Just read my T's dissertation, freaking out

OK, so I am pretty obsessed w/ finding out info about my T. It is really unhealthy, I know this. On the other hand, it would be really hard to open up to a complete stranger. She doesn't self-disclose at all, and I have never asked. Anyways, I have found out a lot of info, but last night I was able to access her dissertation through my school's library. It was actually really easy b/c it was on an online database and I read it. Now I am freaking out.
First of all, I am freaking out b/c I read the acknowledgements page, and it was pretty personal. I mean, not unusually personal or anything, but it was personal. Because the things I know about her now are just facts, numbers, data, etc. Like where she did her undergrad, how old she is, she is single, etc. But now I feel like I have a read a page out of her diary. FOr example, she thanks her twin siser. Now I know that she has a twin sister, which is a complete mindf**ck b/c I'm like "There are two of you?" And she says things in it like "I would like to thank so-and-so for helping me to get to the second grade all they way to New York City." And also things like "I would like to thank so-and-so for beleiving in my ability to become a psychologist long before I ever could." Or she thanks her other sister (not the twin) and says that she looks up to her for "her strength and independence." I mean, those things are pretty personal. And now when I see her I am going to have this person sitting in front of me who is very professional, impassive, etc. and then I am going to have this other person in my head who wrote that acknowledgements page and all these personal things and I feel like I can't reconcile the two. I feel so not OK about this, but also part of me loves that I was able to find her being "a real person" and not a therapist.
The other issue this brings up is that I am writing my thesis right now for my master's. I am completely dissullisioned by my field (originally I was going to apply for a PhD, but now I am just ready to be done.) And I have absolutely no support from my thesis advisor/other faculty, partially due to the fact that I am an MA student and not a PhD student, and partially b/c the people in my field are very competitive and not supportive at all, even the professors. My T, on the other hand, thanks so many of her colleague and advisor and professors for being such great mentors, beleiving in her, being there for her, etc. I would kill to have that kind of support. It makes me, I guess, a little envious of her, and also look up to her even more. I mean, now I feel she had all of these people supporting her during the process, thinking she wa intelligent, etc. I don't have that at all (once again, this is partially the nature of my program, which is very abstract and theoretical.) And reading her dissertation, I was struck by the fact that she has accomplished so much (granted, she was 12 years older than me when she wrote it) and that she really beleive in what she is doing. I would love to have that, but I don't. It was especially hard to read during this stage in my life, finishing up a degree that is useless in the real world without any support at all. It triggered a lot for me, in that I felt like she had everything that I would want at this moment (ie support, to beleive in what you are doing, etc.)
I don't know what to do. I feel like everyone here will say to tell her, but I am so so so ashamed. Plus, she is super scientific and CBT oriented (her disseration was more like a scientific study with graphs, etc.) and I feel like if I mention reading it to her she will just think I am a complete stalker. AND I feel like if I tell her about the dissertatation I would have to mention the other info I have as well. I just don't know, part of me wants to quit therapy.

When is your next appt.? Did you just read this?

I've read many of my therapists' dissertations online ... Most of the subjects they focused on had little to do with what they ended up "specializing" in ... (ie. ME!) ...

Try not to distress too much over this ... I'm sure you and I aren't the only ones who've done this ... Also try not to compare her "support" to your "support" ...

I'm sure she had just as many people who weren't supportive (hell, some may have even been downright sabotaging to her) as any of the rest of us out here do ...

Unfortunately it's the downside of human nature in some ...

If you think it's gonna be a problem in future sessions, you've got two options ... 1.) Talk with her about it, or 2.) Find another therapist and try not to google their personal information ...

I think most therapists realize that their dissertations are available online, therefore I doubt she'd be too surprised to find out that many of her clients have looked the info up ...

Good luck with all this ... and I hope you realize that you haven't done anything wrong ...

Each life is different. You will have your own people to thank who will support you. Sometimes it may take a bit of looking around in order to see the support structures we walk on each day.

If I were in your place, I would let your T know about this.

