Do you expect T?

Hi. I am new and have been having a real difficult time with T, so I want to ask this question and I hope that you all can help:

Do you expect T to:
1) Be supportive and reassuring (if so, what does this mean)?
2) Engage in conversation (as opposed to just listening)?
3) Disclose alot of personal stuff, especially stuff that makes it hard for you to relate?
4) Call back in a timely manner (and what is timely?)
5) Try to stay connected with you (and how?)

I hope these aren't too many questions.
I have felt so much worse because of my current therapy and I am trying to understand if I am expecting too much from therapy or if the relationship is not working. Thanks.

Welcome to PC, Tollhouse.

I'll answer according to the expectations I have of my therapist now, but I didn't have these when I started with him. My expectations have developed based on his typical pattern of behavior. I have come to know what I can expect from him.

Do you expect T to:
1) Be supportive and reassuring (if so, what does this mean)?
Yes, my therapist is usually supportive, but sometimes things he says make me anxious. But in general, he is EXTREMELY supportive.

2) Engage in conversation (as opposed to just listening)?
Yes, he talks to me. We enjoy each other's intellect. But he is a really good listener too, and he makes me take the lead in therapy. It is up to me to start the session with what I bring to it.

3) Disclose alot of personal stuff, especially stuff that makes it hard for you to relate?
My T does disclose a lot to me and I like that. But it is not stuff that makes it hard for me to relate. What he tells me tends to draw us closer. If your T's self-disclosure is not helpful to you, could you tell him that? If my T were suddenly to stop disclosing to me, I would be upset and feel like I had done something wrong. It would push me away from him if he suddenly became insular.

4) Call back in a timely manner (and what is timely?)
No. My T is terrible with returning phone calls. He often doesn't, and I won't hear from him for a week or two until we have a session again. I know this now and so I call him rarely. I try to keep our out-of-session communication to a minimum (my T has very strong boundaries), usually just for rescheduling or cancelling. I think my T is exceptionally bad with the phone, and most T's are more responsive.

5) Try to stay connected with you (and how?)
He connects strongly with me at every session. He is really attuned to me when we are together, and he self discloses, which helps us connect, and he shares his feelings and thoughts with me. He is also very warm and giving and he is able to "hold" my sad feelings when I let them out. We also have a lot of shared interests, and have similar politics. Outside of session, we sometimes have little email exchanges (the messages are a couple of sentences or so) and these can help with connection. But they are not a frequent occurrence.

How long have you been in therapy with this therapist? I think when we are getting started on hard work in therapy, we can feel worse before we feel better. What do you think--is the relationship not working?

Hi. I am new and have been having a real difficult time with T, so I want to ask this question and I hope that you all can help:

Do you expect T to:
1) Be supportive and reassuring (if so, what does this mean)?

Some Ts are talkers and some prefer for the client to lead the way. If your T isn't living up to what you want your T to do in this area, it may be a therapeutic mismatch (ie, maybe you would do better with a T who is more /less of a talker)

2) Engage in conversation (as opposed to just listening)?

My thoughts on this are the same as above, I guess.

3) Disclose alot of personal stuff, especially stuff that makes it hard for you to relate?

Again, some will and some won't. I have had one T who disclosed very little, and another who disclosed way more than I was comfortable with.

4) Call back in a timely manner (and what is timely?)

Some will and some won't! One T I had was absolutely shocking at this, even in instances where any ethically bound therapist would have called back way before. As for timely... there are many reasons why a therapist may not call back as soon as we would like them to. Some will call back after work, and others are very strict about only doing so during work hours. Timely I would say would be the end of the next working day. Which is not really as soon as most clients would like, but the most reasonable expectation, I would think. But again - every therapist will have their own boundaries about contact outside the T hour and clients have to respect those limits, whether they like it or not.

5) Try to stay connected with you (and how?)

I think each therapist should to try to connect with every client at every session. However in reality, it often doesn't happen that way. Ts have off days too. Ts make blunders. Ts sometimes say the wrong things at the wrong time and unwittingly destroy any hope of connection for that particular session.

Interesting questions, Tollhouse. I'm going through a somewhat difficult time through therapy right now, and this is right up my alley, wondering some of these things

1) Be supportive and reassuring (if so, what does this mean)?
Yes, I would hope so. I think mine is supportive in the fact that I know she wants the best for me, and is always there to listen to me. Reassuring is a little different, because I am having a hard time beliving that. I think I have to come out and ask for what I want/need from her, and in the year and a halfish that I've been working, I haven't done that--so I haven't gotten very reassured. One time she asked if I was worried that she agreed with me on feeling useless, and I hid behind a pillow while nodding "yes." hehe. She was like "Well, I don't" all matter of fact. So that made me feel better.

