Mental Health Act

Hi all,
I was detained under section 3 MHA and have been trying to find a conclusive list of the implications of this, thus far though I can't find any definitive list.

I would rather have some official info than personal opinions, and would be very grateful for any help.

Thanks

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http://www.mind.org.uk/help/rights_a..._outline_guide
Parts 2, 4, 4A, and the section immediately following 4A. If you feel like that's not covering it, I would direct your questions to their email address further below those sections. The organization seems to me like they would know and be happy to help you understand your rights and the implications of this law.

Thank you so much.
I've been looking and looking but my mind is a bit of a mess at the moment with so much going on guess I wasn't looking in the right place.

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I have just had a look through the information (downloaded the PDF) and can't see anything about the implications of having been held under section 3.

Specifically what I am after is implications on international travel, employment and any other rights.

Hope this makes sense. Thanks

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Oh, I thought you were talking about implications of what treatment you could be required to continue in... anyway, if you don't get an answer here those people should be able to provide you one.

http://www.rethink.org/living_with_m...al_health_act/

Try this one, scroll down it has a section on the different parts of the acts, I believe parts 2 and 3 are together. Part 3 is about who can put you in treatment and your inability to refuse treatment but it also states what you can do to challenge that. You might want to check with Bazelon Center for Mental Health Law if you have specific questions they might be able to refer you to a proper place. There is also your own state's advocacy, Disability Rights.

Thanks for the help. I'll see what I can find.

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Hiya Leighe.

Being sectioned under the Mental Health Act (2, 3, 135, 136, etc) can be written on the "Additional Relevant Information" section in enhanced Criminal Record Bureau (CRB) disclosures. For that matter, any mental health episode or involvement with the emergency services can show up if the police were ever involved or informed of a mental health incident you've had. I know this for a fact because not only have I read plenty of anecdotal evidence of people having things like sections and OD episodes show up in enhanced CRB checks, but the mental health charity MIND as well as CRB told me this as well since I emailed them both for this information after being on a s.136. That is not to say it certainly will show up in a CRB check, but it certainly can. Some people don't have their sections disclosed at all, so bear this in mind. I reckon if there was violence involved in your mental health episode or section it's more likely to appear. There's also the issue of Occupational Health checks which are mandatory for some jobs, such as those in healthcare, teaching, the fire service, police, etc.

As for travelling, there is a school of thought (including the opinions of mental health professionals) which believe if you've been detained on Section 3 MHA, that you're unable to travel to countries like the USA, China, etc. Personally I think this is a load of b*llocks since foreign authorities cannot access your medical file and cannot demand access to it without a lawful reason. I've known of an anorexic girl who was held on a s.3 travel to Florida without any trouble. I know they say lying is bad, but in the form for the Visa Waiver Program to the USA, I would simply say "No" to the part which asks about mental disorders, they have absolutely no way of finding out and if you're honest you risk them refusing a waiver, which means you would have to pay a fortune for a travel visa which could be refused. Of course, criminal sections (court-ordered sections) are a different thing all together, they are still classed as criminal convictions and are stored on the UK Police National Computer which can be accessed by the US authorities which is why people with criminal records often get denied entrance to the USA. But s.3 is a completely civil section which is confidential.

If someone thinks I'm wrong re: travelling, can you please please please explain to me how foreign authorities can get access to ones confidential medical record unless you consent? I've had this discussion with others who insist a s.3 will stop you travelling to certain countries, but they never seem able to explain how it does, they just send links of embassy websites etc. which make their decision based on information you voluntarily disclose to them.

I think you're also ineligible for Jury Service in the UK if you've ever had serious mental health problems, but the laws may have changed in recent years.

Thanks for that, your answer was pretty much in line with what I thought.

Seems like Great Britain's civil rights for those with mental health issues, even what may end up being a temporary problem, needs some work. All health issues, mental, police involvement or no should be confidential.
I know some lawyers in this field, I now have questions that I'll be asking at our next advocacy meeting. Thanks for bring this up, I had no idea this was even possible. I have been seconded, involuntarily committed still worked in my field-health care, have been on jury duty-too many times to count, but I'm in USA and have never given any broad based consent to search on anything, only time limited and very specific, limited ones.
Where those things happed to me was in a very blue state that takes civil liberties very seriously. I could be wrong but I think police involvement and crime connections could be a state by state rule. I've never had problems traveling, but I have had no MI section involvements since 2001. The world and civil liberties have changed since that date.

