SHOCKED*PLEASE READ* DRUG INFO* TRUE?????

i recently started zoloft for ocd and depression. and i had heard that there were lawsuits against zoloft and paxil and whatnot for an increase of suicide in young children taking ssri's however the latest articles i've read talk about an increase in mania and suicidal and homicidal behaviours and tendencies an adverse reaction. which again i knew about adverse reaction. however are they really as common as people make them out to be or is it just being over dramatized... i'm seriously freaked out. i know i should be ok b/c i've been on it for a while and haven't had any side effects that i know of, but its still scary!
anybody know anything???
-nicole!

I heard its from chaging doses or going off of it too soon.. I dunno though

Well, there is a factor at play that most people don't understand. There is a tendency in people who are recovering from severe depression to die of suicide when they are on the upswing, recovering. When a therapist (or pdoc) is treating depression, they are aware that as the patient begins to get somewhat better, but not completely, the risk of suicide increases. This is something they should be watching for. One very likely explanation for this phenomenon is because a person in severe depression may feel suicidal, but be too depressed to act on it. As she or he begins to feel better, they may start feeling good enough to get the motivation together and act on the suicidal impulses. Because they are still in depression- just less severe, and a little less debilitated by it- this is sometimes where they will decide to end their life.

NO drug can "cause" someone to intentionally take their own life. People need to be a LOT more careful in assuming the causes of something, because there are other factors at play in many cases- such as this one.

I'm a psych major and I learned this in school, from a psychologist, if you're wondering whether this is true or whether it's my own speculation just spouting off.

Angela

thanks sweet for letting us know!

(Quoting Angela here):
---------------------------------------------------------------
"NO drug can "cause" someone to intentionally take their own
life. ......I'm a psych major and I learned this in school, from a
psychologist, if you're wondering whether this is true or whether
it's my own speculation just spouting off."
---------------------------------------------------------------

This is my experience: I was given an antidepressant (not Zoloft, by the way) by my doctor. After only one dose I became an absolute zombie. I lost all normal feelings, all concern for my own life, all empathy for others. In fact, I temporarily became what the literature calls a sort of sociopath. Lucky for me that I stopped at one dose and stayed inside. Somehow I knew that the new me was terribly wrong and also dangerous, although with a second dose I would have been so dehumanized that I wouldn't have even cared. In fact, the realization of what I had turned into was so frightening and horrifying that I knew I would have to destroy myself if I remained that way. Desperate as I was to lift my depression (because I had tried many drugs without success), I still realized that I could suicide or kill on that drug. I suppose I was both Dr. Jekyl and Mr. Hyde at that crucial moment, or I couldn't have perceived what I had just become and stopped in time.

I hope not too many people have to die before it's believed and even taught that certain drugs, by themselves, can be life-threatening for some of the depressed persons for whom they are prescribed.

My take on this is: I've taken elavil, prozac, celexa and effexorxr and i'm still here.....been taking ADs since i was in my early 30s. i'm 61 now....i do not believe that taking a drug such as an AD will cause a person to committ suicide.

I don't deny the possibility that certain drugs can have adverse effects in people, potentially causing symptoms that are unpleasant and perhaps would INFLUENCE a person to increase in suicidal thoughts, but this is VERY DIFFERENT from CAUSATION. It's not like taking this drug forces you to lose control over your ability to choose. I stand by what I said, no drug can CAUSE you to choose suicide. It is your decision in the end.

Hopestheory, different antidepressants work better for different people. For many, many people, antidepressants change their life drastically for the better. Now that you are aware that there are some risks of possible problems in your symptoms and possible increase in suicidal thoughts, you can keep a close eye on yourself as you determine which, if any, antidepressants will work for you.

I personally do not take antidepressants, but I believe that there are some people who need them. That's between you and your therapist to work out. And your T should be keeping an eye on your symptomology as you work through this and decide if and which medication is for you

Just know that no drug is going to force you to die of suicide.

