Can this be caused by antipsychotics and antidepressants?

My son was admitted to a psychiatric hospital ten days ago and they're giving him both antidepressants and antipsychotics to help with his depression and I'm getting increasingly worried because of the side effects. He was feeling extremely sick the first few days, he says that it's better now but he's still barely eating. This seems to be a common side effect of the antidepressant but there are other things aswell that worry me: He's normally a very eloquent (he is really good with words) and clear thinking person but whenever I see him now it's like he is not really there. He seems somehow dazed and unfocused and there is something off about his speaking patterns and movements. A lot of what he is saying at the moment does not make sense and I feel like he doesn't even realise this. (He is not saying any weird or obscure things, it's more like he is in denial about the situation he is in.)
I first thought that this behaviour was due to the medication but I looked them up and I don't feel like this medication usually causes this kind of behaviour, which is why I'm even more worried now because I'm not sure if this is a psychological problem which would be much worse than it being a side effect. I probably should speak to his doctor again about this?

He is taking Fluctin, which seems to be the same as Prozac, and an antipsychotic called Taxilan but on Wikipedia it is stated that they do not use it in the US, so I'm not sure if anyone knows it?

I would be very grateful if people who have experience with this kind of medication could tell me if this bevaviour sounds familiar and if this could simply be side effects.

Thank you and best wishes!

Lunik

Those are odd drugs to use. The antipsychotic could be causing the dazed and unfocused thing. I would talk to his doc.

Based on your last post I assume your son has depression. If he attempted suicide I assume he was in a very severe depression at that time. Was he eloquent and clear thinking at that time? If he attempted, survived and ended up in the hospital that is a very traumatic experience. He could be deeply ashamed and embarrassed about the whole thing. He might be really pissed he didn't succeed. I don't know the circumstances or how serious it was. In any case it is very traumatic for him and anyone would be dazed and confused. You might want to post in these sections to get feedback from others who have been through it and from others who have had to deal with family members who have been through it.

Depression - Forums at Psych Central

Partners of People & Caregivers Support - Forums at Psych Central

Oh I see you did. That is good. Maybe try the depression section to try to see it from your sons side of things.

My daughter had an attempt when she was 16. She took about 20 or so anti depressants. She called her boyfriend right away and he called 911 and they pumped her stomach. 20 or 30 Effexor wasn't going to do anything but she didn't know that. I also did the same thing some years before that with a bottle of Remeron, an antidepressant. I pretty much knew it wouldn't do the job but not for sure. Any attempt has to be taken very seriously but I do think there are orders of degree of seriousness. Some people say it is a cry for help or attention but I don't believe that for a minute. I didn't tell anyone for a month.

He seemed normal before it happened, quiet but not desperate or confused. We had no idea he even was depressed before this happened.
He went out to meet his friends and the next morning the police contacted us and told us that our son had slit his wrists and had been taken to the hospital. He seemed to be serious about it and we still don't understand it because he never said anything, never even seemed sad or unmotivated.
At the moment I find it hard to understand what is going on with him, I never know if he is serious about the things he says or if he is trying to distract himself and us from what happened or if the medication makes him feel confused... he doesn't even seem to realise that he is not making sense.
Why are those odd drugs to you? His doctor said that it is normal procedure to give him an antipsychotic because it takes a few weeks for the anti-depressant to start taking effect and he needs something to calm him down now...

I have just not heard of anyone ever taking those drugs. I am in the US though and maybe it is different in Germany. Anti depressants and anti psychotics are not unusual, I just have not heard of those two.

I recently read a chapter in a book on depression about suicide and it said that in many cases attempted suicide has nothing to do with depression. People always assume that someone has to be deeply depressed but according to this book the statistics say this is not true. Some experts say it should be looked at as separate issue from depression. It is a little understood phenomenon.

How old is your son?
Has he said very much about why?
Has he said very much about what other symptoms he was having before this happened?
A correct diagnosis is important.

He is 19 years old.
He hasn't said much about why he did it or what he is feeling and we don't want to pressure him into talking about it if he isn't ready yet... even though we desperately need answers.
We did ask him why he didn't talk to us and he said because it has nothing to do with us and because there was nothing to talk about. When someone mentions the term "depression" he gets upset and insists that he is not depressed. After it happened we thought that something must have happened, like an argument, maybe he was in love, maybe he did something he feels ashamed of and didn't want us to know... In the beginning we even thougt that someone must have done this to him, forced him to do it, that he was being threatened or something... because it made so little sense to us that he would do this. He said no to all of this and says that nothing happened, not on this specific day and not before. We asked him if he wanted to die and he said that he just didn't see the point in living anymore and that it seemed logical to him in that moment. He was so completely passive about it as if his life didn't matter and it was something he could simply quit if it didn't appeal to him anymore. If he had said that something had happened and that he didn't know how to deal with it and that he did it because he was desperate, that would have been hurtful but more understandable.
His doctor thinks that he is too intelligent and too empathetic and that he is unable to regulate his emotions and outside influences the way people normally do. She thinks that he "understands the world too well" and that he is unable to distance himself from things going on around him. He never seemed depressed to me but it is true that he was always deeply affected by outside influences. He can always tell when something is wrong and he usually knows what is wrong and you ask yourself how he knows these things. He is able to understand people on a level that always amazed me and I used to thing that I was quite good at putting myself into other people's situations. He once said to me that sometimes finds it hard to form an opinion because he understands everyone's opinions and usually cannot even getangry when people treat him wrongly because he understands their position and that he sometimes wishes that he could be more selfish. I used to see this as a gift and now I'm asking myself if it is not actually a curse and that it is the reason he was so unhappy

Maybe I should add that he sometimes has panic attacks but those happen on very rare occasions and he knew what situations would trigger them and tried to avoid these situations, therefore it happened very rarely. (He is afraid of confined places and crowds, places where he cannot get away when he wants to.)

