[Chopin99]

This may not be a popular post that everyone wants to hear, but I've had a time of awakenings recently where I've seen a blend of T's wisdom and my own play out in life.

She used a Bible story to illustrate a concept and can be used whether you are religious or not. I was on FB earlier and saw a friend's status referring to the story: "Do you remember the story about the man by the pool of Bethesda? The one who had been waiting for 38 years to be healed? It seems that someone was always pushing him to the side, or stepping in front of him. He just couldn't get a break...until Jesus shows up one day and says "Do you WANT to be healed?" I have really identified with this individual at certain points in my life. This guy was so discouraged and had encountered so many disappointments and hurtful situations, that he hadn't really expected a miracle in a very long time. He was just going through the motions. When we don't expect much, it should come as no surprise when not much happens for us or those around us. Our inability to always faithfully believe, and our disillusionment cripples expectation. When we expect nothing, nothing is what we get. My prayer today is that we will not allow lack of expectation to stand in the way of the miracles that God wants to perform in our lives every day."

When I read this, I realized that at times our life circumstances (past or present) drag us down to the point that we think NOTHING is ever going to change for us. As long as we keep this attitude, nothing will ever change in our lives. Most of us in this forum have made the choice to be in therapy. That means somewhere within us, we believe that things CAN change for the better! It may not be easy; but down deep, we believe it.

T has mentioned several times of late that change is a choice. I'm starting to believe that. We choose to be in therapy, we choose to accept what our T's are telling us, we choose to make changes in our lives to make them better. Alternately, we choose to repeat old patterns, we choose not to listen, we choose not to change.

I have made a choice. I choose to seek mental health, even when my entire being wants to go back to old, familiar behavior patterns and cognitions. I choose to be good at my job, even when it means really hard work and sacrifice at times. I choose to be a good wife, daughter, and friend, even when all I want to do is disconnect. I choose to forgive. I choose these things despite fear, despite intermittent failure, despite a rebellious nature, despite laziness.

I can do whatever I choose and I choose life! That takes risk. For the first time in 34 years, I believe I'm worth that risk.

[roads]

Well, yea! What a terrific "awakening." Just one has me really, totally confused:

This may not be a popular post that everyone wants to hear

Why ever not?

[healed84]

Thank you for posting this.. It is really encouraging for me and really needing to read it right now!!

[Chopin99]

Originally Posted by roadrunnerbeepbeep

Why ever not?

Honestly, because as I am paying more attention to the actions of others in life, people don't want to accept responsibility for their actions. I'm seeing life more and more as a series of choices. Choices have consequences and quite a few people these days dont want to take responsibility or accept consequences related to the choices they make.

I know that fear (of consequences, failure, etc.) has paralyzed me for most of my life. When I did make decisions, I did accept my consequences...but more often than not...I chose not to choose. Which actually was a choice in and of itself with its own set of consequences!

I am certainly not saying that I am seeing this as an issue amongst PC folks, it is a general observation and indictment of the world at large.

[notz]

Choppin, you always have this way of reaching into my chest and finding my heartbeat.

[faith1983]

woww... it's just wonderful and inspiring.

Thank you so much for sharing that!

I think sometimes the decision to want change is hindered by unconscious defences.,when we begin to reach this level of unconsious defences we begin to chane and its only as that change begins do we believe we were in charge all along. We weren't, we are in charge of whether we seek help, but its not as simple as the 'blind' suddenly 'seeing' a lot goes on internally, otherwise its just a 'pink cloud' change, tomorrow we're back to wondering where all our possibilities went.

[sittingatwatersedge]

>> When we don't expect much, it should come as no surprise when not much happens for us or those around us. Our inability to always faithfully believe, and our disillusionment cripples expectation.
I agree with you on this Chopin, but I have a problem when I get here >> T has mentioned several times of late that change is a choice [...] we choose to be in therapy, we choose to accept what our T's are telling us, we choose to make changes in our lives to make them better. Alternately, we choose to repeat old patterns, we choose not to listen, we choose not to change [...]

changing hard wired behaviors (from whatever age) is not a matter of simple choice. That's what therapy is for; it is hard work, and takes time. And forgiveness for an abuser, according to T2, is only possible when the abuse stops.

I am greatly in agreement that we must believe that change is possible, and commit wholeheartedly to the change process even though it's hard. I also feel that the therapist must believe in the work too, or it will fail. But I guess mostly I wanted to say, although I agree with these things, let's be careful about blaming the victim.

Some people (even on PC) have opined that no one can hurt you, can affect you adversely, unless you allow them to do so. I can't accept this (rather I should say, I find this outrageous). Those who have undergone CSA or SA have enough problems with self blame without having to hear that sort of thing.

Not trying to rain on your parade. I applaud your insight and courage. I hope that you can hear what I'm saying without taking it as criticism, I do not intend any criticism. just my $0.02.