2) Engage in conversation (as opposed to just listening)?
I think as therapy has moved forward, it has moved more from her just listening (or sitting in silence), to more of a conversation. I always have to start the session with whatever I decide to talk about, unless I have sent her some sort of tortured email in between sessions, which I try not to do. Even then, she just casually mentions that I wrote one and lets me take it from there.

3) Disclose alot of personal stuff, especially stuff that makes it hard for you to relate?

She has disclosed personal stuff here and there, but it ALWAYS has related to me and my therapy in some way. Always. I don't think there's ever been stuff where its been hard to relate. I know some things about her family, but they have related to my family life in some way (like her sister lives where I'm from). Mostly though, she lets me babble on about myself

4) Call back in a timely manner (and what is timely?)
When I first called to make that first appointment, I think it took her two days. She did apologize for taking so long to get back to me, though. I've only called her once since, and that was because I overslept and woke up when the appointment was about to begin, so she called me right back. I have yet to call any other time, but I think she would be rather timely about it. I would say that would depend on the situation/urgency of the matter, and if she's working or on vacation.

5) Try to stay connected with you (and how?)
Ooh, good question. I think maybe she tries in some ways, and I'm resistant or oblivious to it. I'm not sure. I struggle with this one. Once, I mentioned a song that really spoke to me, and she got all excited and said "You should bring it in and we can listen to it!!" I was like.... 'NO THANKS' haha. I did end up writing her an email with the lyrics, and the next session she said "It seems like you want to connect to me, but then get scared, I wonder why?" (Oh, therapists)

I hope this helps a little!

Thanks everyone for your responses. I have been with T for 1 year but it has been extremely rough.
I have told T that I don't like the silence about a dozen times in various ways and T does not seem to care. A few minutes of silence is fine, but T does not respond to what I say. Sometimes NOTHING is said.
Last week, I finally gave up and just stopped talking.

I have had 2 major crisis and T did not call back... T says "you can call" but it could be days later when T returns my call.

T has disclosed alot about T's life to me. I come from nothing and grew up without a family (foster care). I even know what T's parents did for jobs and stuff about T's siblings and stuff about T's current family. It makes me feel horrible and like we have nothing in common. How am I supposed to talk about what it was like for me, when I know how great it was for T? See?
If T disclosed that T loved the same music, that would be helpful....but not things that we are so different about.

I try and think it's just "transference," but what is the point of therapy if it keeps replicating the past with no corrective emotional experience???

I feel so depressed, not supported, and generally not cared about.

Do you expect T to:

1) Be supportive and reassuring (if so, what does this mean)?
Yes, but that doesn't mean he's not going to say things to me that hurt somehow, are disconcerting, or otherwise don't make me feel better. It's my responsibility to tell him how I'm feeling though, so that he can be supportive and reassuring.


2) Engage in conversation (as opposed to just listening)?
I've been open with my therapist about being "fired" from therapy before because I couldn't/wouldn't talk. I'm really trying to not have that happen again and he's been very good about asking questions to help me start talking, prodding me along when I get stalled, and increasing his end of the conversation when I start to get discouraged about not knowing what to say next.

3) Disclose alot of personal stuff, especially stuff that makes it hard for you to relate?
My therapist has shared some personal stuff, when it was relevant, but it hasn't been that often.

Every few weeks I make my therapist repeat to me the things that I could do that would make him not want to do therapy with me anymore. He always includes the "therapy interefering behaviors" that could occur on his end that could make me want to terminate. We've agreed to tell each other as early as possible when that's happening to one of us. If he was telling me a lot about himself that didn't seem relevant, it would be my responsibility to bring it up.

4) Call back in a timely manner (and what is timely?)
I don't understand therapists, or anyone in a business, but especially one in a helping/caring/medical/therapeutic field not returning calls in a timely manner. When I leave a message, if I want a call back, I specifically say that and leave some times that I know I will be available. Obviously, the time I expect a call back in depends on the severity of my situation. But I know that if things are really bad and I don't get a call back in an hour or so, I need to find another way to take care of myself - going to the emergency room, getting in touch with a friend or family member that can come over, etc.

If I had several experiences in which I called to change appointments or something like that and it took more than a couple days to hear from him, I'd want to find out what his preferred method for taking care of those things. Maybe it's something we neglected to talk about in the first few sessions. Maybe he's falling behind on his end of the deal.

5) Try to stay connected with you (and how?)
I kind of wish mine would try to stay connected with me between appointments, but I'm not sure what form that would take. The confidentiality forms I signed at the beginning of therapy, specifically included a paragraph on keeping the relationship purely therapeutic and inside the office. I know that doesn't preclude things like email or phone calls, but it makes me think that it's less likely to happen.

