The Reality of the T Relationship

Hi All,

Ever since my meltdown about my t being too busy, I've been trying to understand why it hurt me so much and continues to hurt me. It's no revelation that it triggers my feelings from childhood of being unimportant/not worth paying attention to. And my t tends to point out the problem as being mostly about my issues/feelings about my parents, rather than the hurt actually being about her. While i think that she is partly right (at least that when she can't reply, it triggers "old stuff"), I think it is more than that. The other part of it has very much to do with the therapy relationship.

When i email my t about something related to therapy that i feel really strongly about or that is meaningful to me, i guess i assume that she thinks it is important and wants to know about it too. Especially recently, when we'd had a very unusual -- and what i thought was a breakthrough -- session. Because the session had been so signficant to me, i thought she would also think so. I thought she would want to reply to my message about it. In fact, i thought she would be looking for my message on purpose because i had finally admitted my anger toward my parents and let the pain pour out, which i had not been able to do for years. And also because she had comforted me physically, which i had needed for a very long time but she had been relucant to do because of my past SA. So it was a breakthrough session. And i wrongly assumed she'd want to know if i managed OK after the session, or if guilt and shame had started crowding in.

The reality was, she was so busy attending to other patients that she chose not to respond to me, even though she could easily have replied, "Got your message. I'm swamped now, but we'll talk Wednesday." In the past when she was busy, she had almost always at least acknowledged receiving my message. On the couple of occasions when she didn't, i felt very hurt and we'd had to devote a couple of sessions to working through the hurt. So considering the breakthrough session, and the fact the she knows how much it tears me up when she doesn't reply to a message, i still can't understand why she chose not to spend the 30 seconds it would have taken to at least acknowledge me. Because it happened directly after a session where i'd felt connected and cared for, it hurt and made me question the importance of our therapy relationship.

The more i think about it, the more i believe that the problem is that i put more significance on the relationship i have with my t than she does. Because i've never had anybody in my life listen and care about the hurt parts of me, or help me with my deep problems, i value the relationship i have with her. In many ways, it feels like love (strictly platonic maternal stuff). Because our relationship is so significant to me, i forget that she doesn't experience our relationship the same way i do. This is her job. Because she is with me on what feels like a deep, life-changing journey, it feels like our relationship is unique ane special. But I forget that she is on a similar life-changing journey with all of her patients, and what i have with her is not so unique for her, perhaps even commonplace.

When i email my t about something that feels so meaningful, but she chooses not to acknowledge it, I'm starkly reminded that this is a business relationship where i pay her to spend time with me for an hour. Outside that time slot, she is busy with other people who are paying her to spend similar time with them. Even though my t usually makes the effort to reply, the truth is that she doesn't have time to think about me or read about my life and feelings once i close the door to her office. Each time this realization hits me, it hurts. To have it happen right after such a significant session stabs me in the heart.

I know she cares about me, probably as much as she can while staying objective. But i care about the relationship more. There are parts of me that feel like they are coming to life and learning to live for the first time, with her help. The work we are doing is deep, and I have attached to her. It isn't possible for me to do this type of work in therapy with her for 10 years and see the relationship as strictly a business relationship. But it is. All of these realities hurt.

Sometimes, realities hit too hard, and all i can do is emotionally disconnect, roll into a ball, and hide from everybody and the world until acceptance comes. But acceptance is hard. Every few weeks, i hit up against a wall and get my feelings hurt, and retreat again to lick my wounds. I wish i didn't "feel" so much. It seems that i am too sensitive for this world.

((((((((((((((((( peaches ))))))))))))))))))

FWIW, here is something I have worked out myself, through the many painful ruptures T and I have had (many based on this kind of nonreply from T...)

