[WikidPissah]

This type of situation was mentioned on the Safety Dance thread...I didn't want to hijack that thread so here goes.

I have a standing with my New T on Tues at 3 pm. Every week I go there a little early (like 5 mins) cause I hate to be late. But I wait in my car until 2:59, cause I hate to be early. It's a little waiting room, and multiple t's so it feels yucky to me. Every week at about 3:04 T's other patient comes out. Shes an older woman, all jovial and crap...stops and talks to everyone in the waiting room. When she finally leaves T calls me in. So, the appt is always like 5-6 minutes late. It irritates me. He always wraps up with me about 8 minutes before 4, so I don't know who his next patient is.

Am I being petty? I don't like seeing jovial other patient. I don't like that he runs a few mins over with her. What if she's that jovial in T? Then in comes me, barely talking, unable to look up from the floor, fidgeting and worrying. I must be a huge freakin downer after ms. jovial. He must hate it when he goes from that to me.

Remember, sometimes smiles hide a world of pain. Appearances can be deceiving.

[Perna]

Yeah, you're being petty But I think we all are. However, you can't really know what her appointment/she is like from seeing her for a minute or two?

I saw my T in two back-to-back (100 minutes) sessions once a week. We ended at an "odd" time and I was her first and last client. Your T may not have a "next" patient and/or why wouldn't the next patient have foibles too and come early and see you?

I don't know but if she's that jovial all the time in T, I would be like you if I were T and find it annoying? T doesn't want to see people hiding behind a fake/jovial mask anymore than whatever it is you think he doesn't want to see in you? You might not know if people in the waiting room are waiting for your T or not?

I would talk to T, just ask one time when you first arrive if his previous client is as jovial as she always seems; I'd even tell him I find it annoying that she spends so much time getting out the door that your and his sessions are delayed until she finally can't be "heard" anymore and he knows it's safe to call you/that she's gone? He can tell her she's being disruptive/disturbing when she leaves if he needs to. But how do you pay your bill, does she pay the office manager there or something like medical offices do?

I'd feel sorry for her, sounds like she might be nervous/anxious about how to "leave". Some people don't know how to say "goodbye" one of my stepsons was like that, would stand around on the porch for half an hour or more, unable to just "cut and go". It's not an easy skill to learn? I often feel awkward when I'm leaving (and didn't "like" the waiting room for the same reason you don't but went in on time/early anyway as I didn't want to "miss" anything :-) But I'd definitely think of a way to discuss these things with your T?

[WikidPissah]

good points. I don't want to be petty. But it does irk me that he runs over every week, by at least 5 mins. There is no receptionist or anything, you just pay T at the end of appt. I don't run into the patient after me because I'm out of there early enough to leave.

I thought there was an unspoken rule in T waiting rooms that no one wants to be talked to. There should be a sign on the wall or something. "Please don't talk to other patients" (kind of like the "don't feed the bears" signs at the zoo)

[Yoda]

Originally Posted by Eileen2010

I thought there was an unspoken rule in T waiting rooms that no one wants to be talked to. There should be a sign on the wall or something. "Please don't talk to other patients" (kind of like the "don't feed the bears" signs at the zoo)

Why do you not like to talk to other clients? Is it because you are getting into your "therapy mode" to focus on yourself and don't want to be distracted? Or are you afraid a casual conversation might turn into a discussion of "why we are all here"?

If somebody has their face in a magazine or avoids eye to eye contact I don't talk to them but I often chat while waiting, especially if they have cute kids there.

Am I breaking the rule?

[ECHOES]

I had a similar reaction to a person who's appointment was before mine. It was not just that the person was jovial, it was that she seemed outgoing and *likable*, and several times she and T would be laughing as they were approaching the waiting area.

It reallly wasn't about the other person... it was about my own desire to be outgoing, to be freely open in session, and to be likable. And to feel secure (if she has fun clients, then I worried she would not want me around). T and I often laugh together, but at that time, not so much.

As for the time, my therapist has offered me extra minutes when needed, goes over 10 minutes if we start 10 minutes later, gives me her time on the telephone, flexibility with scheduling including staying later to add me to the end of her day.. so I no longer glance at the clock as we start or finish.