Best of luck to you!
Angela

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
Just know that no drug is going to force you to die of suicide.

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">

That is a reassuring statement although not one that can be held up to verification.

Currently many medical associations around the globe are taking a second look at the SSRI class of antidepressants due to the overwhelming reports of impulsive behaviour which often is acted out in a suicidal fashion.

In an aggitated depressed state not many people are in conrol of their mental faculties. A decade ago when I was in that state I was prescribed different SSRI's over many months as each burnt out or didn't provide a favourable response.

I am glad that you share so much of what you are learning in college however pharmaceuticals cannot be covered adequately in a college psych program. I'm sure that you believe what you are being taught but the emerging stats are beginning to argue your point that no drug can cause suicide.

I think anyone taking any medication has a responsibility to seek balanced information regarding that medication. Read the PDR or the package insert THROUGHLY. Check rxlist for possible side effects. Search mental health boards for feedback. But ultimately it is up to the patient/consumer to advocate for themselves in this messy medical world we navigate.

Is is hard when we're so mentally ill and unable to process such information. That is when we take things on the faith of others. If I had stuck to the faith of my original (first) pdoc in taking the amount of an SSRI he prescribed when I was in an aggitated depression I would have been successful in my suicide attempt instead of just miserable from overdosing and alcohol. I sensed that what was going on with me wasn't me but instead the effects of the med starting up in my system. It seemed natural to take every last bit of medication and alcohol at that time. Thank goodness I survived and quickly got myself up to speed on just what the hell I was putting into my system.

I now know my reaction to a SSRI was NOT UNUSUAL NOR AN ISOLATED INCIDENT.

That doesn't mean that everyone will have the same reaction. It does mean the potential for someone to have a negative reaction exists.

You're fortunate that you do not have to take antidepressants. You might have a different tune to sing if you had run through over twenty of them in a decade with various terrifying reactions. Along with various benign reactions too.

To sum up........meds are a crap shoot. One needs to be as informed as possible about what they are taking and who is prescribing it. It doesn't hurt to establish a relationship with your pharmacist as well. They often know more about these medications than the pdocs. Seek out reliable sources.

I still think that my point is being misunderstood, the difference between contributing factors versus a direct, indisputable, single CAUSE. There is a difference. But, whatever.

You can see, Hopestheory, a few different perspectives to consider anyway. As I said before, be careful to monitor your own symptoms and your therapist should be doing the same.

I wish you well.

Be safe.

My opinion is that since you have been on the med for a while, you will not experience this type of problem.

With that said, ANY time I try a new anti-depressant, I MUST go to psych ward lock up. <font color="blue"> This is because I have paradoxical reactions to anti-depressants. </font> I become suddenly MORE depressed, and have become quite suicidal during the life of the pill. It is a drug reaction, an allergy. It is from either the first or second dose only, this sudden reaction that is so intense.[I do have other reactions that are not so severe, non life threatening.] It has nothing to do with my feelings. It isn't a common reaction for society.

Hubby and I have asked several health professionals. His old doc said it is VERY rare and like Sky and adieu said, you would probably recognize something *off* right away.

Hubby's aunt and cousin are nurses. They concurred. They see people on those meds frequently so I trust their opinion. As with any meds...be careful.

If I remember correctly, these tests/investigations were started because of a young girl that died. Her parents claimed it was something unlike her. I would argue that she could have gone off the meds and experienced a down period. You just never know.

ahhhhh ok well i can see this is heated debate. but thank you all for your responses they were all helpful and i think that b/c i have been on zoloft for a while i'm probably ok and i do feel better about it as a whole so thank you all and take care!
-nicole!

We do care hope. And, IMHO, this isn't a heated debate, but a good exchange of ideas and experiences. This is how a good thread works. You wouldn't want us all saying exactly the same thing only, right?

There is a lot of controversy and discussion over this issue amongst professionals, and even how common it is.

