[granite1]

Monday i was talking to my T about lying.someone at work in a small way made me think he thought i was lying.anyway,it really upset me a lot it is kind of what started this spiral that went on.i told T how i dont lie and how it really hurt that he thought i did.
so then i thought about things after session and i lied to her.i told her i went to work to check on an order when all this stuff went down when in fact i had gone into work to work and i had totally forgot that i worked that dayin fact i forgot a lot about that week but i feel like i lied

also i lie to her every time i see her when she asks how i am doing ?or bye letting her continue to believe i dont SI.or by not telling her things etc..on and on and on.god i feel like a big fat lier.i know this all sounds stupid but i am worried now if T ever realizes how much i lie she will never believe anything i ever say.i feel like i could never tell her the truth now esp about SI.i feel like a fool telling her i never lie.what do i do.i already have such a hard time talking to her.anyone ever tell therapist they never lie and have that be a lie

[SpiritRunner]

oh granite, you didn't purposely mean to mislead your T; I don't think you need to feel like you were lying. also, not being able to tell her something yet isn't something you need to feel like is lying either. I once took a few weeks to give my T details on something when I thought I should have told her right away, and then I told her I felt like I had lied.....but she said, you just waited to tell the truth when you were able; I don't think you lied.
not being able to tell all the truth is not lying.....when you are ready you will tell her, I know you will because I know you are genuinely concerned about being honest with your T!

[Tatyana2009]

Relax. Tell her exactly what you told us in the post.

That would be a very honest act. And a brave one to. And it will set the scene for honesty and you will feel better.

********Possible trigger*********


i don't lie to t exactly, just omit things and then sometimes he will say something and get it totally wrong and i won't correct him. Kinda feel like he is the professional and who am i to correct him? and sometimes it is just easier cause then he has answered the question for me

i si and i know t hates talking about it, (he kinda turns green) like if i don't mention it and he doesn't mention, it will just go away. so now i don't tell him if i do or don't...

not the greatest way to heal in therapy, but in my situation it is just what currently works....

Granite, I don't think you lied either

[WePow]

(((((Granite))))) Someone once told me - I think here on PC - that Ts expect to be lied to a certain amount of the time. Many people who are in therapy have lived hard lives, sometimes involving abuse in some form, and they learn how to lie in order to stay safe. For example, if you have a parent who physically assults a child when the child does poorly in school, the child soon learns how to lie about grades in order to avoid being harmed. Or say a parent asks "Did you have a nice day at school?" and the child says "Not really. Billy the kid stole my lunch." If the parent responds with "Well why are you such a whimp?! You should have punched his lights out! You make my stomach turn!" Well, the next time the parent asks the same question, but once again Billy the kid made off with the hotdog, the answer will be "Oh just fine." Or it could even turn into "Well, Billy the kid tried to take my lunch, but I knocked him into next week!" The parent responds with delight "Now THAT's the way to do it! You make me so proud!"

When things like that happen day-in and day-out, the child can very easily slip into a pattern of lying. It is NOT because they are a bad person. It is because lying becomes a tool for survival.

I encourage you to be honest with your T about the lying. Allow your T to work with you to process through all of this WITH you. Remember that T is on your side.
It is going to amaze you because what will happen is that if you practice telling T the truth about each lie as it comes up, your T will end up trusting you a WHOLE LOT more than even right now. Honestly, most Ts already see through our lies. But their job is usually not to call us out on that unless we are being treated for lying. They allow the tool to remain in play until we have built up enough trust to no longer NEED the tool of lying.

[Luce]

Every single person lies some of the time. While honesty is the best policy in many situations, there are many others where a lie is called for. Some lies are damaging, and some are protective. Not all lies are 'wrong' and some are quite simply necessary.
Your T will not think twice about you having lied to her. You are a human and, well... humans sometimes lie.