Franki, I think for most of this stuff others will be able to be more helpful than me, but I wanted to give one perspective as I just finished my PhD, and in my acknowledgements I also tried to thank everyone who gave me any kind of support.

Two things about this:

1. Plenty of people made my life harder. Some caused me to lose months of time because they messed up my work in some way. People stole ideas from me. Professors said cruel things to me -- one in college suggested I leave the field. Friends betrayed me over stupid, competitive things. I was lied to and harassed. But I didn't mention any of those people, because they have no place in my final achievement. They don't deserve to be on the same pages as my true friends, collaborators, mentors, parents. I wouldn't be surprised if your T had similar experiences... this is one of those things that just doesn't replace at least asking someone about themselves. I'd imagine your T would show you something human if you needed it -- even my T, who is very traditional and discloses next to nothing (I don't even know where he's from, how many kids he has, or where he went to college) will occasionally say something personal when it is solely to help me.

2. I did thank my committee and my research advisor. And I only said nice things about them -- because they read my thesis and decide whether I pass!! Of course, I meant everything I did say, but what I didn't say was that my advisor is a self-interested jerk who was repeatedly dishonest with me, rarely acted in my interest, and actively made it difficult for me to find a post-grad position. Still, he was less of an ***** than most professors, and when it really really came down to it he could be helpful, and to his credit did support my ideas even when they went against his own. And so for that, I thanked him. My committee? Great people, and in the end were my champions and were wonderfully supportive... but the first three times I met with them, I cried afterwards. They were harsh, tough, sometimes excessively so. I resented the fact that they were tougher on me than others' committees were because they expected more of me. But I didn't write about that -- I wrote about how valuable their perspective had been. And oddly, I couldn't write about how much I had relied on their support when my boss was being a jerk, because then I would have had to say that my boss is a jerk. I'm just saying, there's a LOT that is unsaid EVEN in the things that ARE said.

Academia is a rough environment. And it's an unfair environment. Don't feel bad about leaving if it's not for you. Some of the brightest people I know ended up leaving without the PhD, not because they were incompetent or stupid or even disliked... mostly, they were treated really unfairly for reasons that went way beyond anything about them as people. Conversely, I know incompetent people that managed to finish because they happened to be in the right place to be coddled or have their bad behavior overlooked. But all of that... that's all missing from what you see written out in someone's final dissertation, or lack thereof.

Yes, I just read it last night, and my appointment is tomorrow. PLUS my T knows that I am struggling right now with my thesis and my program. One of the problems I struggle with is I tend to take this pill called Vyvanse, which is like Adderall only stronger, to finish my stuff. I have been taking it for my thesis, and she knows this. I feel like she thinks I am a complete idiot for freaking out over a 50 page thesis/needing to take drugs to do it, when hers was a 100+plus dissertation. This was such not a good time for me to read it.
AND the acknowledgements page did freak me out a lot. I mean, I guess I was looking for some clue as to how she is outside of T, and now that I found it I feel so bad. And when I read the acknowledgements page it just drives home the fact of how much I am struggling with my own academic career.
I told my T last session that I am in a quarter life crisis right now, and that's how I feel, and reading this did not help.

I just wrote my dissertation acknowledgements and found that I had to lie a bit about the support I received. In my case, I received MUCH more encouragement and support from professors from my MA program (at a different university) and those outside of my university than from professors in my PhD granting department. But, writing very glowing statements about everyone but my own department just couldn t happen. Please dont read too much into the acknowledgements and also remember that a Phd is a much greater and longer commitment than an MA, so impossible to read 5-7 years into the future...

p.s. My advice is not to do a PhD unless you are 100% certain that you want to and are prepared to be an adjunct making less than grad students for at least 2 years after you finish. The uncertainty and rejection of academia do not mix well with depressive tendencies, people who have self-esteem problems, and mental illness. To finish my diss I needed Concerta--it is not shameful, it just is...

