The Darker Side of Therapy (Dealing with Therapy Dependence)

AAAAA · Sep 25, 2009, 11:17 PM

I would like to thank you Christina for the thread. I've often wanted to ask people what they expected from therapy/therapist but I haven't figured out how to verbalize the question without it sounding offensive.

My own experience/expectation with therapy has been that I was going to a medical professional to seek advice and guidance. I expected him to interpret body language and different tells to assist me in getting to a place of better understanding and learn coping skills.

What a fine and scarey line some therapist must walk.

crystalrose · Sep 26, 2009, 03:58 AM

i thought the article was quite patronizing and rude. It made me angry to read it. Prob just me though. I thought that she was out of touch with how complex the issue is and should have more empathy when writing. IMO therapists foster dependence then complain when it becomes am issue. They also are not equipped to deal with the intensity of such dependence.

crystalrose · Sep 26, 2009, 04:00 AM

oh yeah also someone commented that bpd is the same as complex ptsd. Pft. WRONG! COMPLETELY!

Brightheart · Sep 26, 2009, 07:15 AM

I had no problems with the article itself...it was the generalized flippant attitude of it that irked me. I'm sure some of what she wrote has a ring of truth in some therapeutic relationships, but I didn't care for her approach to the discussion.

My main beef would have been the line about the therapist role-playing during therapy. That is not my perception of what took place during my therapy. I would say it's more about the therapist trying to discover particular qualities in themselves that their client needs. In fact, that is exactly how I think the relationship becomes reciprocal on some level. The client ellicits positive qualities out of the therapist. The therapist is bound to have positive feelings both through helping their client and from discovering the capacity for that particular quality within themselves. So clients give back during the sessions and help themselves at the same time. Interaction and response from both individuals and all of the variables involved. Sometimes the best way to ellicit caring feelings from another person is by letting them take care of you. I don't see therapy as an acting performance by therapists. Believing that to be truthful may be a method of keeping the actual relationship less intimate and at a comfortable distance. I personally believe in the truth and genuineness of this relationship. I believe it is more challenging to allow oneself inside the intimacy and still know that you must respect the other person's boundaries. Restrained intimacy. It's very powerful stuff and not something one would want to avoid by telling oneself the whole experience is just a performance.

Christina, I can't speak for anyone else here, but I certainly don't mind getting set off by things I read sometimes. It's another experience for me to explore things within myself so I find my reactions kind of fascinating as well. And having a place to discuss all of that is very valuable and pretty cool. I'd much rather do that here then on the blog comments. Thanks for putting this thread back.

BlueMoon6 · Sep 26, 2009, 09:51 AM

This article was was triggering for me. But I want to say I am NOT upset at all that it was posted. It confirmed what I already knew about the attitude of some therapists- or at least one that I know of. It could have been written by my current therapist, flippant attitude and all. The way I see her attitude is suck it up, your really dont need me that badly, your a grown woman with children, go back to your life and cut it out. She ignores my transference and seems to be irritated by what it brings up for me. With this attitude I dont feel safe talking to her about difficult feelings, no less bringing up how I feel about her. Since I know this really is the way she feels, what good will it do me to have a closure appointment with her? I'll be pissed I paid for more of the same.

If I really thought all therapists were role-playing and not authentic with me, I wouldnt bother. My t is doing quite a bit of role-playing with me. It is really hurtful. The author is a therapist, right? She is burnt out.

This article was triggering for me because I am going through exactly that- I have a therapist with exactly that attitude and I have had enough insensitivity. Maybe I'll read it next year with different eyes and have a good laugh.

chaotic13 · Sep 26, 2009, 11:10 AM

I see my therapist kind of in line with what Brightheart wrote. In the beginning I was very distrustful of therapy and had the perspective that my T was just role playing and pretending to care. Now I see things a bit differently (most of the time). I don't think my T is role playing, she does care maybe a little on a personal level but certainly on a professional level. I see her as using her unique skills and knowledge to help me learn a bit more about who I am and use this knowledge to accept and possibly enhance my life.