The therapeutic alliance is different from any other kind of relationship. It doesn't seem reasonable that each of the two people should be involved in different ways, and to different degrees. But that is necessary to the two (very different) functions of each of the parties. The relationship is not one of equals and is not equal on either side of the room.

the T's position is so different from the caring of a friend; different from the caring of a mother, and (hear this) different from a strictly business relationship. The client's position requires a lot more personal involvement and I would wonder that any healing could occur if there were no personal involvement...

It's a heck of a system but somehow it seems that "the process" works, even through this temporary relationship (even 10 yrs is temporary over a lifetime). But strictly a business relationship? I imagine hiring a stranger who is not trained in T, to hear my difficulties and help me to struggle through them to grow and heal; I guarantee they would run screaming on the first day, or on the second day would tell me off and then walk out. your T will never do that. T is the trained guide. and she HAS to be a step back from every client; if she cared in the way you do, and as much as you do, about every client she would burn out in a flash. But it's not as if she doesn't care, either I don't see that this kind of work can be done without caring, otherwise you end up with someone like BlueMoon's
"desk T".

No doubt about it - your T should have called you back. That's not too much to ask and I sure understand how upsetting it can be when it doesn't happen - my own T and I have gone around about this many times. I hope that the two of you can discuss the relationship at length, even though it may be painful, and come to a new understanding (on both sides!!)
sorry you are hurting

One saying that helped me understand the T relationship enormously was:

"Your therapy should be the most important thing in your life but it is not the most important thing in your therapist's life."

Think about it. Your T has her own, regular, day-to-day life and other clients and is a T, not you, the client, etc.

That helped give me a bigger view of things and allowed me to concentrate on "me" in therapy instead of what my therapist was saying/doing. If my T's timing was different than I wanted, I immediately gave her the benefit of the doubt, that she was busy rather than that she was deliberately trying to hurt me, etc. Most of what a T does has nothing whatsoever to do with us, individually, except during that hour we are with her. I use to write my T letters daily/weekly and mail them to her office and, over time, I came to realize that my enjoyment of imagining her reading them and "caring" for me in that way, was just that, my imagining. I could not see her reading them, we did not discuss what was in the writings, there was nothing of "her" in them at all, it was all me and what I imagined. I finally forced myself to stop writing her at all (did a six-week trial which she and I discussed) and only "have" her when I actually did have her, during my sessions. I had to communicate with her then as that was "reality" and the only time our lives intersected.

Feelings are there, whether we feel we feel them or not :-) It could be you're getting a delayed thing going (feeling you're feeling something afterwards, when it safe; I use to take scary things from therapy so I could think about/feel them in my head when I was alone, at my home afterwards). For me, my T taught me to identify different feelings, she "gave" me one to think about at the end of a session, "humiliation" and then "disappointment" and, almost funny, all week I was keyed in on humiliation (I felt humiliated, in public, by a boss complaining loudly in the middle of the office and making fun of not understanding me and what I was trying to say) and I learned enormous good things (about anger too!) but at the end of the next session she gave me "disappointment" and I instantly asked, "Does this mean I have to be disappointed all week????!!!!" and we both were started at that and ended up laughing about it but, sure enough, I felt disappointed in my husband and again learned important lessons.

Our feelings are ours and are information and very valuable. Other people don't make us feel, we just feel; that's natural. But what we feel can help us understand ourselves and what we should do or say next (usually tell the other person, "I feel disappointed that you seem too busy to get back to me sooner"). Were that something I told my T, we would then concentrate on my disappointment, who has disappointed me in that way (by being too busy) before, etc.

A lot of how we feel is "habit". I was disappointed in my husband the day after my T gave me "disappointment" to consider, because he decided to go to the racetrack without doing the breakfast dishes first (his job). We discussed that and it turned out he didn't feel well, had a bad backache and thought that the chairs at the racetrack would be more comfortable for him and that he could distract himself with the game. Too, bending over to do the dishes was very painful for him. I then had to reconsider my disappointment. Why did I feel he should do the dishes right then? Why did I care about the dishes? That was my stepmother's teaching; I was raised with "do the dishes right after the meal." But that's just training/one way of doing things, neither better nor worse than any other way. A second thing I realized was I love my husband and wanted him to feel better. He knows his body and what might help him and if going to the racetrack might help him, I wanted him to go! So the whole incident turned out to be about me and convention, not even what I "wanted", just what was familiar and what had been drilled into me by my too-rigid stepmother. I personally want to become more flexible so I had a hard struggle with myself after my husband left trying to decide whether or not I wanted to do the dishes myself :-) It's his job versus why does it matter when it's done versus what did I really want to do with my time, for "me".

