[naya_d022]

About 4 months ago, I told my t, in an effort to understand why I did it, that I had facebook stalked her kids. She was extremely nice about it, but then told me in order for her to take care of my needs as best as possible, that facebook stalking her children needed to be a boundary and asked me not to do it again. I happily agreed.

Fast forward to about a month ago - she had to cancel because someone in her family died, and this meant I would have to go a month without talking to her. I was scared she was going to leave me, and angry that say, it was her husband's cousin who died, why she was canceling. Sooo I went on her daughter's (public) fb page to see who had died. My t later told me herself, it was her father.

Back then, I thought nothing of it because I didn't really feel like I had violated her boundary. But now, I am FREAKING OUT. Yesterday I went into this terrible depressive state where I felt like I deserved to be locked in my room, for violating her boundaries. We've been working on understanding these types of feelings and how they are from "yester-year," and so I really feel I need to talk about this with her. There is nothing we haven't been able to talk about (including my intense feelings and fantasies of her)

However, I am scared that this will be different - this was crossing the line. I would die if she left me, and even if she didn't - would this make things too weird for her?

She's been extremely understanding (We could even talk about when I've had fantasies about her as a mother with her children, as she agreed that this was not violating her boundary)

(Sorry for this whole long thing!) LONG STORY SHORT - Should I discuss it with her, because of the huge emotional beating I did to myself and this is a pattern I need to break (both that and compulsive fb stalking lol) OR will it make things too weird for her, and possibly need to end things?

(I should also mention that I just moved, and am in the process of finding a new therapist anyways, right now were having phone convos)

Thank you pscyhcentral community!!!

[UnderRugSwept]

I personally wouldn't talk to her about it now (if you think she might stop talking to you over it)...I mean, I think you need her support since you have moved and you probably have other things to talk about with her, and you are trying to find a new T as it is. How is your search going?

I do think, however, think that it's definitely something to be discussed when you find a new therapist. It sounds like your current T was already working with you on the origin of your need to search for more info. about her/her children. I think all of that is going to be important to discuss with a new T. I also think it is worth discussing how hard you are being on yourself for looking at her daughter's Facebook again.

Also, regarding your feelings of "her leaving you" (I find this a bit confusing)...are you ready to let go of her once you find a new T?

BTW, I can't imagine why your T's daughter's Facebook page is public, especially after you talked to your T about it?

[3xjj]

I agree. If people don't want information about their children out there, they shouldn't have a FB page. I don't think its a big deal. I look up people I know all the time. I wouldn't tell her.

[glitterrosez89]

I'm sure others will disagree with me on this, but I wouldn't even tell her that I was looking at her family members' Facebook pages. I think that any information someone willingly makes public on the internet is yours to look at if you desire. She can feel like it is a boundary violation if she wants, but I don't think it actually is. It's the internet, and her children put that information there of their own will. It's like you finding out on her LinkedIn where she went to school and then Googling her name + her school name to try to find information on activities she participated in while there. Maybe a bit creepy, but the information is there for anyone to access.

[RTerroni]

Interesting- I would say that borders on a boundary crossing but I am not sure if it is exactly a boundary crossing.

[NowhereUSA]

oh the murky lines of social media. in general, i take a 'public info is public' and i am a little shocked that she hasn't discussed privacy with her children (okay, maybe not shocked, but i am raising an eyebrow). besides that, i've always been under the impression that most of the boundary enforcement comes from the t (obvs, we can violate boundaries, but they are in charge of making sure they stay in place to some extent).

that said, if you're looking for a new t, i don't know that i would bring it up with her. i'd wait and have that conversation with my new t and discuss my fears of abandonment and what drew me to doing it.

[kororain]

I'm kind of that her daughter's page is public. That's on her and her daughter, not you.

[RedSun]

I agree with everyone, if you're going to have a new T then bring this up with them, not your current T. And maybe bring it up in the first session with new T if you can, so that they understand you need firm boundaries and structure. And that they need to keep their fb private!

[stopdog]

I think that this is not nearly as big of a deal as one might feel. And I would not bother telling the therapist about it. I do not believe any harm or wrong has been done here.