I think it's normal to discuss all these things with your therapist. If your expectations aren't unreasonable and your T can't meet them, maybe your T can recommend one that would be a better fit.

Good luck,

gkeeper

Does not sound like a good relationship to me...

tollhouse - like others have said, it really does depend on what the T is willing to offer/what they are trained to do etc.

it does not sound like you are getting much from this T. it doesn't matter what others of us "expect" from our Ts - just that this particular T you are seeing does not seem to be helping you.

i would think it's time to branch out and try to find someone more suitable for you. use your time with your current T & think of it as learning what you do and do not need. ask potential Ts what their policy on returning calls is, whether they use silence in therapy a lot (or misuse, as it sounds in your case), whether they self disclose a lot etc.

I agree that it does not sound like a good fit for you, Tollhouse. Many people change Ts. There is no reason for you to continue seeing one who makes you feel depressed and uncared about.

Actually it is helpful to know what others "expect" or get from their T's, because it helps me realize whether I am "expecting" too much from a therapeutic relationship, especially if I have a therapist who gives mixed signals.

For example: Someone wrote they would expect to be called back within a timely manner and they don't understand therapists who don't do so. (paraphrased)
So, I know better that it is not too much of me to expect this in a therapeutic relationship and it gives me an indicator that my feelings about my relationship are not so off.

This one thing alone suggests that the relationship may not be a good fit. Do you think you would rather be with a therapist who was more responsive? Some T's do not offer a lot of talk, but if they are that way, they will at least explain why they take the approach they do. It sounds like your T has explained nothing to you about the approach he/she is using and why it might be helpful to you, etc. That sounds rude. Or lazy. Or something. It also sounds almost contradictory. Your T "engage in conversation", but yet you hear too much from him/her about his/her own life. Does that mean your T sits there and does not respond to your words, but then will spend significant time talking about him/herself?

Are you getting any benefit from this relationship, from this therapy? Why are you still there? Are there are positive reasons that outweigh the negative things you have raised here?

1) I do, and she has not let me down in this area. She is very supportive of me, and reassuring. Despite all the trouble I am, and all the crap I've brought to her, she helps me work through it, and she is with me every step of the way.

2) I prefer my T to engage in conversation, which she does. It helps me remember that I'm talking to an actual person, and it's more easy to open up and relate that way. But that's just a personal preference of mine.

3) She does self-disclose a good amount, and it helps me a lot. It helps me relate, and again, it helps me remember that I'm talking to an actual person. Plus, she has been through similar things as I have, so it helps me to know that she can relate. However, I wouldn't expect her to throw out her whole life story, because that is personal, but nothing she tells me would bother me either way.

4) She is extremely good about calling me back in a timely manner, and i feel like that is really important. She knows I tend to have a hectic schedule, so scheduling isn't something that can be put off for too long. If I call her early enough in the day, she usually calls back either during a break, or right before she leaves the office. If I leave her a message later, she calls first thing in the morning. She is extremely diligent about returning phone calls, and just that diligence is helpful and comforting.

5) I don't think either one of us has to try too hard to stay connected...it really just happens. I feel a constant connection to her. One, we have a lot in common, so that is connecting, and also, just the therapeutic connection is present. That, I think, comes from me trusting her, and from all of the support and reassurance she has given me. I don't feel like we have to try at all to be connected...we just are.

In the beginning T talked about T-self when I would ask a question. I learned to stop asking questions because I got tons of unwanted detail. Now T says nothing and just is mostly silent. No support, no interpretation, no "why is that?" or "how does that make you feel?" or "im sorry that happened." or "tell me more" or anything appropriate.
In the last couple months, I have asked by talking, by writing, by yelling, by crying to please talk back to me, but nope. The silence is killing me. T never said T was a "blank-slate" type of T.
And as therapy continues, it gets worse. I don't understand.

Why am I still there?
Truth:
I am still there because I am such a loser I have NO one else in my life. And I thought therapy could help and so I pay money to hope. But I either picked the wrong T or I am such a loser that even T is sick of me.

I am just trying to find some validation that I am ok to quit and it makes sense to quit. Maybe I should not ask, but I don't know the answer.
I am trying to figure out what I should expect in therapy. I thought it would be supportive and a relationship with someone who would talk to me about my problems and help me figure out ways to solve them. Someone working with me. It's not like that at all.