I think I am somewhat dependent on therapy as a modality that helps me interpret and see things that are tough for me to look at. I am at the moment dependent on my T as a place to release emotions and energy that I don't know what to do with, stuff that I don't really understand yet, but don't want to re-bury. I don't know if this is a bad or unhealthy kind of dependency that might lead me to some obsessive type of behavior. I hope not.

ECHOES · Sep 26, 2009, 02:31 PM

To me, "therapy "dependence" sounds like diminishing the value of therapy or the therapy relationship. Separately, dependency is an issue in itself and can be worked on in therapy

Role playing does not mean acting without feeling. I think the term can mean different things to different people. For example, I am a mom and there were times when I was raising my son that I responded/reacted from the 'mom' part of me because that's what he needed. It was a real and loving response in a real and loving relationship, but I can see that it could be defined as role playing because at that time that I responded, or chose how to respond, I was aware of that one of my many roles that included sister, daughter, granddaughter, friend, neighbor, employee... and today that includes other roles such as PC community member....

BlueMoon6 · Sep 26, 2009, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ECHOES

To me, "therapy "dependence" sounds like diminishing the value of therapy or the therapy relationship. Separately, dependency is an issue in itself and can be worked on in therapy

Role playing does not mean acting without feeling. I think the term can mean different things to different people. For example, I am a mom and there were times when I was raising my son that I responded/reacted from the 'mom' part of me because that's what he needed. It was a real and loving response in a real and loving relationship, but I can see that it could be defined as role playing because at that time that I responded, or chose how to respond, I was aware of that one of my many roles that included sister, daughter, granddaughter, friend, neighbor, employee... and today that includes other roles such as PC community member....

Very interesting Echoes! Do you think that is how the author meant it? I could have been projecting my hurt feelings from my t onto this author! I imagined the author to mean that the relationship was without genuineness or value to the therapist. A role she steps into and out of when in/out of work. I mean, I guess that is what a therapist would do, but I did see a t for 10 yrs who absolutely was in therapy who he was out of therapy and the relationships he had with his clients reflected that.

jexa · Sep 26, 2009, 04:58 PM

I've been reading this thread but hadn't posted yet because this is a very emotional issue for me! I sort of have trouble with getting obsessed with certain people, authority figures.

Actually thinking about this is making me want to cry. I'm scared of the fact that I like my T so much, I don't want her to reject me, I can't feel that way again.

I've only seen her for 6 sessions so far. She's on vacation this week and it's been really hard. Is that normal, so soon in our relationship? I haven't called or anything, but I keep thinking and thinking about her. I don't want to think about her so much! I just want a normal secure relationship with her! I'm angry with myself for not being more in control of my thoughts.

I don't know if this is too obsessed: I looked her up using pipl.com. On this site, her address was listed. The high school she went to. Her birthday. Her parents' names. Her sister's name. Her husband's name. The fact that her father died many years ago, when she was 14. Her thesis. I read her thesis twice. I know where she lives but I don't go to her house or stalk her. But the site did have a link to Google Maps and I saw a street-view picture of her house. I know which car's hers when I go to sessions and once I walked over and looked in it -- she had some books in the backseat, and a carseat. I look at her website all the time.

I'm afraid of what she will think of me if I tell her! Right now I feel like we work well together, that she really likes me and I really like her and she sees me in a good light, as a worthwhile person who just happens to be stuck on an issue. If I tell her this will it change our relationship?

I know I would tell someone else to just suck it up and talk about it straight up.. but I don't know if I'm too obsessed.. what if it alarms her?

Brightheart · 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ECHOES

Role playing does not mean acting without feeling. I think the term can mean different things to different people. For example, I am a mom and there were times when I was raising my son that I responded/reacted from the 'mom' part of me because that's what he needed. It was a real and loving response in a real and loving relationship, but I can see that it could be defined as role playing because at that time that I responded, or chose how to respond, I was aware of that one of my many roles that included sister, daughter, granddaughter, friend, neighbor, employee... and today that includes other roles such as PC community member....