We've long known that as people hit bottom in depression, they're often feeling low, listless, and with little to no energy. Although you'd think suicide would be a big thing for someone at this stage, it's usually not a concern. To commit suicide, you need to think about it, you need to have a plan, you need to take some action. People who are seriously depressed usually have little energy or enough concentration to even think about suicide.

The problem is, meds like SSRIs often increase energy levels in folks before they start affecting the depression. So the depressed person is still feeling depressed, but also feels less lethargic and has more energy. This can be a bad combination for some folks, and likely accounts for much of the increased suicide risk for people on SSRIs.

Half the battle is understanding it as a potential and at the first signs of such thoughts, talk to your doctor or therapist about them. And keep talking, don't stop. Often just the process of working through these thoughts is enough to keep them at bay and get past this stage.

SSRIs aren't for everyone, but for most, they are very helpful. Always talk to your doctor, psychiatrists or therapist before making any changes to your medications. Even if you want to stop taking a med, they can help you with the process to ensure it goes smoothly and with the least amount of trouble.

DocJohn

If I might add my 2 cents...

I have taken both Paxil and Zoloft. I am currently on Paxil and Wellbutrin. I had s*icidal tendencies when I was a teen. Back then, I was not medicated. I have been SSRIs for the better part of 10 years now. This past year has been a very hard struggle with PTSD, flashbacks, etc. I tried, on two separate occasions to overdose on pills... rational? Absolutely not. I was trapped in a nightmare. I was on Paxil, but it was either not working or I was far past anything Paxil could possibly help. On the average, I would not even consider s*icide as an option. I am married to the love of my life and have two wonderful little kids. I have never been happier. But my brain does weird things. I don't blame the Paxil for my attempts. If anything, it has given me the opportunity to have a mostly normal and happy life. But in the darkest moments, I do revert to my irrational and anger-filled, SI-ridden days.

Right before I discovered this site, I actually reported my own d*ath on my LJ, much to the distress of my friends. Rational? Absolutely not. I was in the middle of a major breakdown. And so now I am on Wellbutrin in addition to the Paxil to keep my brain on the rails.

And I totally agree with the good Doc, that when you start taking an SSRI, it takes weeks for the full effect to kick in, and so that initial startup period is a time of risk to a person.. the process of physically changing while still feeling so low.

Am I just rambling? Maybe. But that is my experience.

Obsidian

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
ahhhhh ok well i can see this is heated debate. but thank you all for your responses they were all helpful and i think that b/c i have been on zoloft for a while i'm probably ok and i do feel better about it as a whole so thank you all and take care!
-nicole!

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">

Nicole,

I've got to agree with Sky that this is an exchange of different ideas.

I think the most important thing of the thread is Doc John's words in bold in his post.

If you've been on Zoloft for a while and it seems to be working....great!! If it is helping you for whatever reasons prescribed that is awesome. Don't be afraid to ask questions of your therapist, pdoc and pharmacist!! They're working with you to help you.

Asking questions is how we find our way through these situations in life. Glad you asked and again I think it is a good exchange of ideas currently surrounding the SSRI class of meds. The fact that you feel better about it as a whole is a nice bonus to the thread.

I didn't mean to vilify SSRIs but instead was trying to urge people to learn about what they're taking and keep tabs on how they're doing while going on or even maintaing a new medication.

Hi Nicole, hope your pregnancy is continuing to go smoothly. EVERONE reacts differently to meds. You are brave to be trying zoloft to help with your ocd. I know many people who have been helped by this class of drugs for ocd. Some need to go back to an older drug to get relief or use combinations. I guess I just want to encourage you to listen to your own body and your own medical treatment people who know you best. I do not tend to react adversely to drugs, but my friend has absolute serious reactions to most medications, as did her mother! Go figure. She is even allergic to advil. Our bodies are just different. Good luck with the OCD and with baby. Geez, I want to hold a little baby!!! pout pout