Originally Posted by WePow

(((((Granite))))) Someone once told me - I think here on PC - that Ts expect to be lied to a certain amount of the time. Many people who are in therapy have lived hard lives, sometimes involving abuse in some form, and they learn how to lie in order to stay safe. For example, if you have a parent who physically assults a child when the child does poorly in school, the child soon learns how to lie about grades in order to avoid being harmed. Or say a parent asks "Did you have a nice day at school?" and the child says "Not really. Billy the kid stole my lunch." If the parent responds with "Well why are you such a whimp?! You should have punched his lights out! You make my stomach turn!" Well, the next time the parent asks the same question, but once again Billy the kid made off with the hotdog, the answer will be "Oh just fine." Or it could even turn into "Well, Billy the kid tried to take my lunch, but I knocked him into next week!" The parent responds with delight "Now THAT's the way to do it! You make me so proud!"

When things like that happen day-in and day-out, the child can very easily slip into a pattern of lying. It is NOT because they are a bad person. It is because lying becomes a tool for survival.

I encourage you to be honest with your T about the lying. Allow your T to work with you to process through all of this WITH you. Remember that T is on your side.
It is going to amaze you because what will happen is that if you practice telling T the truth about each lie as it comes up, your T will end up trusting you a WHOLE LOT more than even right now. Honestly, most Ts already see through our lies. But their job is usually not to call us out on that unless we are being treated for lying. They allow the tool to remain in play until we have built up enough trust to no longer NEED the tool of lying.

Thanks for explaining this so clearly. I struggle with lying...a habit I picked up during childhood. I lied to avoid abuse, but I also learned to embellish stories to get attention when I was being neglected.

I've always hated this about myself, and I never looked at it with compassion like this....a survival skill. Sometimes I catch myself lying to my husband about something stupid...like I spent $20 on something just for me, and I hide it. He wouldn't care! In fact, he would praise me for spending the $20 on myself. But it's instinctual for me to lie.

I didn't mean to hijack this thread. I just wanted to say THANK YOU. I'm so glad I'm not alone in this and happy to see it is fairly normal, esp for survivors.

[SpiritRunner]

Originally Posted by griffinp

Thanks for explaining this so clearly. I struggle with lying...a habit I picked up during childhood. I lied to avoid abuse, but I also learned to embellish stories to get attention when I was being neglected.

I've always hated this about myself, and I never looked at it with compassion like this....a survival skill. Sometimes I catch myself lying to my husband about something stupid...like I spent $20 on something just for me, and I hide it. He wouldn't care! In fact, he would praise me for spending the $20 on myself. But it's instinctual for me to lie.

I didn't mean to hijack this thread. I just wanted to say THANK YOU. I'm so glad I'm not alone in this and happy to see it is fairly normal, esp for survivors.

I think WePow put it well, too, and I appreciate your post too, griffin. I told my T I thought I had been lying, being manipulative, in my childhood....and she explained it to me that way, too, like a survival skill or a coping mechanism, something I needed to do as self-protection....hiding part of the truth to protect myself. I still find myself doing it when I get some feeling I'm not safe......I didn't have much compassion for it in myself either.....but thinking of it as a learned coping mechanism rather than a bad character trait does help!
Anyway, not to hijack the thread either! But I hope this helps you see yourself with more compassion in this situation, granite!

I had to lie A LOT growing up...I couldn't tell anyone what was going on at home, and created a persona that I took to school. When I was really little, I wasn't that good at it....I went way too far with it. I didn't know what normal people lived like, and I read a bunch of Little House on the Prairie books, and I told everyone I lived on a farm. We moved every couple of years, so I kept getting a chance to change my lie, and finally, by middle school, I understood that the lies didn't have to be so elaborate. But, yeah, I grew UP lying.

I hate the feeling that I am lying to T. In a recent session, I was kind of watching the session from outside of myself, and the me I was watching was having a very animated and mature discussion with T about parenting, etc....and finally by the end of the session I was able to get back into my body and told him that I was WATCHING the session and wasn't really there. When I left, I felt AWFUL, like poor T had been sitting there being LIED to all session. I know that's not how it really was, but that's what it felt like. Ack. I called and apologized, and he said he didn't feel lied to at all. But still.

Don't beat yourself up, Granite. You talked, and that's huge and good and brave. I bet almost everyone who goes to therapy lies by omission...because we're just not ready to talk about stuff yet. I didn't tell my for AT LEAST 18 months about the CSA stuff. Didn't even hint about it. And even now, some things are just too hard to say.

Be gentle with you. You are human. And you are doing a great job.