[Chopin99]

Originally Posted by sittingatwatersedge

>> When we don't expect much, it should come as no surprise when not much happens for us or those around us. Our inability to always faithfully believe, and our disillusionment cripples expectation.
I agree with you on this Chopin, but I have a problem when I get here >> T has mentioned several times of late that change is a choice [...] we choose to be in therapy, we choose to accept what our T's are telling us, we choose to make changes in our lives to make them better. Alternately, we choose to repeat old patterns, we choose not to listen, we choose not to change [...]

changing hard wired behaviors (from whatever age) is not a matter of simple choice. That's what therapy is for; it is hard work, and takes time. And forgiveness for an abuser, according to T2, is only possible when the abuse stops.

I am greatly in agreement that we must believe that change is possible, and commit wholeheartedly to the change process even though it's hard. I also feel that the therapist must believe in the work too, or it will fail. But I guess mostly I wanted to say, although I agree with these things, let's be careful about blaming the victim.

Some people (even on PC) have opined that no one can hurt you, can affect you adversely, unless you allow them to do so. I can't accept this (rather I should say, I find this outrageous). Those who have undergone CSA or SA have enough problems with self blame without having to hear that sort of thing.

Not trying to rain on your parade. I applaud your insight and courage. I hope that you can hear what I'm saying without taking it as criticism, I do not intend any criticism. just my $0.02.

I don't take it as criticism at all. I'm where I'm at...everybody else is where they're at. I have not been through any sort of SA, ra**, etc. and I am certain that is a totally different situation. I would never blame the victim of any sort of sexual assault (or any other type of abuse, for that matter).

I don't even blame myself for what occurred in the past with me. What I can control is my present. The present is when I can make choices. Everything happens when it is supposed to happen. Maybe the guy in Bethesda wasn't ready to heal. I can choose today to stay mired in old patterns or I can choose to change. The process of change can be very long, but I believe we have to choose to change every. single. day.

Thanks for your insight into the matter, SAWE!

[Perna]

Originally Posted by Chopin99

I'm seeing life more and more as a series of choices.

Just do not lose sight of the fact that that is not the only valid way to see life and make it into a simplistic dichotomy.

Flowers do not choose to grow toward the sun. As the Arabian proverb states, "All sun makes a desert." Even when we make deliberate choices, we cannot know how those choices are going to play out; it is possible to choose something we think or feel is good for us that ends up not being so and sometimes we hesitate and let positive-seeming choices parade by through confusion, fear, or sheer tiredness and that turns out to have been the correct move for us at that time.

For me, life is lived right now. A moment ago is past and the next moment is unknown, not here yet. I try to relax in the moment and just grow as my nature dictates; the sun and rain, dirt at my feet and air around me are their own masters.

[Chopin99]

Originally Posted by Perna

...it is possible to choose something we think or feel is good for us that ends up not being so and sometimes we hesitate and let positive-seeming choices parade by through confusion, fear, or sheer tiredness and that turns out to have been the correct move for us at that time.

I see this as making a choice and the consequence of the choice being that it wasn't so good for us. Then we make another choice or choose not to make a choice.

Just two different ways of describing the same phenomenon. Neither one is right or wrong in my opinion.

Thanks for your opinion Perna.

[sittingatwatersedge]

hmm... choose schmoose.... if you choose to have a friendship with yr T, it ain't gonna happen....

Important to commit to improvement sure; choices have consequences, sure; but let's not attribute every swingin' thing to "choice".
We're not the only vote in the hat, much of the time.

[Perna]

Actually, SAWE, one can choose to have a friendship with one's T as one's imagination will happily play the T's part :-) But, when other people are involved, we don't necessarily get those choices, they're non-existent, non-chooseable/nonsensical? I can't choose to weigh 100 pounds less tomorrow but I think "friendship" is in the eye of the beholder; my T was very friendly as opposed to enemylike?

[sittingatwatersedge]

Originally Posted by Perna

Actually, SAWE, one can choose to have a friendship with one's T as one's imagination will happily play the T's part :-) mm hmmm, in other words, not
But, when other people are involved, we don't necessarily get those choices, they're non-existent, non-chooseable/nonsensical? I can't choose to weigh 100 pounds less tomorrow but I think "friendship" is in the eye of the beholder; my T was very friendly as opposed to enemylike?

so realistically, it's choose when you can. I can live with that.

[pbutton]

I think it's more choosing things that are within the realm of possibility. I can't choose to be Johnny Depp's girlfriend, but I can choose to find a partner I am attracted to and enjoy. I can't choose to drop 100 pounds tomorrow, but I can choose a healthy diet and exercise.

It's a matter of making the best possible choices with the situation that I have at hand. In my case, I need to quit choosing to push away my T.

[Chopin99]

Originally Posted by sittingatwatersedge

hmm... choose schmoose.... if you choose to have a friendship with yr T, it ain't gonna happen....