(((Peaches))) IDK...your probably right your therapy experience is much more important to you than it is to your T. But that doesn't mean your unimportant though. Or that your T doesn't care about how your doing.

I'm sorry your upset with your T...I still totally hate unanswered emails, but I think I get over them a little bit quicker now. One benefit I see in my own therapy is...at least now I know I'm upset. I'm able to figure out some of the reasons why I'm upset and at least admit it to myself. This to me...is progress. Not being numb anymore to these little hurts, sucks. But, not being numb to the little joys I experience in this relationship tends to balance things out.

I like these responses so far.

Peaches, I'm totally in your same boat. I think there's something basically wrong at the heart of the therapeutic relationship. For me it's just flawed right out of the gate. But I'm still in therapy! It's like what they say about democracy -- it's the worst form of government, except for all the others.

I think your T showed unusual sensitivity, though, for all the reasons you mentioned. You've got a right to be pissed off. I would react exactly the same way if that happened to me. Is she, what, just not paying attention? Sheesh!

So -- you'll probably get advice to talk about this during your next session. I would tell your T exactly how you feel about this! Don't let her off the hook!

It was hurting me enough that i broke down and emailed my t (after not emailing her all week or almost the week before). In my message, i told her pretty much what i said above in my post about the t relationship. Thankfully, this time she did reply to my email. But she said this:

T,
I'm sorry when you feel something is "off" between us because I don't experience the off part. Please don't make assumptions about what I am thinking or feeling because often they fuel your thinking and then your emotions of hurt and anger. It would be better if you asked me about it rather assuming something. Please also don't make any assumptions about my experience of this relationship. That is mind-reading and is often inaccurate. there are some other assumptions you have made about how I think or feel that we can address, but just know that can contribute to your distress when you base your emotions on inaccurate information.
thanks,
R

Do you think she sounds mad at me? Did i make assumptions about what she is thinking and feeling?

She sounds irritated, and her response is a little surprising in its vehemence. I don't think you made assumptions. You were just telling her how you felt, or so it seemed to me...

She is trying to teach you. She has given you "facts" and observations, "don't make assumptions about what I am thinking or feeling because often they fuel your thinking and then your emotions of hurt and anger" Even asking "do you think she sounds mad at me" is emphasizing the wrong person. Don't worry about what she is thinking/feeling, whether she is mad/happy/sad, only about your own experiences.

By asking US if she sounds mad, you are not talking to/dealing with her. She's the only one who knows how she feels! I can't tell you if she is mad, you cannot tell from what she asked if she is mad at you; there are no feelings there, only instructions, "please don't make assumptions about what I am thinking or feeling."

Please return folding trays and seat backs to the upright position, we are getting ready to land :-)

I would think about what she asked in her email and accept that since she sent you an email at all, she cares (at this very moment). Notice too, her beginning sentence, "I'm sorry when you feel something is "off" between us because I don't experience the off part." She shared with you how she was feeling :-) She does not feel disconnected from you.

This is exactly what i said in my email to her:

R,

I feel bad that you’re leaving town at a time when things feel “off” between us. I know it’s my own hurt feelings about the email thing. I appreciate that you were willing to talk to me about it. But it still hurts. I wish you had replied with, “Got your message. I’m swamped now but we’ll talk Wednesday.” You’ve done that before when you’ve been busy. A short message like that would have only taken 30 seconds. I understand that you feel you did not have that time, or that perhaps a reply was not really necessary.