Of course that is exactly what therapists do, but I really do not care for the choice of wording the author used. It feels cold and distant. I just feel a lot of dimishing of my feelings time and time again when the subject of the relationship is written about. The mocking attitude (my perception) of this article to me is like a defense mechanism. It's easier to treat this like it's a funny game, but this is serious stuff. I'd like to write my own article one day...from the perspective of the other side of the room. I understand that my reaction to this goes back to my need to protect my family from when I was a child, but what is the purpose of distancing ourselves from this relationship? Why not face it and acknowledge it for the very special and unique type of relationship that it is? Why diminish it? Why downplay it? Why make it less than it is? For whose comfort is that? This can be a very intimate and beautiful relationship. It's limited and different but it is very special as well. I never had unrealistic expectations or desires within my relationship with my T. I always respected the relationship and knew what it was. I also love my therapist. One can do both.

Okay. All of that being said, I do understand the author's point. But, again, I just question why she made this into a joke. I agree that there are times when one simply needs to be able to laugh at oneself, but not here...not about care and love and not about another's pain and suffering.

I never ever mean to say anything disrespectful. I'm just writing out my personal feelings about this. I also don't question that dependency is a real issue in some therapeutic relationships and that has to be addressed. I just wish these matters were treated a bit more sensitively.

BlueMoon6 · Sep 26, 2009, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jexa

I've been reading this thread but hadn't posted yet because this is a very emotional issue for me! I sort of have trouble with getting obsessed with certain people, authority figures.

Actually thinking about this is making me want to cry. I'm scared of the fact that I like my T so much, I don't want her to reject me, I can't feel that way again.

I've only seen her for 6 sessions so far. She's on vacation this week and it's been really hard. Is that normal, so soon in our relationship? I haven't called or anything, but I keep thinking and thinking about her. I don't want to think about her so much! I just want a normal secure relationship with her! I'm angry with myself for not being more in control of my thoughts.

I don't know if this is too obsessed: I looked her up using pipl.com. On this site, her address was listed. The high school she went to. Her birthday. Her parents' names. Her sister's name. Her husband's name. The fact that her father died many years ago, when she was 14. Her thesis. I read her thesis twice. I know where she lives but I don't go to her house or stalk her. But the site did have a link to Google Maps and I saw a street-view picture of her house. I know which car's hers when I go to sessions and once I walked over and looked in it -- she had some books in the backseat, and a carseat. I look at her website all the time.

I'm afraid of what she will think of me if I tell her! Right now I feel like we work well together, that she really likes me and I really like her and she sees me in a good light, as a worthwhile person who just happens to be stuck on an issue. If I tell her this will it change our relationship?

I know I would tell someone else to just suck it up and talk about it straight up.. but I don't know if I'm too obsessed.. what if it alarms her?

Jexa- There was a thread, or some posts about therapist stalking. I think we all have done similar things and it seems to me that you are not going overboard. Personally, I would not go as far as to say all of that to my t b/c I think it would alarm her and she would not really know how far I was going to take it.

The relationship between therapist and client/patient seems to be such an intense, complex thing. I have read others here talk about how the obsession subsides as the relationship progresses. My relationship with my t was nothing but frustrating, so I clung to any bit of info or warmness I could get ahold of. Im interested to hear what others have to say.

Sep 26, 2009, 07:23 PM

((((((((((((((((((((jexa)))))))))))))))))))))

Early in therapy, I felt almost obsessed with my T too. It really hit me out of nowhere, because it isn't a usual pattern for me... I think there is just something unique about the client/therapist relationship that can bring up all kinds of things.

I did google my T a bit, and look at the website for his church, and things like that. I ended up telling him about it, and he said I was making sure I was safe. He totally accepted it, and understood it.

I've been with him for almost 2 years, and the obsession is (finally! lol) gone. I wish I could say how I got from point A to point B...but somehow, I'm here. I bet you will get here too. I think what you're feeling is really normal.

to you!

rainbow8 · Sep 26, 2009, 11:57 PM

jexa--

I have a lot of experience with obsession for my T. Everyone is different; some people have a harder time managing their relationship with their T than others. I looked up everything about my T right away, like you. I did tell her, though, and I would suggest that you tell your T. She probably won't be surprised, and it will be helpful for her to know your reactions. It's something that you can discuss--reasons why you feel the need to obsess about her.

The goal is to have a secure attachment toward your T without the need to obsess about her. You haven't seen her long enough to do that yet. You said you have this pattern with other authority figures. That's something worth discussing in your therapy. I have this pattern also, though not just with authority figures.

