How would this make you feel?

IndestructibleGirl · Apr 01, 2014, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asiablue

i dunno the whole situation is very off.

I didn't suggest you took the money or want it or anything else. I'm only commenting on the situation.

I know - I just thought you were unclear that Mr Rich Client actually knew where his money was going, and wanted to make things vigorously clear

nottrustin · Apr 01, 2014, 03:07 PM

YIKES!!

First just calling it a scheme sets off a lot of whistles for me. I guess I very scheme to mean something very shady and or illegal. Thinking pyramid schemes, schemes where people work to defraud somebody from their money or possessions, etc.

Secondly I would feel horrible to find out somebody she was talking about somebody else about me about something so personal. T is the only person I have discussed our financial situation with for a reason. H and I pride ourselves on no matter how bad things have gotten we have always made it work with asking others for help. The fact she has offered free sessions is one thing I could deal with (not like it but if it was at a point I needed it then I would accept it). However, to find out that it is a topic of discussion in the office and with other clients would make me feel like a charity case. I couldn't take the money. T has mentioned multiple time not paying the copay when things were difficult but H and I agree that we will always find the money for T...granted it is no wheres $20

That being said I do understand if somebody did accept the help and the money. That is just how I feel.

anilam · Apr 01, 2014, 03:44 PM

So the money would be a "gift" from a wealthy client? OMG talk about crossing a boundary...:/ Is she seriously discussing your situation with other clients?
I'm so sorry, I would terminate on the spot- offering you a job was bad enough but this? She's clearly dealing with some counter-transference here...

IndestructibleGirl · Apr 01, 2014, 04:02 PM

I have been thinking about countertransference. It must be part of the problem. I think I elicit feelings of resentment and annoyance.

It's funny though. Usually on something like this my mine would shoot straight to thinking oh my god it's all my fault. But I don't really think that. I said to my friend (trainee therapist) it must be my fault, something I did that manipulated her boundaries and coaxed her to do some odd things, and I realised that didn't feel true for me. My friend exploded at me that of course it isn't my fault, it's supposed to be the T that manages the boundaries, and that if I am acting in a way that tries to blur them, to deal with it. And surely since I have borderline traits, she should have been more stringent if anything?

I don't really believe it's all my fault, but I still get an insidious little voice every now and again telling me it is. Ugh I feel like I let all my armour fall and she peered in and confirmed all the stuff I said, about being gross and warped and damaged inside, and started to back away slowly while lying through her teeth. Except now I don't believe I'm bad, just mixed up and scarred and hurt.

IndestructibleGirl · Apr 01, 2014, 05:50 PM

Urgh and now I go online to pay my rent and there had been some kind of mistake and I haven't been paid

Normally I could express my anxiety over this in therapy, and now I just can't. I know I'll sort the money thing and I'll pay the rent asap in the next few days when I get the mistake fixed but it has tripped my panicky buttons. I won't miss a beat when I speak to my landlady or the rental agency because I'm able to put on a good performance, but inside I'll be in tears. I hate having to always pretend, and therapy was a place I didn't have to and now it feels gone.

AllyIsHopeful · Apr 02, 2014, 07:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IndestructibleGirl

So much has been happening for me, I kind of am only coming back to this now - I don't think I'm entirely comfortable, but maybe I'm being over sensitive or picking holes in something.

As I have mentioned before, I am being seen for free at the moment. However, a couple of sessions ago - the same one where my therapist said the job she offered me was filled, so was preoccupied with that - she commented that she had managed to get a new social mental health strategy off the ground, thanks to the brilliant new PA that got the job

And I was the first person to benefit from this - basically, a rich client paid the $200 for my session. Out of gratitude, for the help he received himself.

He wouldn't know who I am, or anything. But my T told him I was really struggling for money at the moment, and they agreed to pass the money onto me. I definitely felt weird about this at the time, and said I'd prefer her to keep the money, and she said no, we would prefer you to have it.