I actually agree with you. Technically, mental health discrimination is actually illegal in the UK (Disability Discrimination Act 1995 etc) but when enhanced CRB checks were introduced back in 2002 they've effectively brought in backdoor discrimination which very few people know about. On an enhanced CRB check it gives space for the local police Chief Inspector to disclose any information (criminal or non-criminal, mental health, known drug addictions, past investigations which concluded with no charges etc) held on you if he/she feels it's relevant for the job you're applying for. It's completely arbitrary (although I heard some forces like the London Metropolitan Police do it routinely), and there's currently no straight forward way to contest information and it doesn't have an expiration date or anything like that, it also doesn't require the consent of a qualified professional like a psychiatrist to say if it's relevant or not. I had a discussion with an ex cop about this, he said that because the police are just writing "facts" and not actual judgements on your mental health state, it's completely legal.

Anyone from the UK who is interested in the topic re: mental health / CRB should read this blog, someone did attempt to make an issue out of it, I think she actually managed to successfully contest the information so they altered it accordingly.

http://www.alastaircampbell.org/blog...in-crb-checks/

As for the US and other countries, I'm not sure, but I read somewhere that arrest records are sometimes disclosable to employers under some circumstances in some US states, and mental health act-style detentions are classed as arrests.

(I find this topic very interesting lol)

I was told by other patients that having been on a Sec.3 that i wouldn't be allowed to the states (my mum is from there). Of course I got wound up about that but the staff said it was bogus and it's just gossip. Hope that helps a bit

Regarding jury service, people with a mental illness are excluded under Schedule 1, Part D of the Juries Act 1974, which has not been repealed. (There are periodic calls for its appeal, however.) You can look at it here:
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1974/23/schedule/1

I successfully challenged mine, too, actually. In my case, I kept fighting until it was just completely deleted. I'm not mentally ill, and I don't need that stain on my record.

(I've also recently started proceedings for malpractice against the psychiatrist who had me sectioned. When I win, I intend to press charges for assault and unlawful detention.)

I have travelled to the US twice since I was sectioned; I never had any problems.
I was actually sectioned in the US once, and I have even travelled there after that (I am not a US citizen).

Some countries exclude permanent settlement by people who have been on involuntary psychiatric treatment. I believe Canada is one of them . . .

And with regard to employment, it is illegal under the Disability Discrimination Act 2005 and the Equalities Act 2010 to exclude someone from a job (or education, housing, etc.) on the basis of their disability. Mental illness is included in this.

There are a certain few professions -- mainly service in the armed forces and spying -- where people who have ever been diagnosed with a serious mental illness can be permanently excluded. Also, if you were an MP at the time of your section Parliament can declare your seat vacated and hold a by-election. I am going to go out on a limb and assume you neither were an MP nor wanted to become a spy.

That does not mean, however, that 'backdoor discrimination' does not occur. It's a **** economy and when there are dozens of applicants for every position, it's not difficult for an employer to come up with another reason not to hire. That's why it was important for me to have the sectioned removed from my CRB.

But I work in a professional job now and am about to enter an even more exclusive profession (the law, can you tell? ) and discrimination hasn't been a huge issue since I had the CRB changed.

fish, this is exactly what I am looking to do. Can you give me any hints of what route I need to take to do this (getting it wiped from the record) because so far my legal advisors have said even though they agree with me it is pretty much impossible, although I fully intend to prove them wrong.

Are you getting free legal advice? As much as I love legal aid and admire the solicitors who work on legal aid, they are unlikely to take on such an obscure thing.

I had to use [personal] favours from people I know in the legal profession. You need a highly motivated lawyer to batter them with legalese until they relent. There was no reason for that to be on my CRB, so I had a lawyer who just kept labouring the point until they relented.

Basically, don't let the ****ing psychiatrists ruin your life. These things are highly unfair, but if you don't want to be destroyed by them then you just have to keep fighting until it's all gone.

(My next step, as I may have said, is a malpractice suit followed by criminal charges -- private prosecution if needed. I don't intend to stop fighting until every mention of mental "illness" in conjunction with my name is erased -- from my medical records, my university records, everything.)

The USA also has created many hidden back-doors to get around civil rights since 2001 but here it is a state by state and sadly even a person by person thing. So yes arrest records might get disclosed even for volunteer jobs but they are not supposed to be, at all unless they are felonies, but now it depends on how the officers who respond to the scene feel about; MI, the person they deal with, the city, state it takes place in. More and more records for MI interventions and anything to do with drugs are coming up in public searches when they are not supposed to. It depends on how they file the records. The more sympathy or empathy a person arouses in the officers the less likely it is to have repercussions, so discrimination is alive and kicking in the USA. A thin small cute white woman, who comes from upper-class/middle-class and does not have a drug problem(cops here hate drugs) is much less likely to suffer consequences than a colored overweight person is. Strangely this is true even if the police are colored!(?) Discrimination has gone underground and is much harder to fight.

I too find this topic very interesting too. One reason I'm on a advocacy board.

Leighe---Best of luck. I hope you are successful in getting your record erased.