so think that you are a very heroic person in your efforts to bear the heavy, heavy burdens that weigh upon you!

to answer your question would autism problem called PDA be dissociation no it is not. it is in the autism category of problems.

if you go to your local library and research dissociation disorders in their medical / mental health data bases, you will find that, playing pretend, having imaginary friends, day dreaming, fantasy play actually disqualifies / rules out having dissociation problems. this has been a key criteria for ruling ........out...... dissociatiive disorders since 1994.

in most cases playing pretend, daydreaming and living in fantasy worlds is now considered completely normal. children are taught to use their imaginations from the moment they begin crawling over to their toys, they also learn to use their imaginations in school situations like head start, elementary high school and college. so in general that kind of behavior is considered to be completely normal,

Autism/ autism spectrum disorders / autistic problems have their own "grouping" mental health category.

if you think you may have autistic disorder problems or know someone with autistic disorder problems contact your treatment providers. they can give you information directly related to the problem you or your loved one may be experiencing.

It’s possible. If you have PTSD it could be part of that, too? Disassociation is common with trauma survivors, and PTSD is common in people who have autism. Your theory makes sense, anyway.

It's possible to have comorbidity with more than one mental illness. Some people with predispositions toward bipolar, autism, learning disorders, and other invisible disabilities have also experienced trauma in their childhoods, which can then lead to PTSD or post-traumatic symptoms or dissociation (which is thought to be related to either high stress or high trauma, typically prolonged traumatic experiences, but not always). Trauma-related disorders (PTSD, CTSD - not yet an official diagnosis, dissociative disorders) and anxiety disorders can go hand-in-hand. My T has said that there were a few veterans she had worked with who had both OCD and PTSD, like me.

A diagnosis of a dissociative disorder, since it remains controversial, would require a seasoned trauma-and-dissociation specialist (not just any mainstream psychologist) to diagnose. You can also try seeking out a psychiatrist, but they are even more skeptical about dissociative disorders, especially since many people with dissociative disorders don't react to psychotropic medications in a conventional way, which can baffle psychiatrists (whose jobs mainly comprise medicine, not talk therapy).

I know I have an 'autistic problem' because I've been diagnosed with it!

Is it still normal to live in fantasy in your 50's I wonder? and to be unable to tell whether you created the people in your head or they're there for some other reason???


Ironically as a child I was told by parents I did NOT play imaginatively as a young toddler, it was something I learned when I was older when my younger sibling reached that stage and I asked my mother what he was doing!!


My emotional development has always been several years behind all my life. I mean I'm in my 50's..still hate physical contact, have never been able to cope with an intimate relationship, never had or wanted kids or to get married, still love playing on games consoles and colouring in - which seems to trigger an 'even younger me'.


An although I had 'social masks' when younger to cope with the pressure of being made to go to college or work etc ..when alone my autistic behaviours had to be released after being suppressed all day to 'fit in with normal'

Dr Judy Eaton from the PDA Society says

QUOTE

"there is very little research into how the PDA profile develops as people reach adulthood but the PDA Society has been pulling together the studies on PDA in adults which have been published and the lived experiences of those who have shared their story"

She said that "many adults have come across PDA when searching for an explanation for their own difficulties or have recognised the features of PDA in themselves whilst going through the diagnostic process with their children. Unfortunately some have suffered from significant mental health difficulties and have been misunderstood or misdiagnosed with a Personality Disorder. Some, like James in the case study mentioned, have been sectioned under the Mental Health Act"
UNQUOTE



Adults: PDA & mental health | PDA Society Resources



I also found this where it briefly mentions the person (with autism/PDA profile) being "in a state of dissociation for many years".


S1 Ep3. Emotional Regulation. Autism, Pathological Demand Avoidance and Dissociation | Listen Notes


It seems to be some kind of auditory podcast rather than a written report and I can't access it. I doubt I'd be able to follow it with my auditory processing issues.


It is about Emotional Regulation, Autism, PDA and Dissociation.


I may try asking if they have a transcript. I don't know if they will have though.



I agree with RoxanneToto and SprinkL that it is possible to have both. I do have PTSD due to bullying, past medical treatments, 'old-fashioned discipline' and just coping with life as an autistic person!


I have had a 'mental breakdown' many years ago and several other neuro and health issues from which I never fully recovered.


Add in the emotional turmoil of going through the menopause and years of isolation and there's definitely a recipe for some serious issues in there somewhere!



I haven't been out to any public places for nearly two years since the pandemic started including any medical appointments in case someone breathed on me and I came home with covid!

your question you are diagnosed with autism and asking is it still normal for you to live in fantasy --- I cant answer specifically related to you, I can only answer in general. yes if you google and do research you will find that with some with autism it is normal behavior for a person with autism to live in a fantasy, in their minds. there are some really great autobiographies out there on amazon you can read that can explain this to you or talk with your treatment providers. they can tell you the differences between autism and dissociation.

if you look up the actual diagnostic criteria for dissociative disorders and actual diagnostic criteria for autistic disorders you will find that in order for a problem to be diagnosed as a dissociative disorder fantasy has to be ruled out.

Again, specific to your own situation you will need to contact your treatment providers who will explain it all to you in terms of your specific problems.

It's definitely possible to have multiple mental health disorders. Some can be difficult to diagnose though. Are you hoping to get diagnosis and treatment for a dissociative disorder?

no, just wondered if it was a possibility. I've got long enough list of conditions and if its directly connected to being autistic anyway and the way my brain processes stuff..I already have that diagnosis!


I don't even tell people in real life (neighbours etc..obviously close family already know!) that I have autism, get enough discrimination and stuff just from having mobility and hearing (or auditory processing) difficulties.


Getting a GP appointment in the middle of a pandemic is harder than getting a flight to the moon at the minute anyway!

thought this might answer some of your questions .... its diagnostic criteria for PDA. as you can see number 5 is fantasy. So my guess in ............general.... still stands that its a normal part of the autistic problem called PDA and not dissociation. your own treatment providers can tell you based on your own problems.

like others have said it is possible to be diagnosed with more than one problem. how that works is they look at the problem and decide whether the problem is one disorder or the other.

for example a person can be diagnosed with PDA (fantasy / pretending) and also diagnosed with dissociation (not fantasy, staying connected to reality while at the same time feeling numb, spaced out, like things are far away, those kinds of disconnections and not because of fantasy, imagination.)

https://www.autismeastmidlands.org.u...20drops%20toys

I found this video online and because it's very visual and has subtitles I found it very easy to understand and identify with

Autism and Dissociative Identity Disorder : My diagnosis journey – Planet Neurodivergent