Thank you sooo much eastcoater and SallyBrown. That actually did make me feel a lot better, because I guess I had this idea that her life was perfect b/c of that acknowledgements page.
Although come to think of it, she does still work at the same university with some of the people she mentioned in her acknowledgements. But I guess you are right, that I shouldn't read too much into it. It's just so hard not to, and especially when I feel that everyone is doing so much better than me. Again, I know this is not true, but I am just at an ick place right now with finishing up my degree and realizing that academia is not where I want to be for the rest of my life, which is very disconcerting and disillusioning.

Thank you! My T made me feel so bad one time when I told her I had taken some after I had been off it for awhile and made me feel like I shouldn't be in grad school. It was horrible and I refused to talk to her the next session (we eventually talked about it and got thru it). Anyways, even though we did get through it, the whole thing about her making me feel like complete s**t about the Vyvanse made me feel as though her time in grad school must have been a walk in the park. So thank you.
Anywas, yes, I was originally fully planning on applying to PhD programs after my MA, but I honestly do not love what I am doing enough to put up with the low pay, abuse, non-support, etc. that comes with it.

I remember when I read my former T's thesis; it was in her library which was her waiting room, since therapy was in her house. I learned some things I didn't know about her from the acknowledgment page, also. I ended up telling her, and she said it was okay that I looked because she purposely doesn't put anything private in that room. She said that she would answer my questions and she would rather I ask, than snoop!

If I were you I would tell your T because it affects your therapy, not just because of what you read, but because it brings up your own ambivalence about your master's thesis and schooling. That is probably more relevant than knowing about your T's family, and is something productive to discuss in therapy. I think it will be hard for you to keep this information to yourself, and besides, in therapy we learn how to be honest and see that we won't be punished (hopefully).

FANTASY:

You: How do I know I'm taking to you and not to your twin sister?

I have no doubt at all, that she felt just as you do when she was writing her thesis. (I did!) Writing up is hard work, and no one can help you. (Or if they do, they tell you you've done it wrong. Grrrr!) And it takes forever. But when you've finished, you may be more in the mood to thank people!

When I finished my PhD I baked espresso brownies for my pdoc, and told her from my heart that I would not have made it without her managing my antidepressants. Eastcoaster is 100% right... academia plays into all of the worst parts of mental illness. I initially felt like taking meds meant I was giving up -- but in reality, I realized I was treating a legitimate illness that was making my life (not just my job) harder than it was for people without it. A classmate of mine and I had one of those great long discussions early on where she told me about being on meds for ADD, and was relieved to find that I knew ADD was real, and that I applauded her for doing what she needed to do to make the most of the skills she had. No shame in needing meds.

I'm sure it looks like it's easier for other people in your program, but don't be so sure. My husband also has a PhD, and his experience was a real nightmare. His acknowledgements are also sweet and generous, and say nothing of the awful experience he had. To boot, he had many accomplishments on paper -- he looked great, like he had it totally together. But he was truly miserable, and left the academic track. He's MUCH happier now, outside of the low-paying abusive environment he'd started in.

Both he and I are continuing to work with and contact people we knew from our PhD years. It's just the way our field is if you stay with it, academic or not. And we live in an area that's really ideal for the work we do, and we intend to stay here -- so we'll be bumping into these people forever, like it or not. Just because we have to play nice with them to get our work done (and preserve our own careers!) doesn't mean we like it... it just means we like our line of work more. Could be the same with your T.

And the people I know who don't deserve the degree, but managed to get it anyway? You can fake it through something with set requirements like a PhD, but not so much with life. One of my classmates was never ever sure this was something she wanted to do. Now, she has absolutely nothing planned for the future, and hasn't done well on interviews... because with the PhD, she's overqualified for positions she would actually be more suited for, yet is in reality underqualified for anything requiring a PhD. She did not do herself any favors forcing herself through.

And finally, the MA... in my program, you could apply for a continuing MA if you finished a certain set of oral and written exams/requirements. Almost everyone I knew did, because we were all realists: we know that whether we deserved it or not, or whether we chose it or not, we might not be able to complete the PhD, and in that case, we wanted something to show for our efforts. It's really ok.