Sounds like the doctor has a good theory.

"It just seemed logical at the time" struck me. I think I read that exact same thing in the chapter I was talking about. An impulsive thing.

"The Noon Day Demon" by Andrew Solomon

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I will look up this book. Thank you!

Well, what I was able to find out about Taxilan (generic name perazine) is that it's an old typical anti-psychotic used only in a handful of European countries. It's in the same drug class as Thorazine and Stelazine. There's no detailed drug information available in English, so I'm going to assume Taxilan's effects are similar to those of the other similar drugs and say that your son's apathetic behavior and flattened affect absolutely could be an effect of the drug. In fact, at high enough doses this type of drug is almost guaranteed to make anyone spacey and zombie-like.

Now my real question is: Is this good medicine? When I answered your other thread, you only said your son was being given an anti-psychotic, and I assumed they were using a modern anti-psychotic. Taxilan is not modern. This is a very debatable choice. Newer anti-psychotics have anti-depressant qualities as well as being calming and helping anxiety, which makes them a logical choice for someone having a depressive crisis (and I have to assume that's what the doctors think happened to your son, because otherwise what's the Prozac for?). Older anti-psychotics don't help depression. So why is your son being given Taxilan instead of Seroquel, Abilify, or Zyprexa? I would demand an answer to that question from the doctors. Phenothiazine class drugs like Taxilan are less safe in the short term than the newer drugs, so they're not doing it because it's safer.

Frankly, I'm concerned that the doctors are "snowing" your son ("snowing" is a slang term for when doctors heavily over-medicate a psychiatric patient to make them compliant and obedient--it's a terrible practice which is entirely about making life easier for the staff at the institution and is very damaging to patients). What you describe, especially how his speech and movements seem "off", sounds extremely similar to the anti-psychotic snowing I've seen here in the U.S. This degree of change in personality is NOT a "side-effect". I take multiple anti-psychotics, including a Phenothiazine-class typical AP similar to Taxilan, and have no problems like you describe because the drugs have been prescribed properly.

I could be wrong. I could be that your son is slipping towards a catatonic or psychotic state of depression. But if that's the case, his meds should be being adjusted very aggressively to try to stop the slide.

I am not sure if this will be helpful for you or not but when my parents first found out I was depressed, had attempted suicide on numerous occassions and also self harmed I was not able to tell them why. Its not that I didnt want to but more the fact that I didnt know or understand it myself it took several years of therapy and yes the sh did get worse but now I am finally able to acknowledge why I hurt myself and for me it was all the verbal/ emotional and sexual abuse that I went through right up until my mid teens (I am now 25)

I hope that your son receives the help he needs and that you are looking after yourself too! thinking of you

After Night Side of Edens post I too am concerned why they would use such an old typical anti psychotic that is so similar to thorazine when there are so many newer atypical antipsychotics available.

Was he involuntarily admitted? Do you have a choice in when he leaves? Can you access a second opinion? Are they giving him any group or individual therapy while he is there like CBT or DBT?

Nightside of Eden, what you're describing is pretty much what I had feared when he was admitted! That they would simply lock him up and give him drugs, so he wouldn't do anything "stupid".
What they did with our son over the last two weeks was basically safekeeping and had little to do with therapy. He had two conversations with a therapist and he could have participated in occupational therapy but he declined. There was no therapy apart from that.
The good news is that he will be transfered to a "normal" (open) ward tomorrow! First there had been talk about four weeks so we're really relieved that they decided to let him go. They want him to stay at the hospital for several weeks to get proper therapy but it is not certain how this is going to work out because our son wants to leave as soon as possible, which I understand but don't think is what he needs at the moment and which the doctors strongly advice against, too.
I advised him to demand a change in medication or at least discuss it with a doctor because something about this just doesn't seem right. They are definitely not helping him by giving him drugs that make it impossible for him to think straight and eat properly. He is neither delusional nor aggressive, there really is no reason to sedate him like this.

Nightside of Eden, prozac is also given for panic attacks.
She said her son knew his triggers, like confined spaces, and tried to avoid them.
It's possible the prozac was given for both depression and anxiety.

I'm at a loss as to why the doctor gave him an old antipsychotic. I don't know what to think of that.

atypical anti-psychotics ("modern" ones) sometimes have worse side effects than old ones. mainly metabolic syndrome and pre diabetes, severe weight gain. just because it is old doesnt mean it is automatically bad. while it is true that all antispychotics kind of numb people out, it seemed from an earlier post from OP that the doctor said she was using it until the anti depressant kicked in. maybe i am wrong? either way, it could be a number of things that are making your son seem different. i mean, he did just try to kill himself.

The short term side-effects of modern anti-psychotics certainly are less than older ones. I don't have anything against older APs--I take one myself. But they have no effect on depression and prescribing them for someone who's depressed makes no sense.

Also, anyone who thinks weight gain and diabetes is WORSE than Tardive Dyskinesia is... smoking something I want some of.

The metobolic effects are not really a concern for short term use like in this case.

I took halidol for a year and the ridged muscles and not being able to stop moving was pure hell. This was twenty years ago and I don't think the AAP's were even around. I was in no position to self advocate at that time. I really can't believe I was compliant.

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