I have decided that this whole problem stems from my wrong assumptions/expectations about our relationship. I had wrongly assumed that you would be more responsive to a message after our session that week -- because it had been unusual in that I’d unloaded so much pain and allowed you to comfort me. I thought you would want to know if I tolerated it OK, and if I’d been able to accept the anger and the comfort, or if I was struggling with guilt or shame. In reality, you were too busy to even think about me that day, and that’s where my expectations about our relationship were off.

I’ve never had a relationship like ours before. I attach so much significance to it. Because our relationship means so much to me and I think about you a lot outside sessions, I forget that you don’t experience our relationship the same way I do. This is your job. When things like this happen, I’m starkly reminded this is a business relationship where I pay you to spend time with me for an hour. Outside that time slot, you are busy with other people who are paying you to spend time with them. Even though you usually reply, the truth is, you don’t really have time to think about me or read about my life and feelings once I close the door to your office. Every time you are too busy to reply to my messages, I’m hit with this realization. To have it happen right after having had a session with you that felt so significant was/is hard to accept.

I know you care about me, probably as much as you can while staying objective. But I care about our relationship more. There are little parts of me that I feel are slowly learning to come alive again with your help. The work we are doing is deep, and they are attaching to you personally. It is not possible for me to do such intense work and not feel that the relationship is personal. It is hard to accept that it’s a business relationship. It is hard to grasp that our relationship only exists for 1 hour every week and needs to stop when I leave your office. It’s hard to comprehend that the special path we’re taking isn’t unique, even though it feels unique to me. The reality is that you are walking with lots of people down their special path too, and we are paying you to do it. All of these realities hurt.

Sometimes all parts can do is roll into a ball and hide from everybody and the world until they can accept things. I guess that is where they are right now.

Please don’t feel that you need to reply. I just wanted to let you know how I feel and am grateful for you taking the time to read it. We can talk tomorrow.

See you then,
T

Then i followed up with a short message saying that I am sorry if i expect too much from her. I think she is a beautiful person who works hard to help people. I also said i am sorry if i make her feel that she can't make mistakes or be human. I know i have made her feel that way in the past, and i hope she will forgive me. Her reply was to my first email. Nothing after that. For some reason, i'm not showing it in my outbox, so am not 100% sure she got it. But considering her busyness, i can't bother her again by resending it. that would annoy her more.

Can somebody shed light on what i said to her that was inappropriate/assuming that would have prompted her response to me?

What's so weird is that i thought i was admitting my own wrong assumptions to start with and that i was being realistic, painful as it was. But then she replied that i am making wrong assumptions about her.

i think im confused.

(((((((peaches))))))))

I've definitely been here before oh so many times. It's suffocating to have such a wonderful relationship with your T, only to realize that there are others that you have to share her with. A T has multiple clients, but each client only has one T, so it gets hard to deal with that sometimes. Let's be honest...most of us would like to think that after our hour each week, our Ts curl up and hibernate until our appointment time next week. We like to imagine that T is completely and solely devoted to us and our treatment. But the reality is, there are multiple people thinking that about the same person. It's really, really tough.

I would like to say, however, that you give your T something none of her other clients could ever give her: you give her YOU. Although it doesn't feel like this is a mutual journey, it is. You and your T are working through all of this together. Although it may seem like it at times, this is SO much more than just a business relationship. I'm sure she sees it that way as well.

I can definitely understand the hurt in her not responding to you. I'm much the same way. I freak out if my T calls me five minutes later than she said she would. I get absolutely paranoid, which brings on hurt in my own mind. I'm keep telling myself that she forgot about me, or that she's giving up on me, and of course, that make me freak myself out. I think that's what your T is referring to in the e-mail. I don't think she's mad at you at all. I think she was just trying to warn you about your own processes, and how they can contribute to some of your distress. I know it's hard, but try to talk to her before you assume how she's feeling. It'll definitely make things a lot easier on your mind.