Thanks.

sorry - i don't think i made my earlier comment that clear. it wasn't meant to be dismissive of your initial questions .

i guess with therapy, as with most things, people will go in with different expectations and then also revise those expectations as the process continues. with the example you brought up - i agree!! i think it is reasonable to expect that your therapist calls back in a timely manner. but i have been seeing my pdoc (who acts as my T) for almost 5 years now, and i love him dearly, but i know he is hopeless at returning calls. most times it is a few days later, but there have been a few times when he's forgotten altogether. but, for me, it isn't enough to break our relationship over because he has been helpful in so many other ways. if i was having problems with him in other areas (e.g., if he would just sit in silence - something some ppl appreciate, but personally i just hate) then i guess i would start looking for someone else.

i think there are a few articles on PC about how different therapists work which you might find helpful. i tried to dig them up but i suck at doing searches .

also - love your avatar, it makes me .

I will answer your questions in a moment, but I must say that they are very good questions - you are not a loser, just someone who is looking for support because you're not getting that support from your current T, and you should be! If the relationship does not feel right to you, and it sounds like you've really given it a try a few times, then it makes sense for you to find another T. The relationship with your T should be just what you wrote above - since you said it's not like that at all, I'd suggest looking for another T.

On to the questions...

Do you expect T to:
1) Be supportive and reassuring (if so, what does this mean)?
My T has been so supportive and reassuring that I really was confused at first as to why she was being so accepting of everything I was telling her, giving me constant affirmations when I didn't even feel like I deserved them.
2) Engage in conversation (as opposed to just listening)?
My T always lets me kick off the discussion, but then she definitely asks questions and makes comments. Her favorite question is "What do you make of that?" There are some silent moments - sometimes I break the silence, and sometimes T does.
3) Disclose alot of personal stuff, especially stuff that makes it hard for you to relate?
My T has disclosed very little personal stuff - the only time she's disclosed something personal, it was directly related to what we were discussing.
4) Call back in a timely manner (and what is timely?)
I've only had to call my T once, but she called me back in 2 hours.
5) Try to stay connected with you (and how?)
My T and I are fairly connected. When she says or does something that I don't like or disagree with, I bring it up, and we spend time talking about it - my T always thanks me for bringing things like that up and says how important it is to our relationship that we discuss those issues. So yes, I'd say we stay connected.

I don't understand either. Your T sounds mean, bordering on abusive. You are paying this person and he/she won't say anything to you? The behavior you report is way different from how a T who is a blank slate behaves. It almost sounds like he/she is doing some sort of experiment on you--"how long can I go without saying anything before she quits?"

It is OK to quit. It makes sense to quit.

Find someone who is not so rude and who will talk to you!

Wow!! I totally agree with Sunrise - this sounds like awful treatment. I certainly wouldn't be paying money for silence. Find someone else - you deserve better than this. Good luck!

1) Be supportive and reassuring (if so, what does this mean)?
Yes absolutly. This means she listens, empathises with me etc.
2) Engage in conversation (as opposed to just listening)?
Yes, I cant stand those therapists that expect work to get done but they arent genuine enough to have a proper conversation
3) Disclose alot of personal stuff, especially stuff that makes it hard for you to relate?
Most therapists don't take a lot about personal stuff and if they do then it is supposed to benifit the client in some way. I don't know that much about my Therapist and she usually answers my questions about her personal life. but doesn't spend ages talking about it.
4) Call back in a timely manner (and what is timely?)
Yeah I get annoyed if i have called and she doesnt call back. If i call in the morning i expect that she should be able to call before the end of the day. If i call in the afternoon I dont expect her to call back straight away.
5) Try to stay connected with you (and how?)
Sort of. Like if i dont attend an appointment i would like to think that she would call. I expected that I could have her email address but the management said no. dont know why.

Hope this helps and welcome to psychcentral

Do you expect your therapist to:

1) Be supportive and reassuring (if so, what does this mean)?
Yes, I do. I'm coming to therapy because i have problems i need help with. Life is rough out there as it is, so yes, when i come to therapy, i expect my t to treat me in a reassuring, gentle way.

2) Engage in conversation (as opposed to just listening)?
Yes. My t has never just sat there in silence, and i would not like it if she did that.

3) Disclose alot of personal stuff, especially stuff that makes it hard for you to relate?
No. My t very rarely discloses anything about her personal life. When she has disclosed, it has been directly related to my problem or situation in some way, like if she'd been through something similar.

4) Call back in a timely manner (and what is timely?)
My abandonment fears get triggered really easily, and this is one area that my t knows is touchy for me. 95% of the time she replies the same day, and 75% of the time within a couple of hours.

5) Try to stay connected with you (and how?)
I think she does try to stay connected with me by being kind and showing genuine personal interest. But I'm a hard person to get close to. I've told her many, many times how much i need to feel close with her. It's a main theme in my therapy. But when given the opportunity to connect with her, I often react defensively, can't allow myself to take in the good feelings, or the connected feeling turns into anxiety because then i fear losing the relationship down the road.

If i had the experience you are having in therapy, i would definitely change therapists. No question about it. But that's me. I know you need to decide what's right for you.