[glitterrosez89]

This is just my opinion, but I think the bigger boundary violation lies in telling the person you "stalked" them or their family members, rather than in actually doing it. For instance, there are several old articles I wrote while in college on the internet. I wish they would disappear, but I agreed to have them published. I know the articles are there, and anyone who Googles my name can access them. I even know that it's likely that, say a guy saw my online dating profile and took an interest in me, he would research my name and find them. However, the act of him telling me he read them would feel quite creepy and violating. The same goes if a guy decided to look at my sister's Facebook profile in search of pictures of me. The information is on the internet, and he's not doing anything really wrong...but I would rather he not shoot me a message, "Hey, by the way. Found your little sister on Facebook. You look great in her 5th profile picture!" because it would make me uncomfortable.

[Teepee]

Hi,

This is just my opinion, but I feel that yes while the profile was public you and T agreed this was a boundary you would not cross. There seems other ways you could have found that info by calling, texting or email. talking to her about why the need to know who had passed would have been more productive than the position you find yourself in now.

I also feel your trying absolve yourself from all responsibility by saying well it was public instead of it was public BUT I showed restraint and hounered a verbal agreement I had made.

I'm sorry if this comes across as harsh it's my honest opinion and I hope you can find peace with whatever path you decide to follow.

[Hellion]

I am not really sure looking at someones facebook page would cross anyones boundary....they can put stuff they don't want public so only friends or specific people can see it. If there where public posts about the death, then its not really stalking to have looked at it.

Stalking would be more following someone around via facebook, like going to all their groups, excessively sending them friends requests or like essentially not leaving them alone I thought.

If its bothering you that much it might be good to talk to her about it, and you aren't going to die if they stop seeing you, It would suck but if they would terminate therapy simply over you looking at their facebook it might be better for you in the end to have a more tolerant therapist or something.

[Lauliza]

I don't think it's a big deal that you looked at her daughters page. I agree with everyone who's said that the internet is public. I think Glitterrosez brings up a great point though - that telling the person is more of a "violation" for lack of a better term. Just like property records are public- you can go on most states' registry of deeds websites and look up mortgages, deeds, foreclosure info and everything else. Real estate agents do it to see what home sellers financial situations are. I didn't like it when I found out one had looked up mine, but it was her right to look. And that's not something in my control. FB isn't nearly that revealing, or it shouldn't be. It's something users have control over, so if your T didn't tighten her daughter's privacy settings that's on her, not on you. It's human nature to be curious and it's asking a lot to expect you not to look.

[RTerroni]

After thinking about this more, this was clearly NOT a boundary crossing since all of the information was freely out there and you didn't have to "hack" into a system (or use some other illegal means) to obtain the information.

[nottrustin]

My only issue is that she asked you not to do it again and you happily agreed. Yes facebook is a public but unless the child is an adult they are "innocent" bystander to her mothers profession. Trust is a two way street. Would you trust your T if she said she wouldn't do something and then did?

That being said, no I would not tell her that you did it again. I don't think there is anything to gain at this point by telling her considering that you are looking for a new T.

[glitterrosez89]

Heck, I've looked up my professors' addresses just because I was curious what types of areas they lived in. Not because I had any sexual interest in them or anything (most of my professors were women) but simply because I'm naturally curious about people...I like to know who they "are." It's really not THAT creepy of a thing to do, but would I go up to one of them and say, "I have a confession. I Googled your name, and now I know where you live..." No, because it's weird.

[Lauliza]

I just think with all the access to info via the internet combined with the amount of time spent online that the temptation to peek at profiles or look up information can be constant. I understand the OP agreed not to go on the FB page again and ideally maybe should have kept the promise, but is it realistic not to expect a slip up? I don't think so at all. It is the T's responsibility to be aware and in control of their (and their kid's) online presence, especially when their clients are younger and so into social media. So with that, I would not say anything. Doing so makes it more of an issue than it needs to be.

[musinglizzy]

She asked you not to do it again and you agreed. You had a weak moment during special circumstances. I wouldn't be THAT hard on yourself.

I know if I were a T, or doctor or teacher or cop or any other type of occupation where you are looked up to by others, or tick people off (cops, judges, lawyers, etc) you should explain to your kids about maintaining a private FB page. Although I am curious if her daughter is a minor or an adult....but if I were your T, as a mother, I would ask her children to keep their pages private. Chances are, pics of themselves, and/or personal information, will show up on those pages, and if public, it's fair game to the public. I do not have the type of occupation where I really NEED to be a private person, however my FB page has always been private.