I was embarrassed. It's sensitive enough going for free sessions, without this. And I know she was trying to help but...I don't know. Incidentally, at our last session it wasn't mentioned again anyway, so it hasn't been a thing. But thinking on it makes me a bit queasy. It's actually doing a nice job at dampening down my romantic ardour, however. I feel annoyed and wary again.

Am I being unreasonable? Am I possibly being unreasonable and finding fault to try to seize an excuse to be pissed with her so I can avoid the romantic feelings?

Would you be ok with a situation like this?

NO NO NO absolutely NOT! I would be so mortified if my therapist gave me this information! It is a good and thoughtful concept but way out of line to discuss with you, in my opinion. Did she give the $200 to you? Or was she explaining that the session fee would be covered by the other clients?

I'm so sorry you are having so many doubts and questions about your therapist and the relationship right now. Hang in there.

feralkittymom · Apr 02, 2014, 07:41 AM

There is something going on here that is twisted. I think your T has lost her therapeutic perspective, the frame has crumbled and with it your rightful security. I believe her intentions are good, but I also would worry that could change rapidly because she doesn't seem to be cognizant of her own confusion.

She's trying to save you by interfering (which is ultimately not only unethical, but non-validating and undermining psychologically) and seeing your reasonable discomfort/non-compliance as pathological. How long can that continue before she starts acting out her frustration consistently?

Only you can know what you can handle and the risk/benefit to staying, but I would be tempted to at least take a break. See what a few months away from her feels like. And see how she responds to that.

AmysJourney · Apr 02, 2014, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by feralkittymom

There is something going on here that is twisted. I think your T has lost her therapeutic perspective, the frame has crumbled and with it your rightful security. I believe her intentions are good, but I also would worry that could change rapidly because she doesn't seem to be cognizant of her own confusion.

She's trying to save you by interfering (which is ultimately not only unethical, but non-validating and undermining psychologically) and seeing your reasonable discomfort/non-compliance as pathological. How long can that continue before she starts acting out her frustration consistently?

Only you can know what you can handle and the risk/benefit to staying, but I would be tempted to at least take a break. See what a few months away from her feels like. And see how she responds to that.

I couldn't have said it any better, this is right to the point, I think.

IndestructibleGirl · Apr 02, 2014, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by feralkittymom

There is something going on here that is twisted. I think your T has lost her therapeutic perspective, the frame has crumbled and with it your rightful security. I believe her intentions are good, but I also would worry that could change rapidly because she doesn't seem to be cognizant of her own confusion.

She's trying to save you by interfering (which is ultimately not only unethical, but non-validating and undermining psychologically) and seeing your reasonable discomfort/non-compliance as pathological. How long can that continue before she starts acting out her frustration consistently?

Only you can know what you can handle and the risk/benefit to staying, but I would be tempted to at least take a break. See what a few months away from her feels like. And see how she responds to that.

I think you are right

She has cancelled on me twice this week already, and I am psychologically exhausted after psyching myself up for a session I am dreading. It's because of health problems (awesome, part of me just wants to look after her and give her cuddles to make her feel better

) but I am super annoyed. So I told her I was annoyed and I was worried the relationship was no longer therapeutic. She said she can understand that, but she has her own opinions which involve only healthy therapeutic things - wtf does that even mean???

Is she actually daring to blame me for all her poor boundary maintainence?? Does that sound like apportioning blame, or am I being too prickly?

So then I said it was hard to have the sessions cancelled twice this week and could we have a check in before we meet tomorrow, as I'm finding it difficult. I understand if she can't, I just want to make my need heard even if we can't meet it. And she praised me for being honest but said no, she's concentrating on herself today.

I actually don't know if I want to go to even one more session to wrap it up, or just cut my losses, thank my lucky stars for the healing I have received and move on before things become more hurtful.

AllyIsHopeful · Apr 02, 2014, 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IndestructibleGirl

I actually don't know if I want to go to even one more session to wrap it up, or just cut my losses, thank my lucky stars for the healing I have received and move on before things become more hurtful.

