unpopular but effective treatment for depression

I think it's awesome that you tried and you were right to feel pride. Your therapist was being a jerk when they said that IMHO

Hi Jimi
I'm with Ancient Melody. I do "get" the downward pull that can make any kind of activity feel impossible. For me, it's the Catch 22 problem that I've faced when job hunting: you need an experience to get a job but you need a job to get experience.

When you're depressed, you need energy to exercise but you need to exercise to generate energy. I've fought depression all my life. I don't know if it was as severe as others on this board, or MORE severe. I've seen therapists, and done a lot of other treatments. I've found that for ME, exercise and a better diet are TREATMENTS, not cures.

But I applaud you too for trying to do something in your own power, that should have been empowering, on your behalf. Your therapist really blew this one, IMHO.

For me, the problem is once I am immobilized, it takes practically superhuman strength to begin my exercising. So, yes, I get it.

It doesn't cure dementia nor addiction like he also had and definitely not depression. I think it's how you initially worded it like hello....people don't know to try this!? And diet and vitamins ect...nothing wrong with thse things but thy are probably better for situational depression which effects everybody anyway

I am probably sensitive to this topic right now because I find myself sliding back into depression no matter how I have safe guarded againSt it and it pisses me of dealing with this since I was 15
For what it's worth I wouldn't touch ect either ha

?? I said nothing of the sort. I suggest you re-read what I've written and you'll see that. Maybe you were referring to someone else. Nobody here has claimed that exercise is a cure, only a treatment method.

Here are some studies that have evaluated exercise and depression:

Exercise Treatment for Major Depression: Maintenance of Ther... : Psychosomatic Medicine
Abstract


Objective: The purpose of this study was to assess the status of 156 adult volunteers with major depressive disorder (MDD) 6 months after completion of a study in which they were randomly assigned to a 4-month course of aerobic exercise, sertraline therapy, or a combination of exercise and sertraline.
Methods: The presence and severity of depression were assessed by clinical interview using the Diagnostic Interview Schedule and the Hamilton Rating Scale for Depression (HRSD) and by self-report using the Beck Depression Inventory. Assessments were performed at baseline, after 4 months of treatment, and 6 months after treatment was concluded (ie, after 10 months).
Results: After 4 months patients in all three groups exhibited significant improvement; the proportion of remitted participants (ie, those who no longer met diagnostic criteria for MDD and had an HRSD score <8) was comparable across the three treatment conditions. After 10 months, however, remitted subjects in the exercise group had significantly lower relapse rates (p = .01) than subjects in the medication group. Exercising on one’s own during the follow-up period was associated with a reduced probability of depression diagnosis at the end of that period (odds ratio = 0.49, p = .0009).
Conclusions: Among individuals with MDD, e-ercise therapy is feasible and is associated with significant therapeutic benefit, especially if exercise is continued over time.

And another point worth adressing: as much as some people only respond to medication and nothing else, there is a good third of people who DON'T respond to medication. They need other treatment options.

And here's an interesting article discussing an exercise prescription for his patients
For Depression, Prescribing Exercise Before Medication - The Atlantic

Nobody initially worded it like this...like HELLO, people don't know to try this??

No, you didn't. You said it would be unpopular. That implies there is a choice but people will reject that choice because it is too simple or requires too much effort. You may not have meant it that way but that's how it sounded and that would be insulting to some people. It isn't necessarily unpopular... it's downright out of the question for some. One thing you have to keep in mind here is that a lot of members have chronic or long term depression. It's often accompanied by other issues that make exercise even more out of the question. We have also read many posts introducing exercise as something new
Speaking on exercise, I have found that it is very helpful for anxiety although it takes a while to really help. What it is really helpful for is as a tool to help prevent people from falling back into severe depression.
As for a good diet, it's been mentioned that good healthful foods are expensive. And it also requires extra thought and planning and preparation. Someone who is very depressed may have difficulty managing a package of ramen noodles or scrambled eggs.
What you take as defensiveness is just a combination of having heard this before many times and sheer frustration.

Yes, and the meds also may take a while to really help. And they may have horrific side effects, like permanent and disfiguring movement disorders such as tongue flicking and tics. So there's that. But those facts may also prove unpopular, but they are emphatically TRUE.

Yes, the treatment of MI is a complicated issue.

Of course exercise and good food is good, but I found the OP judging from the start. Like, if you don't choose it you did something wrong.

It IS hurtful. When I was depressed I looked for emergency help and when I was denied I was going home just to realize I didn't know where I lived. Also I couldn't cook not JUST because I lacked energy, but because I also didn't remember what to do with food anymore.

Everyone's depression is different. Some can be rather active still and remember how to do things. They have other options than if you lack energy and don't have any memory or focusing skills. The first type might not be any LESS hurting or less severe. No, not at all. But where your depression hits, that will be a very weak area for you. I don't really like when that is not seen and ignored.

I try not to minimize other people's depression just because it looks different than mine. But trying to understand others takes some effort, it just doesn't happen, you have to work a little for it to happen.