All issues are important in therapy, so it would be good to talk with your T about everything in your post.

[geez]

Eileen how long is your appt supposed to be? My T had cut my appt short by 10mins before and has also had run late before with no apologies (because a patient before me was flapping his gums during my set appt time by like 8mins over). I discussed with T and she apologized and said she would be pissed if it were her waiting. I also learned something about myself in the process of it all. I would talk to your T about it - there is probably something more you will learn about yourself.

I understand your frustration! - I have been there. Keep us posted!

Peace.

[looking4polaris]

Originally Posted by Eileen2010

There should be a sign on the wall or something. "Please don't talk to other patients" (kind of like the "don't feed the bears" signs at the zoo)

I like this idea. Maybe you should make the sign and take it in. My T has separate in and out doors, so I never see anyone else. I would love to see this sign in plenty of other offices I've been in though!

[sunrise]

I don't mind seeing other clients on my way out of T's office. Seeing his other clients tells me something more about him and his practice. It's interesting--sometimes there are couples, sometimes whole families, sometimes one parent and a teenager, sometimes individuals. I also feel a kinship with my T's clients, because we all "share" him, so we have my T in common. Once my T told me he was considering new office space and he said one perk was that there would be separate entrances and exits from his office, so the clients wouldn't have to see each other in the waiting room. "What?!" I said. "I like seeing your clients!" I guess I'm strange or something. I even had a nice dream once about T's other clients. We were all at a big party at T's house.

The only time I don't really like seeing clients is when I arrive in T's waiting room, because that means the schedule is messed up and he has either double booked or either me or the other client has messed up. I hate that. I have definitely talked to those clients in the waiting room. (My T doesn't have the "no talk" rule in his WR. ) The talking only happens when he is double booked, but the other client and I ascertain that we are both waiting for the same appointment, and make the best of it. One time I had been dreading my appointment with T, so was kind of relieved there was another woman waiting there. I figured when T came out, I would let the other client have the appointment and tell T I could see him at another time. The other client, a woman, told me she also really didn't want the appointment and I could have it! When T came out, we both said the other person could have the appointment, and both admitted to him we didn't want to be there. T was kind of chagrinned. There he was with 2 clients, neither of whom wanted to be there! As it turned out, T felt I was in urgent need of an appointment and the other woman wasn't, so he "chose" me for the session. That was a pretty interesting interaction! Also very interesting to hear that T thought I was urgently in need.... Another time a rather loud and jovial man was waiting there, wearing an expensive suit and very flashy jewelry. We talked about our kids, and he gave me advice on the college search for my daughter. He was pretty funny and there was a lot of laughing. T came out at one point and told us we were having entirely too much fun, LOL. He also told the man to go away, as the appointment time was mine.

I don't mind seeing t's other patients either. I'm always interested to see the range of individuals he works with: young children, teenagers, elderly, etc. It's kind of a guessing game I play with myself to try to figure out what he sees them for.

As far as talking in the waiting room goes, my t is part of a practice with several psychiatrists, so it is a busy waiting room. They installed a big screen tv a few months ago that helps the time pass more quickly. The only problem is that the tv is always tuned to the Food Network. So, inevitably those of us in the waiting room get to laughing about how hungry it is making us.

Then there are the children who come in. There is a toy box and it's fun to watch them put together these huge floor puzzle of fire trucks, etc. Or the kids doing their homework while they wait.

It's a friendly office. I like that.

[Melbadaze]

I think its natural to be curious of other clients, I remember when I was with an agency therapist I'd sit and wait for the previous client to leave, not sure I was envious of anything because my T at the time made it known to me that she enjoyed friday mornings with me, perhaps she said the same to the preivious client?? Not sure, but it worked at that time and I felt ok with seeing the other client. now that I'm with a therapist that works privately and from her own home, I much prefer it.

[WikidPissah]

Originally Posted by Yoda

Why do you not like to talk to other clients? .....
If somebody has their face in a magazine or avoids eye to eye contact I don't talk to them but I often chat while waiting, especially if they have cute kids there.
Am I breaking the rule?

