[Phreak]

After receiving a letter telling me that in a test I'd completed that I'd scored clinically significantly for 5 different personality disorders, I then not only read the wiki-pages but also downloaded and read every single page of the DSM-IV as the tedt had been based on DSM-III and DSM-v was still being worked on.

Basically after reading over 900 pages I suddenly became more clued up than the professionals I was dealing with. After getting referred to a psychiatrist I also found myself knowing why she was asking the questions she was, and being able to dismiss it as non-applicable.

I also once made somebody who was evaluating me in his own words feel quite uncomfortable - he did also comment that it interested him as to why, but alas due to budget cuts I got bounced despite him wanting to work one-on-one with me.

I know I need to allow myself to be the patient rather than turniing the tables and attempting to control things...

Ultimately when does getting a working knowledge of what is wrong with you become counter productive and too much knowledge?

Phreak

[Miswimmy1]

I think if you are obsessing over the information and it becomes all time consuming, then that becomes counter productive.

[Phreak]

I've never obsessed over it. My main concern is knowing more than the professionals and having been able to turn the tables on the occasion I actively tried.

I'm currently on a waiting list for a T and hoping the dynamics get off to a healthy productive start.

Phreak

[beauflow]

agree if it's obsessing it's not doing you good.

know I need to allow myself to be the
patient rather than turniing the tables
and attempting to control things...

I think this is a good thing to realize.... Have you asked yourself why you attempt to control things?
Like is it a way to keep your front up and not to expose yourself? Or something else? Or many things?

Even though you know to be the patient, sometimes feelings of whatever that means for you could over write your logical thinking. (you probably already know that)

I think if you find a,'right fit', therapist or other professional to where you could let them know what you realize you do, I could see it possible helpful and productive.

If you don't tell them or maybe a not so good fit, I could see it counter productive.

To bad you got bounced, the one psychiatrist could had been beneficial, since they wanted to know why.

Sorry if this is sweet little nothings

Hope you well s

[Sometimes psychotic]

Originally Posted by Phreak

I've never obsessed over it. My main concern is knowing more than the professionals and having been able to turn the tables on the occasion I actively tried.

I'm currently on a waiting list for a T and hoping the dynamics get off to a healthy productive start.

Phreak

My question is why the DSM----I too read a lot, often articles in the primary literature that my pdoc/T would never have time to read. I don't do it to turn the tables though---wouldn't be much point, once you hear voices its hard to deny the crazy and I need all the help I can get. I can't help but wonder if the excessive love of the DSM is to embrace or refute it. Are you looking for reasons your dx's are wrong?

Personally I don't believe in the DSM and neither does my pdoc because its not based on modern science. His description of the DSM was that its just a book some guy wrote, this dismissive attitude has really prevented me from ever caring about it.

[sewerrats]

The shrinks don't like it if you challenge them, or talk over them . Its the quickest way to the exit sign, plus they put it all on your records for the next shrink to read . AND never do online tests for illness you will finish up with leprosy and jungle fever.

[The_little_didgee]

The DSM is just a book of disorders and their diagnostic criteria. It does not explain what each disorder is and its features in detail so it is almost useless to a layperson.

If you really want to learn about a specific disorder, read psychology books and research papers. Take some psych classes.

Note: The little numbers associated with each disorder are billings codes. This is what the book is mainly for.

Five PDs?

[Ms.Beans]

I'm starting my PhD in Medical Anthropology, particularly anthropology of psychiatry and psychopathology.. I read A LOT of MH related stuff in various disciplines.. It does make me feel a bit like a hypocrite sometimes.. when I'm trying to criticize biomedical approach yet I am medicated.. But apart form that I find it enlightening.
I find it easier to communicate to mental health professionals, although some of them were quite suspicious at the beginning. But when they realize I'm not after a prescription, they seem to accept that I know a thing or two and we just get to the point.
I don't know how American shrinks would react though.. it's a completely different health care system.

Regarding DSM.. you aware that the rest of the world is very uhm skeptical about the diagnostic validity of the DSMs? Plus, as far as I know, the medicalization in DSM-V is of epic proportions. Read up some anti-psychiatry stuff ma pal =)

[Phreak]

The DSM because the test I'd been given had been based on it.