Finally, I know what I said about your wanting your T to say that she didn't have kids was a bit cold and that was hurtful -- I did not mean to be hurtful, but I will elaborate to say that it was a little stunning to me that you were willing to have her dig up something potentially very very painful in order to gratify your need to see her vulnerable. It was hard for me to imagine someone else forcing me to talk about my own miscarriage just so they could feel like they know me better. That's why I said what I said. This is quite different, but I still see you coming up with something that would prevent your T from understanding your position. She's not a mom, so she can't possibly understand your mom. Now, you see that she got a PhD, but you fear it was a cakewalk for her and so she must judge you and must not be able to understand your struggle. Similarly, I can really relate to your disillusionment with academia... and so if you came up to me and said, after reading my sunny and sweet acknowledgments, that I must have had an easy PhD and couldn't possibly get you, I'd be pretty thrown given all the things I wrote about my experience above.

What I am saying is NOT that you are a bad person. Quite the contrary. What I AM saying is that while on one hand you're desperate to know more about your T -- and I really think she will help you with this if you tell her everything you've written here! -- you also seem to try to find ways to put distance between you and her. I think this is really really worth thinking about and examining. Is it self-protective? Are you afraid that she will stop caring about you because of these things? Are you angry with her for not being caring enough? I can't answer these, but I think that if you can answer it for yourself, it could tell you a lot.

ETA: I just wanted to say one more time, that the only mistake you can make is doing something that's wrong for YOU... so forget what was right for all these other people! You're going to be ok. I was just in the position of having absolutely nothing lined up as my next step in life and it was terrifying. But you will figure it out, and when you do, you'll be happier for having found a better path.

I'm sorry you're feeling so mixed up after reading her thesis. I can really relate to the urge to do so- my T's thesis sits neatly next to her husband's on the bookshelf in her office. I have visions of one day pulling it out of the bookcase double quick and reading the acknowledgements before she can stop me I feel this is one of the few things she would say no to if I asked her permission. If it was available online, like your T's is, I would have read it one hundred million times over by now. Hope you can find a way to feel more peaceful about this information you now know about your T

i want to read my t dissertation how do u go about it

I routinely feel tortured over papers shorter than yours. I am glad I didn't seriously consider a PhD even though some professors encouraged me, and I'm old enough to more or less know the results career-wise.

I also read a small part of my t's dissertation. I never told him. The bit of personal information I got from it he has since told me in another context. I usually consider my t about my intellectual equal as far as academics go (occasionally he astonishes me with his therapy insights though), but I get a sense he's got more ego about his academic achievements than I do about mine . Whether your t has a lot of ego or not, I don't think PhD's in therapy fields are the most challenging.

[ Whether your t has a lot of ego or not, I don't think PhD's in therapy fields are the most challenging.[/quote]

Whoa! NOT true! Of course there is some variation among different programs, but statistically it is much harder to get into a clinical or counseling psych PhD program than into medical school. The typical APA accredited program has about 200 applicants for 5 spots. Once in a program you are expected not only to master techniques of therapy, but also (like other degrees in the sciences) to master empirical research, including statistics. For a dissertation, you are expected to conduct sophisticated original research.

Give your T's some credit. A PhD in psych is in many ways one of the hardest ones out there!

EJ

Getting in to some programs might be somewhat difficult, but the bigger question I think is how hard it it to get out? Once in, in a lot of places, the rigor lacks. Plus having credentials does not ensure competence in general nor a guarantee of the elusive alliance.

