I think on another thread I mentioned that my biggest problem anymore is rumination. Ironically, that is exactly what my t and I discussed yesterday afternoon.

He was asking me what had set me off into depression this last time, and I knew it was a lack of sleep. Then we were discussing what was causing my sleep problems, and I was telling him with all that has happened in the last year, worrying about my husband, my sons, my sister, myself, my job, etc. has been a full-time job.

I ruminate about some problems to the point of panic and anger, helplessness and inevitably depression. I've had HUGE problems to deal with in the last year and it's been overwhelming at times. T says I have to find a way to disconnect from these. That doesn't mean not care or not support or anything like that. But once I've done my part, I have to recognize and ACCEPT that these things are beyond my control and disconnect so I don't ruminate over them.

That's easy to do in a situation such as my sister's illness where clearly I can do nothing more than support her and assist her when I can. It's much more difficult to do in a situation involving my husband or my children when I fear that if I stop thinking about them and something goes wrong, it will be somehow my responsibility.

So I have to remember to rationally think through what I really CAN do in these situations and let the rest go -- disconnect. That will save me so much grief and certainly help me stay out of my head and ruminating over things I just can't control.

[Perna]

Hi, farmergirl, I was strongly reminded by your rumination :-) about when I was having a miserable time at work; my boss, who'd been with the company 10-15 years while I'd been there and working for him 7-8, was a selfish, sloppy, disrespectful, play-by-his-own-rules administrative nightmare. He was good at his job but not at all at the paper half of it; our billing was always late and the owner of the company was always yelling at him (water off a duck's back) and, since that didn't work, at the owner would yell at us/me to "make him" do the billing, etc.

But, discussing it with my T, I was finally cornered into understanding that he wasn't ever going to change his behavior. I'd get yelled at, bigger administrative guns than me would be called in to try to get the billing out of him, they'd get yelled at, finally the owner would create a new you-know-what for him and, eventually, he'd do a whirlwind, too-fast, sloppy job of it, leaving a great deal of chaos for me and the other administrative (bigger guns) to figure out and clean up, and it would be done for another month and might stay up-to-date for most of another cycle, only to start again in 5-6 weeks. He was good at generating income though (so the owner ultimately like him :-) and good with soothing his clients when there was a problem, etc. just didn't do paperwork (so the income was slow coming in, owner didn't like that, we're talking $1,000,000+ a month).

But my T and I discussed how he wasn't going to ever change and my T explained to me, I could either quit/change jobs or I could get depressed. I had tried everything imaginable to support this guy, being laid back, being direct, doing 99% of the work, etc. but, since he had to go over each bill before it could go out and since he wouldn't look at/correct them, they couldn't go out (and they required elaborate paragraphs detailing what work had been done, which often there was no way I could know).

So, which did I choose? Neither :-) I "invented" a third way, My way (which T was sceptical of working :-) Dealing with this guy, being frustrated and yelled at by the owner and trying different ways to make things easier for this guy and interacting with all the other people, I felt was helpful to me in understanding my emotions and learning to pay attention to them and express what I was feeling and compromise, etc. I could understand that no one took this whole drama "seriously" and everyone saw the pattern so, in a sense, it was like working with a "model" drama, custom made for me :-)

Less than six months after the revelation, this guy found another job! I was free of him but the situation after he left was even worse as it was a young guy he had trained and an older, former owner/partner trying to work together to teach the young guy how to do the billing, etc. Young guy had a horrible attitude, worse than the uncaring one my previous nemesis had but, fortunately, I was leaving/retiring too so got out of the whole situation myself.

To make a long suggestion, short Is there some way you can make whole packages of a particular problem/situation/worry and get it outside of you so it becomes a training/educational opportunity that you don't have to take as "seriously"? Everything has a time period so gather it based on that or create your own time period (for the next six months I'm going to work on X) and your own situation that you're working on.

I'm anxious/afraid of my husband getting seriously ill or dying so I've been working on understanding our finances better (a main component of what I'm afraid of) and I start conversations with him now and read a boring newspaper he subscribes to :-) and we do some of the financial tasks together (don't get me wrong, as the above job illustrates, I use to work in accounting). For awhile I was doing the whole shebang but my husband and I approach things differently and that wasn't working for me so now I've realized, over time, that I can start from the "bottom" and just become more and more familiar with what's there, it's the "whole" and its unknownness that is most frightening so I'm kind of taking it apart and getting use to it piece by piece before I try to put it together into a whole.

Maybe you can figure out a way you can "always" be thinking about your husband/children but not in a focused way, kind of like a submarine :-) guy looking through a periscope. That's one part of what a submarine is doing but not all of it.

Thanks Perna for you thoughtful response. I think that is what my t is basically saying: There's a difference between being concerned and supportive, etc. and ruminating over issues. Most of these issues are truly beyond my control. There is nothing to be done that I haven't already done. It's that old serenity prayer thing -- the wisdom to know the difference.

[theave]

I was talking to my T about something similar today - I feel sometimes that I am trapped in a spiral of worrying about the effects my depression has had on me and those close to me, as well as dealing with some pretty major life events, rather than actually being depressed any more - that I end up ruminating and becoming low whenever something comes along and destabilises me. Acceptance, and realising that how people act might not actually have anything to do with me, seem to be key - not something I find easy at all, but it is worth working towards, I think. I hope you can find a way through it all.

[lily99]

(((farmer))) one of my worst habits is rumination! wish I had something wise to say about it, but I'm not quite there yet.
take care

[Sannah]

I realized pre and post anxiety that if you are anxious your mind needs something to think about period. After I decreased my anxiety way down I found that I stopped this rumination.

[sunrise]

Originally Posted by Sannah

I realized pre and post anxiety that if you are anxious your mind needs something to think about period. After I decreased my anxiety way down I found that I stopped this rumination.

I find that to--that my mind needs something to do if I'm anxious, so I "throw bones" to it, to keep it occupied with something harmless, instead of worrying about something I have no control over. A favorite is doing math problems or some type of stepwise mind puzzle. I throw this problem to a part of my mind and let it work on it in the background--beyond my consciousness, really. I can feel the mind churning away and this takes away nervous energy that might otherwise go to rumination. If you aren't that prone to compartmentalization as I am, you can also gnaw on the bones more overtly/consciously. For example, I will go to online sites and work algebra problems. My mind is really calmed by this.

Hope you can come up with some strategies that work for you, farmergirl. Rumination is no fun.

[mixedup_emotions]

Rumination is a big one for me too.....It's hard to have any sense of control over that....I wish I could give you some strategies that have worked for me, but since I struggle with it too, I can only empathize and relate....