[WePow]

Granite, I really do hope that all these replies help you a bit. They are helping me out too- knowing others face this same problem. So thank you TONS for being so honest with us here about this problem. It is a part of our healing journey.

[Sannah]

granite, you already got a lot of good replies. I hope they have helped.

[granite1]

sorry it has taken me so long to respond.i have had a lot going on with my son going back to okinowa yesterday and all i spent most of monday with him along with going to therapy .tuesday is kind of a blur(HATE THAT)anyway.thank all for taking the time to read my post and commenting.it really helps to get things straight in my mind a lot.
first i need to get up the guts to even keep talking to T kind of hard but i am committed.i am affraid she will be so angry at me for not being honest with her esp about the SI .i try to say its whatever i dont really want to stop.i let her think that i am ok when i'm not because i cant tell her differntly.just a ton of little ways of lying

[granite1]

Originally Posted by WePow

(((((Granite))))) Someone once told me - I think here on PC - that Ts expect to be lied to a certain amount of the time. Many people who are in therapy have lived hard lives, sometimes involving abuse in some form, and they learn how to lie in order to stay safe. For example, if you have a parent who physically assults a child when the child does poorly in school, the child soon learns how to lie about grades in order to avoid being harmed. Or say a parent asks "Did you have a nice day at school?" and the child says "Not really. Billy the kid stole my lunch." If the parent responds with "Well why are you such a whimp?! You should have punched his lights out! You make my stomach turn!" Well, the next time the parent asks the same question, but once again Billy the kid made off with the hotdog, the answer will be "Oh just fine." Or it could even turn into "Well, Billy the kid tried to take my lunch, but I knocked him into next week!" The parent responds with delight "Now THAT's the way to do it! You make me so proud!"

When things like that happen day-in and day-out, the child can very easily slip into a pattern of lying. It is NOT because they are a bad person. It is because lying becomes a tool for survival.

I encourage you to be honest with your T about the lying. Allow your T to work with you to process through all of this WITH you. Remember that T is on your side.
It is going to amaze you because what will happen is that if you practice telling T the truth about each lie as it comes up, your T will end up trusting you a WHOLE LOT more than even right now. Honestly, most Ts already see through our lies. But their job is usually not to call us out on that unless we are being treated for lying. They allow the tool to remain in play until we have built up enough trust to no longer NEED the tool of lying.

wow i love your explination of why we can tend to lie.
maybe trigger



many times when living with the mother she would randomly accuse me of lying and really beat the crap out of me.once i remember sitting on the stairs of my house she thought i lied about something she asked me .i remember her being so fast i couldnt turn around she pulled me down the staird by my feet she hit my face loved to kick me.i didnt lie she said sorry.went to my farthers and he complained about how my face was so marked up but did nothing.i hate being told i lie.but i guess i do on some level

[granite1]

Originally Posted by Tatyana2009

Relax. Tell her exactly what you told us in the post.

That would be a very honest act. And a brave one to. And it will set the scene for honesty and you will feel better.

i really believe this would but i get so scared but really want this honesty.working in getting up the guts to have this conversation

[granite1]

Originally Posted by jbmomg

********Possible trigger*********


i don't lie to t exactly, just omit things and then sometimes he will say something and get it totally wrong and i won't correct him. Kinda feel like he is the professional and who am i to correct him? and sometimes it is just easier cause then he has answered the question for me

i si and i know t hates talking about it, (he kinda turns green) like if i don't mention it and he doesn't mention, it will just go away. so now i don't tell him if i do or don't...

not the greatest way to heal in therapy, but in my situation it is just what currently works....