So I went into see her today and of course did not talk to her about reading her dissertation.
Last night, I went over to my friend's house and was seriously debating just getting so drunk that I couldn't come in the next morning. Or just emailing her and telling her that I couldn't come in and not giving a reason. I also debated emailing her and telling her that I had read it, but I couldn't do that either. When it comes down to it, I couldn't not come in to see her today b/c I would miss seeing her so badly. And I didn't want to tell her about the dissertation thing b/c I need her now when I am going through all this with my thesis and finishing my degree and feeling depressed, and if she started thinking I was some kind of stalker-freak I don't think I could handle that.
So I went in and I did tell her I was feeling emotionally drained and that the last two years have been the hardest two years of my life (for various reasons, school-related and not school related as well.)
She also knows that I am thinking of applying to social work programs. What she doesn't know is that I am thinking of becoming a therapist with a social work degree, b/c she has helped me so much and made an impact on me, which has inspired me to want to help other in the same way. But I can't even tell her that. She keeps saying we need to talk about my reasons for wanting this degree and I keep acting like I just randomly thought of it for no specific reason, when I have actually been considering becoming a therapist for quite some type and have been looking into the various ways I could become one (i.e. PhD, PsD, LCSW). I feel that eventually I will need to tell her about her role in my considering social work, but I don't like admitting how much I look up to her. If I can't even admit this, how am I supposed to admit that I read her dissertation and online stalk her?
And I noticed again that when one of her other clients left, they called her by her first name. I can't even call her by her first name, it is always Dr. So-So, because I would feel too personal calling her by her first name, even though I want to.
I feel that eventually I will have to discuss this stuff with her or else I can't continue in therapy, because I feel like I am being fake and covering up a lot. I would love to talk about our relationship, but I really feel like I will sound like a weirdo. I want to tell her that I look up to her and that her dissertation really triggered me and all this other stuff, but I can't right now.

franki - the first time I learned some significant things about my t on line, I waited six weeks to tell her and as time passed it got harder and more awkward. She wasn't pleased. The next time I learned something I told her right away and it wasn't easy but it was better than waiting. I wish I could call my t by her first name, too. I hope you figure out how and when to talk to her.

I relate so much to this. My career interests have shifted over the years, but there was a long time when I intended to go into clinical psych, to be a practicing psychologist. At the time, I was always so afraid to discuss this with my T, because I was afraid to admit that she was a big influence on my decision to go this route, and yes, I looked up to her. Also I think I was afraid of her thinking I would never be sane/healthy/competent enough to do such work.

I am now in a research-oriented (non-clinical) graduate program. My interests are no longer to become a therapist, and I find it much easier to discuss school/career stuff now with both my old T (who I still am in contact with) and my new T, now that it's not as close to what they themselves do.

Anyway, it totally makes sense to me why you'd feel weird about this. For some reason it's just hard for some people (like us) to be open about how we feel about people, *even* when it's all positive stuff. The "stalking" stuff... well I don't really consider that stalking. Simple looking up online, reading dissertations, is all pretty tame and expected/normal. Admiring the work your T does, being inspired to pursue a similar path-- still normal and nothing to be ashamed of. And yet still, it's hard to admit for some reason. I wonder why. Is it because we're afraid of the other person (in this case, our Ts), won't reciprocate the same level of interest/admiration? That they'll think we're silly to think we can do what they can do? hmmm...

Hang in there. You can still talk about this with her, when the time feels right.

Whoa! NOT true! Of course there is some variation among different programs, but statistically it is much harder to get into a clinical or counseling psych PhD program than into medical school. The typical APA accredited program has about 200 applicants for 5 spots. Once in a program you are expected not only to master techniques of therapy, but also (like other degrees in the sciences) to master empirical research, including statistics. For a dissertation, you are expected to conduct sophisticated original research.

Give your T's some credit. A PhD in psych is in many ways one of the hardest ones out there!

EJ[/quote]

Okay, maybe I'm a bit mad at my t now.

But I didn't say I don't respect PhDs in therapy fields, I do a lot. I just said I don't think they're the MOST challenging. The OP said her field is very abstract and theoretical and I was thinking some fields that fall in that category- math, physics, philosophy- could be harder than psych.

AS someone said above, you did not do anything wrong. Dissertations are public.

Oh my god. I just emailed her and told you I read it. I am freaking out, I am about to have an anxiety attack.