It wasn't a psychiatrist it was a "staff nurse" who was evaluating me for group therapy. In fairness I just made him a little off guard by asking him why his body language was so closed off, it really hadn't been, but it flustered him

i do read other things on top of the DSM, although that is a comprehensive and nice self contained read.

i did once contridict my consultant psychiatrist.. and he conceeded my point.

i think part of the challenge is to be able to turn the tables successfully on people who should know better... it's just satisfying.

i talked to a T informally online once, within 24 hours she'd agreed to refer herself to therapy.

ugh god I need more self restraint.

i think part of me wants to try and fail, to give me the security of the knowlwsdge that i couldn't do it if i wanted too.

[spondiferous]

I think it's never a bad idea to get as much information as you feel you need to know about something in order to understand it. But there comes a point where you have to make a decision to either trust your professionals, get new ones or go your own way.
My psychiatrist says the DSM isn't worth the paper it's written on. I concur.
When I first got diagnosed about 3 years ago now, there was a huge list of things: BPD, dissociative disorder, depressive disorder, EDNOS, panic disorder w/agoraphobia and OCD, all with psychotic episodes. When I got my new psych, just a couple months ago, she said she was scrapping it all and changing it to PTSD and EDNOS. I felt kinda hollow when she said that. Here I'd been identifying with specific things for so long, and now it was different. Because it went from so many things to just two, I felt like somehow my experience was being invalidated.
Basically how I feel about it is, regardless of what some doctor has to say about it, or the DSM, or anyone else, it's your experience that matters. Regardless of what's going on for you, you still have to find a way to take care of yourself. I would use the information to that end, not to question or investigate professionals or drive yourself crazy over it. And if you really believe that your professionals do not have your best interests in heart, and they are not encouraging you to learn as much as you can (all of my doctors have done that), then perhaps you may want to find someone else.
Just my two cents.

[Phreak]

Originally Posted by Ms.Beans

I'm starting my PhD in Medical Anthropology, particularly anthropology of psychiatry and psychopathology.. I read A LOT of MH related stuff in various disciplines.. It does make me feel a bit like a hypocrite sometimes.. when I'm trying to criticize biomedical approach yet I am medicated.. But apart form that I find it enlightening.
I find it easier to communicate to mental health professionals, although some of them were quite suspicious at the beginning. But when they realize I'm not after a prescription, they seem to accept that I know a thing or two and we just get to the point.
I don't know how American shrinks would react though.. it's a completely different health care system.

Regarding DSM.. you aware that the rest of the world is very uhm skeptical about the diagnostic validity of the DSMs? Plus, as far as I know, the medicalization in DSM-V is of epic proportions. Read up some anti-psychiatry stuff ma pal =)

Being in the U.K. I can't offer any insight yo American shrinks either

Any literacy recomendations o learned one?

Phreak

[Sometimes psychotic]

Originally Posted by Phreak

The DSM because the test I'd been given had been based on it.

i think part of me wants to try and fail, to give me the security of the knowlwsdge that i couldn't do it if i wanted too.

So basically you want someone smarter than you are as a pdoc or T? Can't really blame you for that...some of the pdocs are pretty smart...best to get them in the morning though, when they are sharp and well rested.

[sewerrats]

Originally Posted by Phreak

The DSM because the test I'd been given had been based on it.

It wasn't a psychiatrist it was a "staff nurse" who was evaluating me for group therapy. In fairness I just made him a little off guard by asking him why his body language was so closed off, it really hadn't been, but it flustered him

i do read other things on top of the DSM, although that is a comprehensive and nice self contained read.

i did once contridict my consultant psychiatrist.. and he conceeded my point.

i think part of the challenge is to be able to turn the tables successfully on people who should know better... it's just satisfying.

i talked to a T informally online once, within 24 hours she'd agreed to refer herself to therapy.

ugh god I need more self restraint.

i think part of me wants to try and fail, to give me the security of the knowlwsdge that i couldn't do it if i wanted too.

You talked I therapist into getting therapy herself, are we on the same planet

[sewerrats]

PHREAK , I live in England and you could teach a kid of 6 what uk shrinks no., so you don't have to be that clever . They only there to dish out meds and they come from the NHS bible . Ask for anything not in it and you wont get it. I asked for LEXAPRO and the shrink said no way , its only citalopram in a different box . S0 I went to my GP and he gave me Lexapro because GP PRACTICE has more money the NHS funded mental hospital. You never see the same shrink twice so all he knows about you is in a file he or she hasn't even looked at. SO you can be has clever has you like it will get you nowhere in England at any NHS hospital, THEROPIST double up for CBT and any type of theropy you can think of there will be 3 therapist at each hospital for thousands of patients. go private and you get the same people only quicker.