Granite, I don't think you lied either

i'm sorry you T has such a hard time talking about SI it must be so hard for you

[granite1]

Originally Posted by griffinp

Thanks for explaining this so clearly. I struggle with lying...a habit I picked up during childhood. I lied to avoid abuse, but I also learned to embellish stories to get attention when I was being neglected..

i think i tend to lie to T to avoid talking or dealing with things i am terified to face

[SpiritRunner]

Originally Posted by granite1

i think i tend to lie to T to avoid talking or dealing with things i am terified to face

granite, you have been very honest here; this ^ is a very honest statement.
I think your T would not see that as lying nor would she tell you that she thought you had lied. you're not lying; you're avoiding speaking about things that have and do hurt you deeply because you are scared to talk about them yet. that's not lying, that's self-protecting.....you're not trying to deceive your T, you're just not ready to let her see some things or talk about them too much. But you ARE working toward that, and you ARE making honest progress. You are taking steps toward the sort of trust that will help you open up and tell a bit more of the deeper hurt, little by little.....it's OK to allow yourself to tell the truth slowly, bit by bit, a little more at a time as you are able and it's OK to stop thinking you're being a liar...you're not!

[granite1]

OMG do you think that telling a T that you lie is kind of like telling her that she cant trust you or anything you say.i dont believe she would anyway but now i will never say anything remotely close to this

[mightaswelllive]

Originally Posted by granite1

OMG do you think that telling a T that you lie is kind of like telling her that she cant trust you or anything you say.i dont believe she would anyway but now i will never say anything remotely close to this

Honestly (), if you are thoughtful about how you broach this topic with T, I think your T will not only trust you more, but also respect you for owning your faults.

I believe your T will react respectfully and appreciatively if you say something to the effect of: "When I said ___ the other day (or whenever), I was not completely honest with you. ___ is what really happened (what I was feeling, what I left out, etc). From now on, I will always try to tell you when I realize this has happened."

You may even want to include an explanation on why you think you misrepresented yourself/the situation. For example: "I don't think I am intentionally dishonest, but sometimes I speak what I believe is my truth and later I realize I was wrong. I think, internally, I'm trying to protect myself."

But please don't call yourself a liar. You're not a liar. Misrepresenting the truth is a very common defense mechanism. You are just protecting yourself.

[mightaswelllive]

As a more general reply to this thread...

Reading everyone's thoughts, feelings, and experiences on this whole concept really intrigues me. I used to misrepresent a lot of what I said and I didn't even realize it. Unfortunately, everyone around me did. When I said things that I really meant, it was difficult for people to really know - so even when I reached out, I rarely got support I needed.

I used to exaggerate, deny, omit, etc, to everyone including my T all the time and I didn't even realize it. Eventually, a close friend starting calling me on my BS around the same time my T did. T used to say "I'm not buying it" I think in my case, I'd numbed out so much from everything happening in my life that I was always playing the character that I'd convinced myself I was - unfortunately (or perhaps fortunately), I wasn't a very good actor. This was a massive realization in my life and I spent countless sessions, hours, and sleepless nights mulling it over - it still makes my stomach turn to an extent (though admittedly, it does make me feel relief to read that others have struggled with it too). I constantly wondered "Does everyone I know think I'm a liar? Does everyone know who I really am and I don't even realize it? Am I someone I'm not? Do I really believe ___? Do I really feel ___?" So yes, clearly a lot of doubt and confusion arose from this, but my therapy didn't really begin until I heard, acknowledged, and learned about these thoughts and feelings.

Misrepresenting, exaggerating, lying, fibbing, denying, omitting, delusional behavior, excessive hyperbole, whatever you want to call it - they are the way we've learned to protect ourselves. Fortunately, being in therapy, we all seem to be at a point in our lives where we are ready to look at the things that made us learn these protective behaviors and find better ways to deal with them.

Granite - if you're really ready to explore all of this with T, it could really be a major turning point in your therapy.

[SpiritRunner]

Originally Posted by granite1

OMG do you think that telling a T that you lie is kind of like telling her that she cant trust you or anything you say.i dont believe she would anyway but now i will never say anything remotely close to this

Oh my goodness no! If you tell your T these things that you have been thinking/feeling, that you feel like you should be telling her more than you have, I think she will respect your courage......and trust you more! I have withheld things from my T, confessed it later.......and granite, she has still told me that she trusts me, that she knows I want to and will be as honest as I can.
It takes strength, character, and courage, which you do have, to tell your T you have withheld some things and why......you don't have to say "I lied" just something like what mawl already very helpfully suggested.
you are doing so well, granite, in giving these things so much thought right now! you could really be close to a breakthrough moment in your therapy.....

[granite1]

i think i will start with the list of my perfect T session and leave the lying thing alone