I personally say, "relax", these meds have become an "escape goat" for those that will most likely suicide regardless of being on or off meds. everyone that will or will not accept the responsibility of such actions are so ready to accuse pharmaceutical companies and/or the docs who prescribe them, not saying there are exceptions.
I personally disagree (over years of "life" experiences) that the meds., even Accutane, for acne (I was on that too) cause a person to suicide, one must seek a mental health evaluation before accusing meds., docs., and manufacturers of such psycho pharmaceutical companies of one's downfall.
My best (and maybe unwanted) advice, is to talk thoroughly with the prescibing physician of what possible side effects may occur and then weigh them on the scale of "how helpful" the meds may be.
My final and possible contraversial opinion is, do not attack the pharmaceutical companies and the prescibing physician, it is our own responsibilty to ask questions.

Please take care,
DE

))))))))))))darkeyes((((((((((((



xoxo

Nicole, I have to agree with what most people said, you have to stay aware that everyone may react differently to medications and you must be vigilant and informed. Get all the information you can and then make an educated choice. Talk to all the professionals everyone said to. There is one thing I would like to add...also tell those people who are closest to you (friends, relatives) when/if you change medications. Your t may see you 1x a week or less but friends and family see you daily. They can perhaps pick up on behaviors that are different or worry-some, that you may not be aware of. I was once on a med. that caused problems I was not aware of and a friend approached me and let me know things were not good. I made an appointment right away and got off the drug. It may have saved my life.

Just a thought. Take care. (((Nicole)))

place

Im a bit late in responding, but here's what I know about SSRI and kids...

The thing with SSRI is that they lower your inhibitions and give you energy before your depression is "cured" (read: getting better). Young adults and kids are less able to control impulsivity and are usually even more instable than mature grown-ups. Thereby this effect might be even more pronounced with this group of people. Often also kids have less efficient defense mechanisms and different ways of coping. I think you can simply say that it's different kinds of depressions between younsgters and grown ups Strictly speaking no one should be given antidepressives without close follow up by an experienced psychologist or psychiatrist because of this, but as it is now this is not done. I guess per today its impossible.

That has been going on for quite some time with young kids.
Not just for Zoloft but SSRI's in general.

I started taking Zoloft at a young age at 16 yrs old and never got any suicidal tendencies.

No kid should really be on SSRI's until they are older.

I took Zoloft for Depression, Anxiety and PTSD and it worked wonders for me.

Parents need to be aware of how their child is reacting to any medication, not just anti-depressants.

Some people miss the warning signs, and it's a terrible thing.

But I think it's not for every child no.

But it has happened therefore the warnings need to be in place.

Like i said Zoloft has been wonderful for me, I had no such tendencies at 16 when I first got on the drug.

I'm sure you will be fine. Try not to think the worse ....

I never had an adverse reaction.

Not everyone will have an adverse reaction, they don't happen very often at all.

But with all medications there is always a chance of an adverse reaction depending if you are on any other medications and so forth.

Try not to worry about it, you will be fine hon.

I have been on a myriad of AD's and none of them ever made me feel suicidal; I either didn't care about ANYTHING or they didn't work at all.

Every person is different on how they react to a new med (I'm learning this everyday as I try to adjust to my new recipe).

Voice your concerns to the Doc who prescribed them, and maybe they can put you a bit more at ease about taking the new med.

I hope you gained some useful knowledge thru all of us here, and GOOD LUCK!

Take Care,
Jenn

This is an excellent thread. I learned a lot reading each of your posts.

I feel that I must trust Doc's advice and also add that each person's body chemistry is different. Each person reactis in his/her own way to a medicine, just as some of us are allergic to eggs and some of us aren't.

My pharmacist helped me so much the other day when I was having severe problems with my meds. He was a kind soul and frankly, I've never met a rude one. Ask your doc and ask your pharmacist.

Best,

January

PS. I need to add that only you know your body and mind. If you know something is terribly wrong, get on the phone and leave an emergency message or go to the emergency room. If you're alone like me, and you can't drive, call 911. They will help you. Above all else, call someone and tell them you need emergency help. If you have to, make a big sign and tape it to he frige to remind you when you can't think.

January