I just don't want to talk to anyone. I have extreme anxiety, especially in the waiting room. Too small, too many germs...yucky magazines that people have touched, I don't know who sat in the chair before me, maybe they had a bladder problem... etc.

I don't mean to sound like an ogre. I do love kids, and if there were ever kids there I would enjoy watching them.

Originally Posted by geez

Eileen how long is your appt supposed to be? .... I would talk to your T about it - there is probably something more you will learn about yourself.

I think all the appts are supposed to be like 50 min...to give T enough time to take a breath between clients. I am nowhere near the place where I can bring something up to T like this. Maybe someday, but not yet.

The other thing that bugs me...there's no breath between the other client and I. The chair is still warm from the other patient. I wonder if he's still in "other client mode" when I come in. How can he switch gears so quickly? And after I do go in and sit down, he always excuses himself to go get my chart and a cup of coffee. I don't know...I just want my time to be mine, free and clear of anyone else.

[elliemay]

I've certainly had some profound reactions to other clients in the waiting room and coming out of my therapist's office before - and by profound I mean horrible.

I understand your reticence about talking in the waiting room. I certainly don't want to talk to anyone in my physicians waiting room either. I usually don't feel well when I'm there and just want to be left alone.

Outside of that I do sense of problems with your therapist's time management that may be interferring with your therapy. I know they are hard to talk about, but your time belongs to you. You are worthy of it.

One day, I think you do need to express this with your therapist. If my therapist owes me time that I'm paying for, then he's going to give it to me. Give it some thought.

[seventyeight]

hi eileen,

i don't think you're being petty at all! you're paying for that time, and it belongs to you and you only. i think i once figured out that my therapist costs about $3.33 per minute. if her rates were applied to you, every time your session is cut by 5-6 minutes, that's $16 to 20!

not to mention, how it must make you feel to not start on time, like the client before you is "more important" because he decides to give your time to her. i think i would definitely ask him what the poilicy is, and maybe even consider changing your appointment time to 3:15 to avoid all of this.

just my, er, 333 cents

[WikidPissah]

Originally Posted by seventyeight

hi eileen,

not to mention, how it must make you feel to not start on time, like the client before you is "more important" because he decides to give your time to her. i think i would definitely ask him what the poilicy is, and maybe even consider changing your appointment time to 3:15 to avoid all of this.

just my, er, 333 cents

Thanks 78...that's it in a nutshell. Feeling that I'm not worth it....that old thing I've felt since a kid...not mattering. Ugh.

But you know what...a HUGE part of it is also my obsessive personality. I like (actually need) things to be exact. Never a minute late, never a minute early. I really need to learn to bend a little and go with the flow.

[(JD)]

Generally appointments are 50 minutes. (The proverbial 50 minute hour.)
He may have trouble getting her to leave on time, as she may wait until the last bit to drop the real reason she wanted to discuss. She may need extra time for this time-being and he's allowing it? I doubt her attitude after session has much to do with why she's going to therapy, unless it's to have someone to talk with, but I doubt any self-respecting T would do that, and surely not allow them to run over time!

I agree that you need to discuss this with T...maybe print out your post? What's fair is fair...and mental health patients do often have issues with "fairness." T needs to know that you're noticing. I'm sure hearing another side to it will help you, and it might even change the situation.

When I see my pain doctor, sometimes his partner is taking a new patient (he sees children) and the whole family is in the waiting room! I can't handle that much noise and that many people in such a small space (talk to me about elevators later) so I wait in the hallway. T comes and flags me when the coast is clear.

Hope you can solve this issue.

[BlackCanary]

Originally Posted by Eileen2010

...

The other thing that bugs me...there's no breath between the other client and I. The chair is still warm from the other patient. I wonder if he's still in "other client mode" when I come in. How can he switch gears so quickly? And after I do go in and sit down, he always excuses himself to go get my chart and a cup of coffee. I don't know...I just want my time to be mine, free and clear of anyone else.