I definitely don't want to sway your opinion either way, because it should be fully your decision; but it seems like this may be the safest thing for you to do, in the case of looking out for yourself. You are being given many red flags and admittedly feel uncomfortable over these situations. If you cannot go in and bring this all up with her to determine whether or not she really is blaming you for anything, what all of this means, and if the relationship could be repaired, it may be best to cut your losses. Do you feel you are done with therapy? If not, would you begin looking for a new T?

IndestructibleGirl · Apr 02, 2014, 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hopelessly Hopeful

I definitely don't want to sway your opinion either way, because it should be fully your decision; but it seems like this may be the safest thing for you to do, in the case of looking out for yourself. You are being given many red flags and admittedly feel uncomfortable over these situations. If you cannot go in and bring this all up with her to determine whether or not she really is blaming you for anything, what all of this means, and if the relationship could be repaired, it may be best to cut your losses. Do you feel you are done with therapy? If not, would you begin looking for a new T?

I definitely could go in and have it out with her, yes, but part of me thinks do I really need a big upsetting grand finale where bitter words are said that will cheapen all the good things that I want to remember with fondness?

Maybe better to just cancel and cease all contact?

I'm not done with therapy forever, but I would certainly take a break! Money would dictate so anyway, but I think it would be healthier too.

AllyIsHopeful · Apr 02, 2014, 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IndestructibleGirl

I definitely could go in and have it out with her, yes, but part of me thinks do I really need a big upsetting grand finale where bitter words are said that will cheapen all the good things that I want to remember with fondness?

This is a great point. It makes absolute sense and if that's how you feel, listen to your instincts! They won't let you down.

feralkittymom · Apr 02, 2014, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IndestructibleGirl

I think you are right

She has cancelled on me twice this week already, and I am psychologically exhausted after psyching myself up for a session I am dreading. It's because of health problems (awesome, part of me just wants to look after her and give her cuddles to make her feel better

) but I am super annoyed. So I told her I was annoyed and I was worried the relationship was no longer therapeutic. She said she can understand that, but she has her own opinions which involve only healthy therapeutic things - wtf does that even mean???

I have no idea what that phrase means. But do I remember that your T is a non-native speaker of English?

Quote:

Is she actually daring to blame me for all her poor boundary maintainence?? Does that sound like apportioning blame, or am I being too prickly?

Well, this is the crux of it, I think. I don't think she is consciously blaming you directly, but it does seem pathologizing to me and doesn't reflect an awareness of how it appears she's crossing boundaries all over the place.

Quote:

So then I said it was hard to have the sessions cancelled twice this week and could we have a check in before we meet tomorrow, as I'm finding it difficult. I understand if she can't, I just want to make my need heard even if we can't meet it. And she praised me for being honest but said no, she's concentrating on herself today.

This seems ok to me.

Quote:

I actually don't know if I want to go to even one more session to wrap it up, or just cut my losses, thank my lucky stars for the healing I have received and move on before things become more hurtful.

I think if you are considering at least taking a break, it would be better to go, but only to get her to explain her thinking about boundaries, how she views you, treatment plans. You do want to get answers before you leave, whether it's permanent, or temporary so that you don't ruminate on it all.

ETA: I wouldn't go and rant; not only will it not be effective, as you say, it will just leave you feeling horrible. Is a calm and straightforward discussion possible? Even if you need to wait a week or two to gather yourself?

unaluna · Apr 02, 2014, 08:39 AM

Health problems? Concentrating on herself? That does explain a lot. Vaguely, but at least she admits that shes lost it. Sounds like she needs some time in rehab or something. You need to draw a boundary for yourself. What is wrong with her associates that they are not seeing this and making her take time off? No matter - if she has cancelled twice, i would move on. Something is up, given all of this.

Eta - i wouldnt even do a final session - if she is using, whats the point?