[Phreak]

Originally Posted by sewerrats

You talked I therapist into getting therapy herself, are we on the same planet

Actually twice I think. It's a bit different in an informal conversation with somebody online though who just happens to be in the profession though, isn't it?

Ah just remembered, the second occasion I convinced a therapist who was already in therapy to change her therapist, and apparently I'd helped her more in two days than her T had in 2 years. I was chuffed when she said that

[sewerrats]

Originally Posted by Phreak

Actually twice I think. It's a bit different in an informal conversation with somebody online though who just happens to be in the profession though, isn't it?

Ah just remembered, the second occasion I convinced a therapist who was already in therapy to change her therapist, and apparently I'd helped her more in two days than her T had in 2 years. I was chuffed when she said that

I just gave you a full account of the NHS SHRINK AND THEROPY CARE and you didn't give one answer to anything, you say your being treated for depression are you sure its not delusion have you been in metal hospital if so which one in England ,and how did you meet these therapist has patients or therapist????. Give me a blow by blow account of your MEDS , THEROPY, and you hospital encounters, I can tell you a thousand you told none only talked about how much better than any shrink you met and talked a bunch of therapist into getting theropy themselves, you wasted my friend you should be head of the department.

[Phreak]

Originally Posted by sewerrats

I just gave you a full account of the NHS SHRINK AND THEROPY CARE and you didn't give one answer to anything, you say your being treated for depression are you sure its not delusion have you been in metal hospital if so which one in England ,and how did you meet these therapist has patients or therapist????. Give me a blow by blow account of your MEDS , THEROPY, and you hospital encounters, I can tell you a thousand you told none only talked about how much better than any shrink you met and talked a bunch of therapist into getting theropy themselves, you wasted my friend you should be head of the department.

I didn't give an answer to anything because I didn't see the additional post - check the time stamps we were a minute apart.

The psychiatrists I were originally seeing, a juniour and their consultant were actually pretty good, alas they changed to somebody useless a few months later as he'd been acting as a locum consultant.

My GP has had me over the years on Prozac, venlaphaxen, citalapram 60mg, duloxetine, mitazapine.

My psychiatrist then moved me onto 300mg of trazadone.

I'm currently on a waiting list for dynamic psychotherapy.

As to your question of have I ever been admitted to a psych ward, no.

I at no point stated I was better than anybody.

Is that all? If so, please go and troll else where kid - I'm guessing you're a teenager. I'm sure you'll correct me if I'm wrong

Phreak

[sewerrats]

Originally Posted by Phreak

I didn't give an answer to anything because I didn't see the additional post - check the time stamps we were a minute apart.

The psychiatrists I were originally seeing, a juniour and their consultant were actually pretty good, alas they changed to somebody useless a few months later as he'd been acting as a locum consultant.

My GP has had me over the years on Prozac, venlaphaxen, citalapram 60mg, duloxetine, mitazapine.

My psychiatrist then moved me onto 300mg of trazadone.

I'm currently on a waiting list for dynamic psychotherapy.

As to your question of have I ever been admitted to a psych ward, no.

I at no point stated I was better than anybody.

Is that all? If so, please go and troll else where kid - I'm guessing you're a teenager. I'm sure you'll correct me if I'm wrong

Phreak

Im 65 young un , even your psychotherapy has got to be DYNAMIC , im sorry but I don't believe anything you say, do you expect people to believe you talked 2 theropist into having theropy them self on your advice . This is a mental health forum not Britain,s Got Talent.

[Phreak]

Honestly I couldn't care less what you believe.

Clearly you think it worth announcing to everybody that you don't believe me. The fact you think your opinion has so much worth to be note worthy just shows how obnoxious you are, regardless of your physical age.

[sewerrats]

[quote=Phreak;3104526]Honestly I couldn't care less what you believe.

Clearly you think it worth announcing to everybody that you don't believe me. The fact you think your opinion has so much worth to be note worthy just shows how obnoxious you are, regardless of your physical age.[/quote

[sewerrats]

[/quote Enjoy your sleep med, TRAZADONE not used often on its own?? only for mild depression, useually added to combo,s has a sleep med. But then again you are bound to no that 1 aren't you. The troll call was a low blow summed it up straight away for me , your on the back foot. goodbye.

[FooZe]

This thread has unfortunately strayed way off topic and turned into an argument. I am now going to close it.