As to when the obsession will subside, I don't think there's any one answer. It took me a very long time because the obsession was really my biggest therapy issue. But it WILL get better. I don't know if this fits for you, but my T thought I did those obsessive things in an attempt to get closer to her. It was a safe way for me, though not a very effective way. She told me I could just ask her what I wanted to know about her instead. I couldn't do that, though. It was scary to become close to her. Obsession was easier, more comfortable, and not scary for me.

I don't know if that fits for you or not.

Regarding role playing: I never felt that my T was playing a role. If anything, she was TOO real with me. She was always authentic, never a blank slate. I guess I have to reread the article since I didn't consider it flippant or funny.

Brightheart · 02:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rainbow8

I guess I have to reread the article since I didn't consider it flippant or funny.

It was the line about walking off hand in hand toward the quintessential sunset or wanting your therapist to adopt you that ruined the entire article for me. That was the flippant part. Basically it portrays someone loving their T as being "silly" or "ridiculous"...or at least that's what I got out of that. You know, as if I were dancing around my house writing my therapist love poems or something...which isn't how it has been at all. I know I'm over-sensitive about this stuff, though. She just posted another blog about falling in love with your therapist. Maybe I should stay away, but I know I won't be able to.

I don't know, imagine that you'd had this treasure that you'd worked on building (like with my sand castle metaphor) and it really represented the very best in you and others came along and laughed at it, kicked it down and called you stupid for cherishing it so much. That's what reading those 2 lines felt like. I'm sure it's some kind of transference reaction from me as well. Maybe even a double one. The protecting love thing and from being teased and unaccepted by the other kids whenever I tried to express a deep and sentimental part of myself. I really like the part of me that loves T. I don't want to squash it.

I didn't mean to ignore your concerns, Jexa. I was in the middle of the I've-been-triggered-and-have tunnel-vision-right-now method of post reading. I'm sorry I mised your post.

On the plus side, the word transference doesn't seem to set me off anymore. I keep trying...

jexa · Sep 27, 2009, 02:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rainbow8

It was scary to become close to her. Obsession was easier, more comfortable, and not scary for me.

That. Is exactly the thing. Exactly the problem, and the pattern. I don't actually want to be close to these people. I want to intellectualize them, and keep them on their faraway pedestals. Worship is easier than trust.

.. My T does acceptance and commitment therapy (ACT). She normally does CBT but she's doing ACT with me. Not psychodynamically trained and probably not that interested in what the relationship has to do with my problem. But I can try. She may be willing to discuss it. At the very least I probably need her help with this.. it's a long-standing pattern and has always given me trouble! She's pretty warm and open, though, and so far she's been very intuitive to my needs for each session.

I don't know, I'm scared to death of scaring her but everyone seems to be saying this is pretty normal. I know "transference" is normal but I feel like all the looking up stuff might scare her a bit. I'll try to tone it down but I have a problem of being too honest when I try to speak the truth.

Thanks rainbow.

sunrise · Sep 27, 2009, 03:34 AM

Jexa, some have suggested you talk to your therapist about this. That is one way to go, but not what I did. I became very attached to my therapist very early on, within weeks. I thought something must be wrong with me. Things seemed to be getting more intense with my feelings after a few months. What I did was do some reading (I recommend the book "In Session: the bond between women and their therapists"), joined PC and lurked and read people's posts. I discovered from the book and this board that my feelings were not unusual. As time passed, this "obsessive" phase lessened. My therapist and I settled into a very close and comfortable relationship. So the "troubling" phase passed on its own, as our relationship became more established and we got to know each other better. I never had to have a big "tell all" conversation with my therapist during this early period. I never had to "work this out" with him. It just naturally worked itself out. Yes, we have certainly talked about our relationship since then, and how close we are, how much we have shared, and how much we seem to be in sync. But we never had an "I am obsessed with you" conversation early in therapy.

Maybe this wait and see approach won't work for you. But maybe it will. It seems like you feel things are pretty intense right now, after 6 weeks of therapy. Why not just go with the flow, read some books to reassure yourself you're normal, and see where you are at in a few months? By then, you may be over this phase. If not, re-evaluate and then talk to your therapist about the ongoing situation.