I wish you the best in all of this, and don't hesitate to reach out if you ever need anything.

Sittingatwatersedge,

thanks for your post. i need to think on what you said.

If I read that from my T, I probably would be hurt. But, it is SO hard to tell tone over email. I think your T is just trying to let you know that when you start assuming without asking about how SHE feels, it just makes you sprial into worse and worse thoughts about it. I think that's why email can be such a difficult form of communication. I have emailed my T a few times, and always got back a short response, and never really addressing any of the feelings in the emails. I try really hard now to wait to talk in the session. I could write novels to my T about my feelings and thoughts, and then so much can actually get missed in the session. Its hard, I know. I doubt your T is mad at you, but just trying to re-frame your thoughts when you take a thought you think she has, and run with it.

Try to take what you are feeling from this and ask her directly next time to see her. Maybe it will help?

I don't think she sounds mad at you at all. She's using this as an occasion to teach you. She's talking about cognitive distortions that are getting you upset. She's asking you to use your skills. (That's the way my t talks to me all the time. It's a learning process.)

As she told you, you are engaging in so much mind-reading behavior. You are assuming you understand how she feels about your relationship. She replied by reminding you that you cannot read her mind. You need to realize see that. You put so much emphasis on what you assume to be true.

Hi Peaches,
I'm sorry you are hurting so much.

I just want to say, I thought your email to T was really great. Very honest and perceptive.

Also, I agree with Farmergirl - I don't think your T sounded mad at you at all in her response.
I hope you can get this cleared up with her. When is your next appointment?


Oh, and I'm editing this because I just went back and read Perna's post and I agree with it 100%.
Perna - very good insights and way of putting things!

Peaches, I would feel hurt by this email too, but I definitely don't think your T is angry or means anything by this email. I think she is trying to help. But, I see where you're coming from -- I HATE these CBT labels for my thoughts. Labelling my thoughts as "mind-reading" or "catastrophizing" or whatever was TOTALLY invalidating to me and made me feel worse than I did just having the thought and believing it. Is your T a CBT therapist? Does she usually say things like this?

In a way, think about what she's saying though -- if she says you are "mind-reading," then something about how you said you perceived the relationship is not the way she sees it, right? That is a good thing, peaches, because you're seeing this disconnect, and you feel like she doesn't have time to think about you outside of session, and maybe it's *quite* the opposite for her.

peaches - i think there is a sticky called "cognitive distortions" or something at the top of this forum. if you read over it, you'll see that your T seems to have written her email to you from a very similar angle.

here is an example of an assumption you made about T: "you don’t really have time to think about me or read about my life and feelings once I close the door to your office."

how do you know this, peaches? unless you've asked T, then you don't really have any facts to back this judgement up. maybe i am odd, but i've always assumed that pdoc is too busy for deli, and so we're faced with the reverse situation of him trying to prove to me that he is a human too and our relationship extends beyond the therapy walls. e.g., he told me once when he was listening to the radio and a famous australian philosopher came on, and how he thought about me and wanted to tell me to listen to it. or how he worried about my family when one girl from my old school was murdered by her sister because he knew we would have known them well. or how sometimes when he hasn't heard from me in a few weeks how he wants to call and just check i'm going ok, but that he has to remind himself to sit inside the "psychiatrist" box and let the patient come to him.

sure, pdoc doesn't schedule extra time to think about me or anything, but i'm still important to him in my own way (although i also relate to where you're coming from: i sent him a txt yesterday and he didn't reply. of course i know think he hates me).

i think, like T said, it'd be good for you to discuss your email the next time you see her. maybe you could read through your email and try to rework it into questions? e.g., instead of your assumption above, change it into "do you ever think about me once i close the door to your office?", "do you think our relationship only exists in the one hour slot that i pay for?" etc.

Peaches - cognitive distortions or otherwise, it doesn't make it hurt any less (in my experience). I hope it is helping you to talk about it here.