Ack! I have this challenge with my new T. I see her at the end of the afternoon. She brings the prior client to the waiting room (large HMO, a dozen people waiting, game shows on TV). Then says "Ready?" to me. No break. No nothing.
I did tell her it bothers me, that I worry about the other person's stuff seeping over into my session.
So, she told me how she handles it, that I can trust her and it's her's to manage. This helped, so I try to let it be her's to deal with vs. me to worry about.
OriginalT, I always saw him first thing at 9 AM, so no one was before me. I always went out by the stairs, never saw the next client. And he did take a few minutes between, was always good about getting me out with a few minutes to spare (over 45 but less than 1 hr).

I hope you can find a way to mention it to your T, it's a short list, one thing at a time?
- want to start on time
- willing to also finish on time
- want him to be ready for you when you walk in vs. getting the chart and his coffee after you are seated.
- you want to feel like he's already transitioned to you when you are in the room, not in progress of transitioning.
- tell T how it makes you feel, that's the big part.
good luck

[Dr.Muffin]

Originally Posted by Eileen2010

I must be a huge freakin downer after ms. jovial. He must hate it when he goes from that to me.

ah, but maybe that jovial lady annoys the living crap out of him!

[WikidPissah]

so today he went 10 min over with her. sigh

[gelfling]

Eileen, i had this conversation with my former t - and he got really,really, REALLY defensive about how he sometimes went over with me, had called me or whatever (he went over cause he started late-but whatever) so for me it was not a fruitful discussion -

and the sick thing was, when he started being more conscientious i felt like a raging meany for having brought it up.

[sunrise]

Originally Posted by Eileen2010

so today he went 10 min over with her. sigh

Did that mean your session started 10 minutes late or just that he didn't get his 10 free minutes between patients? If he started your session 10 minutes late, did he give you extra time so you got your full session? If you are consistently getting shortchanged, Eileen, do you think it worth mentioning to him?

[sittingatwatersedge]

Originally Posted by Eileen2010

so today he went 10 min over with her. sigh

hm...... imagine making an appointment with a VP in your workplace and while you were in there, he kept answering the phone or stepping out to talk to someone.
I could envision you going in to see yr T and saying, this week I'm having a problem with a business contact. Actually it has been going on for a while. They're important in my work but I can't seem to get their attention; we make an appointment to work on an important project and they always seem to have conflicts with the schedule, other priorities, and they allow these to cut into my appointment; I feel like it's starting to impact the work.
The T is suposed to validate your viewpoint, so probably will. The two of you can examine together whether it's a perception of yours, or whether the important person is out of line; if ethics or justice are getting cracks around the edges (not emotional, business - the T relationship is working with a professional, not a relative). You can keep it in terms general enough to not name names. Then, if "cracks" are established, you could then say, well... it's you, T.
Your conversation could then take a whole new turn. good luck

[WikidPissah]

Sunrise, he was 10 minutes late for my appt. sigh. I did get it back in the end though, so I got my whole time. I just hate waiting in the waiting room If he would say something it would be better...something like "I am behind today" or "sorry I ran late" or something...at least acknowledge it.

I think I am going to ask him to change my appt to 3:15. Then I won't be in the waiting room that long. Hopefully he won't run over for that time.

[granite1]

Originally Posted by Eileen2010

Sunrise, he was 10 minutes late for my appt. sigh. I did get it back in the end though, so I got my whole time. I just hate waiting in the waiting room If he would say something it would be better...something like "I am behind today" or "sorry I ran late" or something...at least acknowledge it.

I think I am going to ask him to change my appt to 3:15. Then I won't be in the waiting room that long. Hopefully he won't run over for that time.

eileen i love SWE idea i bet he would totally get it in a nut shell what you are trying to express to him in a less intimidating way.10 min late is not cool.my T was 15 min late once because she didnt get the message that i was thare and she thought i was a no show.imagine her surprise when she walked by in the middle of doing something and saw me sitting thare

My t is routinely about 5 to 10 minutes late for my appointments. It doesn't really bother me because he doesn't short me on my appointments. I've just grown to be used to it. He spends his full time with each patient and sometimes runs over. Since I'm at the end of the day generally, it just seems pretty reasonable that he might be a few minutes late by the end of the day.