Anyway, just wanted to lay out an alternative for you, Jexa. Good luck.

BlueMoon6 · Sep 27, 2009, 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brightheart

It was the line about walking off hand in hand toward the quintessential sunset or wanting your therapist to adopt you that ruined the entire article for me. That was the flippant part. Basically it portrays someone loving their T as being "silly" or "ridiculous"...or at least that's what I got out of that. You know, as if I were dancing around my house writing my therapist love poems or something...which isn't how it has been at all. I know I'm over-sensitive about this stuff, though. She just posted another blog about falling in love with your therapist. Maybe I should stay away, but I know I won't be able to.

I agree completey BH. I feel mocked by that line. Tha author is mocking the relationship for me that is unlike any other in my life. And probably the healthiest relatioship I have.

Quote:

I don't know, imagine that you'd had this treasure that you'd worked on building (like with my sand castle metaphor) and it really represented the very best in you and others came along and laughed at it, kicked it down and called you stupid for cherishing it so much. That's what reading those 2 lines felt like. I'm sure it's some kind of transference reaction from me as well. Maybe even a double one. The protecting love thing and from being teased and unaccepted by the other kids whenever I tried to express a deep and sentimental part of myself. I really like the part of me that loves T. I don't want to squash it.

I think it is a very valid reaction- why should you (or anyone) be teased about loving someone who cares, protects and listens to you? Because it is your therapist? Maybe the author is unaware that she mocks her own feelings?

Quote:

I didn't mean to ignore your concerns, Jexa. I was in the middle of the I've-been-triggered-and-have tunnel-vision-right-now method of post reading. I'm sorry I mised your post.

Cant blame you for that tunnel vision, I feel the same.
I havent ever seen this person's blog, but does she say anthing about having a therapist of her own? Even if she doesnt have/need that kind of relationship with her t, it is mean to mock others that do. IMO

Quote:

On the plus side, the word transference doesn't seem to set me off anymore. I keep trying...

Sep 27, 2009, 08:02 AM

Ugh, I had a long post and then lost it.

jexa

Those feelings are hard, I can relate. I tend to feel the need to find out anything and everything about someone who comes along who may fill that alter-mother role for me, T being no exception. I haven't yet told T about this - like you, I'm scared to death that I'll scare T. I really couldn't handle it right now if T decided to terminate me. But I do think that Sunny has a point - for me, I found these things out about T in order to trust her more. Should I have asked her instead of being sneaky online? Absolutely. But right now, I really need T - I had a really rough week, and I'm feeling too fragile to discuss this with T right now. Maybe one day, I will bring it up with T for discussion. Or maybe I won't feel the need to do it when our relationship continues to grow and change.

I think you should do what you feel comfortable doing, and what you think will benefit you most.

deliquesce · Sep 27, 2009, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dreamseeker9

Should I have asked her instead of being sneaky online?

trust is such a huge issue for me that i dont think asking face to face would have allayed my concerns. i needed "independent" verification.

i think i started one of the (many!) threads on net 'stalking', but i really dont feel guilty about it. i am not doing it to be malicious, invade someone's privacy or hurt them. i am doing it because it is my imperfect way of trying to remove a block from therapy - unless there is a basic level of trust, i won't be able to give what is required.

i know it's not perfect, but it is what it is. anyone here who knows my full name would be able to find out much more about me than i did about pdoc/Austin-T. i think it's just a fact of the world we live in, and it's up to the individual to take precautions against that should they be uncomfortable with certain information about them being "out there" for all to see.