IndestructibleGirl · Apr 02, 2014, 08:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by feralkittymom

I have no idea what that phrase means. But do I remember that your T is a non-native speaker of English? Haha, no! She is as English as can be! But this sentence makes no sense to me, at all. Just seems like an indirect way of saying anything that's wrong stems from me.

....

I think if you are considering at least taking a break, it would be better to go, but only to get her to explain her thinking about boundaries, how she views you, treatment plans. You do want to get answers before you leave, whether it's permanent, or temporary so that you don't ruminate on it all.

ETA: I wouldn't go and rant; not only will it not be effective, as you say, it will just leave you feeling horrible. Is a calm and straightforward discussion possible? Even if you need to wait a week or two to gather yourself?

I guess I do want to get answers, that's true. It is good to feel like there is nothing pertinent left unsaid, for sure.

I wouldn't rant exactly, but I will have to be careful I don't get see red and just rip into her. I am very easygoing, capable of discussing things reasonably (I guess part of me feels she took advantage of my relaxed nature, being lazy with her boundaries and expecting me to suck it up because I can cope with anything) until I feel I have been pushed too far, and then I have a short burst of temper and don't mince my words. Would be a good learning experience to see if I can do it differently in this situation though.

ETA: Not sure why this all came up in bold at the end..

IndestructibleGirl · Apr 02, 2014, 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hankster

Health problems? Concentrating on herself? That does explain a lot. Vaguely, but at least she admits that shes lost it. Sounds like she needs some time in rehab or something. You need to draw a boundary for yourself. What is wrong with her associates that they are not seeing this and making her take time off? No matter - if she has cancelled twice, i would move on. Something is up, given all of this.

Eta - i wouldnt even do a final session - if she is using, whats the point?

Do you mean using as in, on drugs?

No, it isn't that - it's a gynaelogical problem.

I do know a reasonable amount about her past mental health issues, and feel bad sometimes for wondering do they have something to do with it? But if I have that information (and a person who was very close to me suffers from the same mental health condition, so I am very familiar with it) then I can't help but make links, sometimes.

feralkittymom · Apr 02, 2014, 09:03 AM

You know, even if things weren't weird, it just seems like all the knowledge you have about her does inhibit you, and that shortchanges you.

Perna · Apr 02, 2014, 09:08 AM

I think the job offer and this discussion of others paying for you/giving you money; your T's therapy "schemes" is too intrusive of you trying to do therapy to help yourself. Your therapy sessions need their own boundaries so you can work within them on your therapy and it sounds to me like your therapist is not providing that.

IndestructibleGirl · Apr 02, 2014, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by feralkittymom

You know, even if things weren't weird, it just seems like all the knowledge you have about her does inhibit you, and that shortchanges you.

Yep, but only since things took a drastically wrong turn three weeks ago. Before that, it made me feel very close to her in a good way. I loved her in a relaxing way that didn't cause me any angst. Now since things have gone pear shaped, it's very different.

I'm starting to think it all boils down to the absence of the traditional transaction in my therapy. I think she was (probably unconsciously) resentful of my not paying (why the flying ***** not work this out and be honest since I asked repeatedly if it was ok) and then started trying to manoevere a kind of bartering in return.

The ebay thing, the job thing, and as I see it suddenly telling me an awful lot about herself which was almost like the relationship bleeding towards friendship - all ways of trying to get something back from me. And then my starting to have romantic feelings, which I could perhaps interpret as my unconscious trying to find a way to 'pay her back' in kind (lol

) by being a good lover and a nurturing partner.

feralkittymom · Apr 02, 2014, 09:43 AM

That's a whole lot of insight there!

It's what I wish she could see!

IndestructibleGirl · Apr 02, 2014, 09:52 AM

I will be presenting her with these ideas tomorrow at the session. If she doesn't cancel again.

A shot of whiskey will be required to anaesthetize me beforehand, I think. Reason #1706683362 that my therapy is on unhealthy ground

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