People healthy food is not THAT expensive and hard to make. Sure veggies are more expensive than burger in your part of the world (in my part of word by some quirk in economy McDonalds menu is more expensive than dinner in some normal restaurant), but it's not gonna wreck your bank account. And how hard is it putting veggies on baking pan, drizzling them with olive oil and some spices and bake them? How hard is it to make couscous to go with it?

You don't need all the fancy schmancy trendy fad foods and diets (low carb no gluten paleo frutarian nonsense). Just common sense. Avoiding processed foods. Make your portions when feeling somewhat better and pop them in freezer.

How hard is it to make couscous when I'm depressed? ? Lol old REALLY hard, especially since my brain barley knows my name . I'm talking DEPRESSION here people, like close to catatonic
I guess like Jim said we all experience it on a different way so it's hard to relate.

Isn't pouring hot water over ramen or couscous the same... process and amount of work though? Is there really so much difference in opening can of hummus or jar of something healthy and jar of something that is so full of preservatives and chemicals it does not deserve to be called a food?

I read an article recently (sorry for no link forget where) that food can generally be 2 of 3 things: cheap, healthy, and convenient. It is very rarely all three.

So yes, there is some cheap healthy food, but it is rarely convenient. And there is healthy convenient food but it is rarely cheap. I volunteer at a food pantry and can tell you many many people struggle with this, and many of them don't have the additional burden of low motivation from depression.

You mention that eating healthy is not that hard on your bank account. Many of the people I see at the pantry are so poor they don't HAVE a bank account.

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Venuss I've always respected your opinions and views but on this one you are making assumptions that don't hold up and you are oversimplifying as much as others are overcomplicating. Think on it. Some people with depression/anxiety can barely prepare the simplest meal. Then there is the trip to the supermarket if they are lucky enough to have one nearby. For a lot of people going into a supermarket is very difficult. It was for me at one time. I was in and out as quickly as possible.
You're also going off on a tangent with talk of fancy shmancy trendy foods. I don't know where that came from. To me, during the bad times, it was all extremely hard to plan diet much less put it into practice. Other than the money question it was also the action required... get on a bus (hellish experience with agoraphobia or severe anxiety) to get to where the food is, run into the supermarket and try to last long enough to pick up oj, tea, eggs, peanut butter, oatmeal, ramen and maybe bananas and some broccoli. Then the agonizing wait in the checkout line and back to the bus stop to wait for the equally hellish ride home.
I think most of us on the con side of this are just pointing out that the situations aren't the same for everyone. There are degrees of illness and stages of recovery. It isn't a one size fits all.
As for exercise, yes by all means, if you can do it. And really push yourself before you say you can't. But some people, some times, really can't.

Yup, like trying to exercise or eat better just doesn't happen, you have to work a little for it to happen. But....that sounds "judging" so it is off the table, and you can shame me for being "judging" but you can freely tell me to "understand others."

Well, here if I want to live outside of "under the bridge" and have job, I need to have bank account or nobody will even talk to me. So it's not sign of some luxurious lifestyle.

Or should I say vallet... only to be told some are so poor they cannot afford vallets? Bad joke, I know, but picking out on a word is not really an arugment.

No, by itself it's not an argument. My first two paragraphs were my main argument, but you haven't addressed those.

I never said you having a bank account meant you live a luxurious lifestyle. The reason I pointed it out was that it is a simple thing that most of us take for granted. And the people I'm talking about without bank accounts--most do have jobs and don't live under bridges.

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So what do they eat? For me, if I don't eat, I starve, eventually I could get really ill/die. If I don't go to supermarket (don't have one nearby either), I will have no food. And once there... does it matter if you buy unhealthy non-food or something that is at least somewhat resembling food?

Or maybe cause I am in EU, where unhealthy crap is taxed for being unhealthy, the disparity is not so glaring? As I said, McDonalds is EXPENSIVE here.

But still.

As for fancy shmchancy food, I have experience with people who think it's either super restrictive unrealistic diet or mcdonalds and pop tarts all the time (or whatever vice of choice).

Well, I agreed with your first two paragraphs, I was just at the bank account bit. You don't need bank account to buy vegetables/non-crap anyways.

Maybe eating healthy will not "cure" you. But eating horribly will not help and in most cases WILL make you worse. Also I do not thing eating well will do much to "situational" depression. That requires resolving of the situation. However, again, it will not help to wreck your body by putting crap in it.

I am all up for diet and exercise today! I woke up and finally my effexor has kicked in yeah yeah
Nomnom love me some meds with all that healthy food haha
Everybody has a point we just have to understand everybody is coming from a different place and possible illness

Great point on the timing too. I have heard that theoretically that is how anti-depressants are meant to be used ideally. They give you the boost and you take it from there. Theoretically... ideally

Venuss, I don't know what they eat but I'm glad they manage to eat something/anything that will get them through to better times. I ate that way for a year until things got better. Eggs, peanut butter, oatmeal, etc aren't really unhealthy... you just get really really tired of them.

Yea but what if all your energy goes to just staggering to the bathroom and "simple" things like that? But yea, we didn't TRYYY enough... yea good heavens, we didn't fight for our lives...

We were just lazy.

Say it how it is.

well said!