Sep 27, 2009, 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peaches100

I believe that I am “not attached enough.”
Because I didn’t get my emotional needs met in childhood, I have an empty, yearning, needing place inside me. And, having not had my needs met, I have never had the experience of being securely attached. So I am empty in some respects and lacking a very important developmental step I should have learned and experienced in childhood (being nurtured, cared for, learning to trust in that care, attaching in a secure way, and eventually being able to bring all of those good caring feelings/actions together inside me to help form secure attachment with myself and the ability to take care of my own needs).
Until I learn the necessary things. . .the ability to trust, to allow nurturing, to take in the caring feelings and learn to attach securely to my t. . .I am going to continue having that empty place inside me and yearn for what I’ve missed. I am also going to have a very difficult (if not impossible) time understanding my emotions and meeting my own needs. I am going to struggle trying to nurture myself because I have no frame of reference – I don’t know what it feels like. Therefore, I am trying to give to myself that which I’ve never felt before. Further, until I learn these necessary things in my relationship with my t, I will continue to harbor fear and distrust which makes true connectedness with others impossible. I probably haven’t explained this very well.
It irks me when I read or hear statements that that it is bad, wrong, or unhealthy to become dependent on a t. . .that it’s something to exorcise. And I think this belief comes partly from our Western culture that puts such an emphasis on independence. Needing, asking for, and accepting help are viewed as weaknesses. We are all supposed to be these rugged individualists who are towers of strength. We are not allowed to be “human” and to have human needs for attachment and connection. And I think it’s sad, Sad,
Personally, that’s what caused my traumas in the first place – growing up as a child and not having help when I needed it. The idea that I should cut out the dependency I feel with my t and handle my problems myself (when, in fact, I believe that I need help with my problems) only serves to reinforce the same message I got as a child. . .I SHOULD NOT NEED HELP. I MUST SUFFER IN PAIN ALONE.

This is so brilliantly said...I feel so much validation just reading it...I was just at the beginning of allowing myself to feel my therapist's caring for me when she was snatched away from me 4 months ago...I have had to work really hard at not giving up in total despair. The good news is I will probably see her again in a few weeks. Not going to say more about that, because I don't want to jinx things by being too glad too soon!
Thank you so much Peaches for putting words to my experience of myself.

jexa · Sep 27, 2009, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sunrise

Jexa, some have suggested you talk to your therapist about this. That is one way to go, but not what I did. I became very attached to my therapist very early on, within weeks. I thought something must be wrong with me. Things seemed to be getting more intense with my feelings after a few months. What I did was do some reading (I recommend the book "In Session: the bond between women and their therapists"), joined PC and lurked and read people's posts. I discovered from the book and this board that my feelings were not unusual. As time passed, this "obsessive" phase lessened. My therapist and I settled into a very close and comfortable relationship. So the "troubling" phase passed on its own, as our relationship became more established and we got to know each other better. I never had to have a big "tell all" conversation with my therapist during this early period. I never had to "work this out" with him. It just naturally worked itself out. Yes, we have certainly talked about our relationship since then, and how close we are, how much we have shared, and how much we seem to be in sync. But we never had an "I am obsessed with you" conversation early in therapy.

Maybe this wait and see approach won't work for you. But maybe it will. It seems like you feel things are pretty intense right now, after 6 weeks of therapy. Why not just go with the flow, read some books to reassure yourself you're normal, and see where you are at in a few months? By then, you may be over this phase. If not, re-evaluate and then talk to your therapist about the ongoing situation.

Anyway, just wanted to lay out an alternative for you, Jexa. Good luck.

Thanks sunrise. Enough's going on right now that I don't think my obsession with her is my most pressing issue anyway.. maybe I can put it off for a while and see if I can get over it. I like that alternative -- I really, really don't want to scare her. I know that tree was able to just let it subside on its own, like you.. and she probably isn't going to want to talk too much about "us" yet. I wish I would stop thinking about her but there are other things going on too.

Brightheart · Sep 27, 2009, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueMoon6

I havent ever seen this person's blog, but does she say anthing about having a therapist of her own?

Yes, I believe she's had the same therapist for more than 10 years. So maybe she meant only to mock herself, but it just came across to me as generally sarcastic to anyone who might have had feelings for their T.

Jexa, I really honestly think that curiosity is a normal thing in the beginning of relationships. Maybe, in time, the need to know things about her will ease as your security within the relationships grows.