Hi Peaches,

I am sorry this happened to you. My first response to this was that she responded with a "logical" response and gave very little validation to the emotions you were feeling. (Although I don't think she is upset with you at all.) Your email was about how you were feeling (backed up by your explanation of the therapeutic relationship as you see it), whereas her email had a very businesslike tone to it (if emails can have tones, which I guess they can't...but her wording was of a more impersonal nature, I think.)

And I guess I don't see how you COULDN'T make "assumptions"...you hadn't talked to her yet, you just knew she hadn't responded to you, and you felt hurt after feeling so connected to her in your previous session!

With that being said, I do think it was just an oversight on her part not to respond back to you, and her email seems somewhat "defensive". Hopefully she realizes that she could have handled it better.

Anyway, with all that being said, I think any time you have a great therapist who you work closely with, these things are going to happen and you should be able to talk through it just fine. (My therapist and I hit an impasse recently, and we were able to get through it the next session.) Just be honest with her and express your feelings.

Do let us know how your session goes. I think once you talk to her in person, you will feel much better.

Peaches- I can certainly understand why you would feel hurt, I know I would, too. But you know your T best. I didnt think she sounded angry, but you know her. I agree with Deli, you said things in your original email that assumed a lot about her thoughts That your importance to her, after working together for 10 yrs, starts and stops at each hour and you pay her for this. You know as human beings we are much more complicated than this. She may have a busy day, but that doesnt mean bits and pieces of you and your conversation, your progress and bravery dont come into her thoughts during the day, during other sessions, during her breaks, during a phone conversatiin, someone may remind her of you. You two have been together for a long time. Maybe she was a little hurt and felt kind of "demoted" to the position of merely someone you pay for a service. And then you become just one more face in the crowd.

OK, now that I have said that, I would feel the same way and might think the same things if my T didnt respond to an email after a breakthrough session. Sigh....It seems she is trying to point out to you that you cannot know what is in her mind. That she does feel much the same way that you do, but must show that love in a different way.

When I read her email over it does seem maybe a little sharp, not sure. Maybe she thought you put her down as someone who has many clients and doesnt care about you the way you care about her out of anger? And she got a little sharp in return? Maybe that sounds strange. Just a thought.

I so often wonder about the relationship between myself and my T. And it brings me back to why I am in therapy. Yes, for a theraputic relationship, but my goal is to return me to my life and to the people in it that are more permanant. The thera[ustic realtionship is there for me so that I can deal with people and situations in RL, who are not going to respond to me theraputically. These are the people I am "practicing" with T for. My therapy is the part of my life that helps me deal with more permanant parts of my life. I can love my therapist, I can hold the words of wisdom of all of my Ts in my heart, but they are a stepping stone to enable me to have loved ones. When I think of it that way, it helps me. It can depress me, too. But it helps me to turn my attention to my life.

It sounds like she is saying that what you say are "wrong" assumptions may not be "wrong" at all. You are making assumptions that your assumptions are wrong! And I think her email response was very caring, and I don't see how you could think she was angry. She wants you to stop making assumptions so you don't get caught up in thoughts that hurt you when they may not be based on reality. You are creating your own pain! She is telling you to stop ruminating about things you are assuming about the T relationship. You don't know what she thinks or feels about your relationship unless she tells you.

This is SOOOOOOOOOOO helpful to me. Thanks, Blue

Hey peaches,

I wanted to thank you for sharing this, and the replies have been really helpful to me. I often feel similar with my therapists.

I don't think she's mad at you either, although as someone said its hard to identify tone in an email. What she says makes sense, some of the things I'm trying to learn to. I wish I didn't make assumptions about how my t's feel or think about me, but I do. I also wish I didn't care so much about what they think or feel, but I do, I've not found that place yet. I'm sure we all will if this is right for us.....I guess it takes time

Take care

peaches, you feel what you feel....I hope you and T work this through to a comforting conclusion...