Sorry. Had nowhere else to put this thought.

[StrongerMan]

Yes, I hate it that they motivate me to withdraw and isolate.

[learning1]

Interesting subject line.

[unaluna]

Im struggling with these this week. My t is like, eff them! And im like, no, i keep running away from them and they keep chasing me - i may as well turn around and face them so maybe they will shut up once and for all. And i did get to some new insights. Like my dad's always wanting to give in to my mother just to keep peace in the family, even tho he and i knew it was the wrong or crazy thing to do - how do you build a life on that? How do you grow right?

If we get a mixture of good and bad parenting growing up, I think shame isn't so huge.
We can withstand things, not take them as meaning we are bad.
Shame for me, begun at the start, when mother didn't acknowledge my right to existence, and didn't hold me enough. The body experiences that as shaming.
If we did get enough fundamental brick building in the beginning, than we feel hurt when things went wrong, as they do, but not life lasting shame.
Many of our conscious memories are smoke screens. The shame already existed. We try to master it by pin pointing things we felt were the culprit. It's easier than going back to the non verbal state when shame felt like a death

[JustShakey]

Yeah. This.
Mouse, one of my mother's favorite 'funny' stories is about when I was a too-big too-hungry baby who wouldn't let her get any sleep and how she solved the 'problem' by giving me baby rice at 5 days old. Another one is about how I was such a 'good' baby I never cried to be picked up, even when me and the crib were sopping wet. Small wonder I grew into a child who would cry by herself in a corner and an adult who can hardly stand to let anyone know how she really feels

(((BPA)))

I agree, they are both demotivating and motivating.

[Perna]

I'm right there with the fear thing. Am still learning to "accentuate the positive, eliminate the negative" in order to nullify the fear and shame. Thank you Johnny Mercer, Harold Arlen, and Bing Crosby:

You've got to accentuate the positive
Eliminate the negative
Latch on to the affirmative
Don't mess with Mister In-Between

You've got to spread joy up to the maximum
Bring gloom down to the minimum
Have faith or pandemonium
Liable to walk upon the scene

(To illustrate his last remark
Jonah in the whale, Noah in the ark
What did they do
Just when everything looked so dark)

Man, they said we better
Accentuate the positive
Eliminate the negative
Latch on to the affirmative
Don't mess with Mister In-Between
No, do not mess with Mister In-Between
Do you hear me, hmm?

(Oh, listen to me children and-a you will hear
About the elininatin' of the negative
And the accent on the positive)
And gather 'round me children if you're willin'
And sit tight while I start reviewin'
The attitude of doin' right

(You've gotta accentuate the positive
Eliminate the negative
Latch on to the affirmative
Don't mess with Mister In-Between)

You've got to spread joy (up to the maximum)
Bring gloom (down) down to the minimum
Otherwise (otherwise) pandemonium
Liable to walk upon the scene

To illustrate (well illustrate) my last remark (you got the floor)
Jonah in the whale, Noah in the ark
What did they say (what did they say)
Say when everything looked so dark

Man, they said we better
Accentuate the positive
Eliminate the negative
Latch on to the affirmative
Don't mess with Mister In-Between
No! Don't mess with Mister In-Between