BlueMoon6 · Sep 27, 2009, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peaches

Originally Posted by peaches100

The Darker Side of Therapy (Dealing with Therapy Dependence)

I believe that I am “not attached enough.”
Because I didn’t get my emotional needs met in childhood, I have an empty, yearning, needing place inside me. And, having not had my needs met, I have never had the experience of being securely attached. So I am empty in some respects and lacking a very important developmental step I should have learned and experienced in childhood (being nurtured, cared for, learning to trust in that care, attaching in a secure way, and eventually being able to bring all of those good caring feelings/actions together inside me to help form secure attachment with myself and the ability to take care of my own needs).
Until I learn the necessary things. . .the ability to trust, to allow nurturing, to take in the caring feelings and learn to attach securely to my t. . .I am going to continue having that empty place inside me and yearn for what I’ve missed. I am also going to have a very difficult (if not impossible) time understanding my emotions and meeting my own needs. I am going to struggle trying to nurture myself because I have no frame of reference – I don’t know what it feels like. Therefore, I am trying to give to myself that which I’ve never felt before. Further, until I learn these necessary things in my relationship with my t, I will continue to harbor fear and distrust which makes true connectedness with others impossible. I probably haven’t explained this very well.
It irks me when I read or hear statements that that it is bad, wrong, or unhealthy to become dependent on a t. . .that it’s something to exorcise. And I think this belief comes partly from our Western culture that puts such an emphasis on independence. Needing, asking for, and accepting help are viewed as weaknesses. We are all supposed to be these rugged individualists who are towers of strength. We are not allowed to be “human” and to have human needs for attachment and connection. And I think it’s sad, Sad,
Personally, that’s what caused my traumas in the first place – growing up as a child and not having help when I needed it. The idea that I should cut out the dependency I feel with my t and handle my problems myself (when, in fact, I believe that I need help with my problems) only serves to reinforce the same message I got as a child. . .I SHOULD NOT NEED HELP. I MUST SUFFER IN PAIN ALONE.

i also want to quote this. It is so insightful and profound. I want to print it out. It explains why I feel so invalidated by my t. That the distance adds fuel to a fire that caused the problem in the first place. There was no secure attachment and I wasnt given the inner strenght to help myself. Even shreds of attention cause me to hold onto something that really isnt there in the hope that this empty place might be filled, there might be some short relief from the desire for attachment. Would a warmer t still be an illusion of love? Or would it be healing for me? Would I feel the emptiness in an even more painful way when I realized the warmer t is still just my t? I think it makes me wonder/afraid of the warmth and caring of a different kind of t.

Sep 27, 2009, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueMoon6

Would I feel the emptiness in an even more painful way when I realized the warmer t is still just my t? I think it makes me wonder/afraid of the warmth and caring of a different kind of t.

(((((((((((Blue)))))))))))

To be honest, this was the most crushingly painful thing in therapy for me. T's caring for me made me feel the absence of all of the caring I should have had growing up in the biggest, most breathtaking, painful way. Looking back, I really think feeling that pain was part of what I needed in order to heal. It doesn't hurt anymore...I love that T takes care of me, and while it doesn't take the place of what I didn't get, it does feel really good to be getting what I'm getting now. The pain was worth it, and I made it to the other side. You will too.

BlueMoon6 · Sep 27, 2009, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by treehouse

(((((((((((Blue)))))))))))

To be honest, this was the most crushingly painful thing in therapy for me. T's caring for me made me feel the absence of all of the caring I should have had growing up in the biggest, most breathtaking, painful way. Looking back, I really think feeling that pain was part of what I needed in order to heal. It doesn't hurt anymore...I love that T takes care of me, and while it doesn't take the place of what I didn't get, it does feel really good to be getting what I'm getting now. The pain was worth it, and I made it to the other side. You will too.

Thanks Tree- That is how I know I will feel. I feel it even with the shreds of attention and caring I get from my t. I am afraid it will hurt too much with a warm therpsit who cares for me. Even a nice word in the session will make me cry. That has happened with desk t. At what point did it not hurt so much? And WHY do you think it stopped being so painful? For me, the pain of thinking someone cares doesnt have an end. Usually I dont trust or believe I am cared for. That protects me from the pain of being cared for.

I will bring all of this up to ftt. Since I dont know her well, it will be really hard. I feel like I have to hit the ground running b/c I have so much going on. Talking about all of this is taking a big risk in terms of being vulnerable with a t I dont know, but maybe it will help me trust her and feel safe with her. Or I could feel like I made a mistake.

I just printed out this page of the thread (6 pages on my printer!). Everything here is exactly what I want to say.

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