Important to commit to improvement sure; choices have consequences, sure; but let's not attribute every swingin' thing to "choice".
We're not the only vote in the hat, much of the time.

True. In my original post, I was referring to choices only involving myself. When you add other people into the equation, that's when things get tricky.

However, we can choose how we respond to the choices and actions of others. A coworker (who has been in therapy for years and made some amazing changes in her life) was telling me at lunch today that at Christmas, her aunt was trying to make her feel guilty for choosing to stay away from her family (one factor she considers key to her healing). She said she started feeling rage and guilt (her old triggers) at what her aunt was saying, but told her aunt, "I cannot carry that baggage anymore. I cannot carry the burdens of my past. I am laying this cross at your feet. If you choose to pick it up and carry it, that is on you. I will not do it." She then walked away, feeling no more rage or guilt.

To use your example, me "choosing" to have a friendship with my T; I can ask, she can say "no", then I choose how to respond to that. I can have a meltdown , think I'm not worth being anybody's friend and a loser, and fall apart. Or I can think she has the right to choose not to do so, respect it, and move on and make a friendship with someone who wants to have a relationship with me.

[Chopin99]

Originally Posted by pbutton

I think it's more choosing things that are within the realm of possibility. I can't choose to be Johnny Depp's girlfriend, but I can choose to find a partner I am attracted to and enjoy. I can't choose to drop 100 pounds tomorrow, but I can choose a healthy diet and exercise.

It's a matter of making the best possible choices with the situation that I have at hand. In my case, I need to quit choosing to push away my T.

Exactly!!

[bluemountains]

Originally Posted by Chopin99

True. In my original post, I was referring to choices only involving myself. When you add other people into the equation, that's when things get tricky.

However, we can choose how we respond to the choices and actions of others. A coworker (who has been in therapy for years and made some amazing changes in her life) was telling me at lunch today that at Christmas, her aunt was trying to make her feel guilty for choosing to stay away from her family (one factor she considers key to her healing). She said she started feeling rage and guilt (her old triggers) at what her aunt was saying, but told her aunt, "I cannot carry that baggage anymore. I cannot carry the burdens of my past. I am laying this cross at your feet. If you choose to pick it up and carry it, that is on you. I will not do it." She then walked away, feeling no more rage or guilt.

To use your example, me "choosing" to have a friendship with my T; I can ask, she can say "no", then I choose how to respond to that. I can have a meltdown , think I'm not worth being anybody's friend and a loser, and fall apart. Or I can think she has the right to choose not to do so, respect it, and move on and make a friendship with someone who wants to have a relationship with me.

I like the reply that your coworker was able to give her aunt. I hope to be at that point soon.
My thoughts on the "choices" discussion is that we choose our actions and our reactions to our thoughts. The way we make these choices can be conditioned to be more positive for us. For example, I can't choose to lose 100 lbs. tomorrow, but I can make a choice that I will work towards losing 100 lbs.

-I'm enjoying the discussion!

Bluemountains

[Chopin99]

Originally Posted by bluemountains

My thoughts on the "choices" discussion is that we choose our actions and our reactions to our thoughts. The way we make these choices can be conditioned to be more positive for us. For example, I can't choose to lose 100 lbs. tomorrow, but I can make a choice that I will work towards losing 100 lbs.

Conditioned. That is an excellent word! I am in therapy to condition me to have healthier actions/reactions to my own thoughts and the actions of others. My coworker's trigger response prior to therapy would have been to actually physically assault her aunt. In the intermediate stages of her therapy, she would have taken her rage out on an inanimate object in the immediate vicinity of her aunt. Now, post-therapy, she can let it go and walk away.

I told her today that watching her change in her five year journey in therapy shows me it can be done. It wasn't easy for her. I've known her for eight years. She made mistakes and gave up and went back and fought hard and had panic attacks and talked of killing our former boss and took up boxing and lost weight and gained weight and did things right and messed things up. Despite all that, she has come out the other side a person I highly respect. She chose to dedicate herself to the change and DID IT!! I can do it too.

[Perna]

I am so glad you have a job with coworkers like that; I did too. I use to listen in/watch my friend/coworker talking on the phone to her mother and how patient and calm she was and it really helped me dealing with my own when she got senile.

[Chopin99]

Originally Posted by Perna

I am so glad you have a job with coworkers like that; I did too. I use to listen in/watch my friend/coworker talking on the phone to her mother and how patient and calm she was and it really helped me dealing with my own when she got senile.

Me too...but I like to say we are all a special brand of "crazy" where I work. Seriously, if a person is anywhere near normal, we tend to weed them out because we know they won't fit in! My boss says if you're normal, he wants nothing to do with you. Crazy, weird, odd, eccentric, he can deal with. I'm proud to be part of such a great weird group of people!

[notz]

I have found nothing more gratifying than acceptance of me as me. Having a work environment like that, must be welcoming to accept the fullness of your being.