[msxyz]

If people don't want others to know something about them they shouldn't put it online for everyone to read. I think if something is public it's fair game for everyone.

[glitterrosez89]

Frankly, I think telling someone not to look at a person's Facebook profile is stupid. The entire point of Facebook is for people to look at it. It's not that different from, if her daughter were a published author, her telling you, "Don't ever pick up a copy of my daughter's book and read it again."

It would be one thing if she got on her daughter's profile to block you, and then you created a separate page just to be able to view the profile once more. That is not what happened, though.

[BonnieJean]

Originally Posted by Lauliza

It is the T's responsibility to be aware and in control of their (and their kid's) online presence, especially when their clients are younger and so into social media. So with that, I would not say anything. Doing so makes it more of an issue than it needs to be.

older clients can be into social media too

[Lauliza]

Originally Posted by BonnieJean

older clients can be into social media too

Oops! Sorry, so true. I am one

[nottrustin]

Originally Posted by Akama

If people don't want others to know something about them they shouldn't put it online for everyone to read. I think if something is public it's fair game for everyone.

I think we also have personal responsibility. I kind of feel like the whole argument of if you don't want to be raped then don't wear revealing clothing. I am NOT saying what the op is doing is a crime. I just feel like we are blaming the child in this situation.

I have seen T and her son's FB page (he is 26 and we have a mutual friend)....but to blame him or T for would be inappropriate for ME...

[CameraObscura]

If I told my T I wouldn't do something, and then I did, I'd tell him. If I didn't, it would start to feel like a secret, and I turn secrets in on myself and feel like a terrible person. It's also very important to me that my T trust me, and I wouldn't be able to hide it and still have a good working relationship with him.

Since you're already looking for a new T, there's really little risk to you. Would you feel better telling her and leaving without that hanging between you, or just letting it go, forgiving yourself for making the mistake and moving on? Either way, I think you should bring it up with your next therapist.

[Lauliza]

Originally Posted by nottrustin

I think we also have personal responsibility. I kind of feel like the whole argument of if you don't want to be raped then don't wear revealing clothing. I am NOT saying what the op is doing is a crime. I just feel like we are blaming the child in this situation.

I have seen T and her son's FB page (he is 26 and we have a mutual friend)....but to blame him or T for would be inappropriate for ME...

I know we disagree here and of course everyone will have their own opinion on this.

I don't think this is a case of "blaming the victim" even though I can see how it looks that way at first. Her T might have felt victimized, but I don't think someone with more savvy about social media would have.

I have a personal example of this. A couple of years ago my pdoc suggested I go on a dating site. About 2 months after I sign up, who does the site match me up with but but my pdoc! So of course I click on his profile and read the whole thing and looked at his one picture. The site shows paying members who has looked at their profile, so knew that I had looked at his (he never looked at mine, but I think that would have been riskier). I was so afraid he'd be upset with me for looking and really wanted to talk to him about it, but I couldn't bring it up and he never did (he probably couldn't). Over time, we talked about my experiences dating in session and he's allude scenarios or give me dating/profile pointers. It became an unspoken thing that we knew, but didn't have to talk about. Talking about it openly might have created an issue out of something that didn't have to be one.

I was off the site for a while, but fast another year and I logged onto it again. My pdoc was still active on it, but now had a very different profile and more pictures (one even shirtless). The profile was more flirty and showed personality, where his original was very straightforward and dry. When I saw this new profile, I finally realized I hadn't invaded my doctor's privacy by looking at his profile after all. My pdoc clearly tailored his profile to show information and pictures that he was ok with me seeing. It's a weird gray area when you're on a social networking site. The information is out there and is meant to be seen, but for people in certain professions this isn't the kind of thing you'd always want clients seeing. My pdoc could've asked me not to look at his profile I suppose, but he's realistic enough to know it's human nature to be curious and we all have many moments of weakness. But he saw it as his responsibility to control what he put online, not my or his other patients' responsibility to keep from going on the site and reading his profile.