Stuck

I've been thinking a lot about the situation re. taking too many sleeping pills (which I will reinforce was not to harm myself and I didn't actually take enough to do any serious damage, and I did research beforehand to figure out exactly how much I could take that would lead to sleep but not any harm/death/coma, etc.). I think I was only so upset about T calling 911 because I felt helpless and powerless and like she was controlling me (even though I know that wasn't her intention and controlling me is something this T literally NEVER does). But it felt a lot like being a little kid and being punished in a way that really hurts you physically or emotionally "for your own good."

I know that wasn't T's intention, but she knows that hospitals are very traumatic places for me where I have been hurt physically and emotionally, so even more than that, it feels like being punished when you're a little kid by your parents in a way that harms you without them even giving you any warning that they were going to do that, and in fact if they had told you specifically that they would never punish you for doing x, but then punished you anyway. And I really don't like being in a situation at age twenty that makes me feel like a little kid. I still think if T had told me what she was going to do and helped prepare me for it, it would have been way less traumatic and wouldn't have felt like such a breach of trust.

And I told her this, but she refuses to make any commitment that I would need to make me feel emotionally safe. I'm not a child anymore and if she had rationally explained to me that she was worried about the medication I'd ingested and she would feel a lot less worried about me if I went to a walk-in clinic, or even the emergency room, I would have gone. But since she didn't trust me enough to even mention to me that she was thinking of calling 911, and since she didn't even consider less invasive options (like calling a mobile crisis team, which where I live is a police officer and a nurse who are trained in crisis situations and risk assessment, or calling the hospital that specializes in treating suicidal thoughts/behaviours - they also have a mobile crisis team that would have been way less traumatic than the police, since I am very afraid of police due to some bad situations when I was little). I asked T if she had even thought about other alternatives, any other options at all, and she said no, she hadn't...

And I suggested these other options to T, but she couldn't commit to even discussing them with me...so I feel stuck. Even if me feeling unsafe right now is irrational, I feel very, very unsafe. Pdoc thinks I can work things through with T, and I want to do that, but I think if T can't help me feel safe, even if my feelings of being unsafe are irrational, another T might be the only solution...

TRIGGER WARNING for this next part - I don't know how to use the new trigger warning system, so if a mod could edit this post to include it, I would appreciate that.

My feelings right now remind me of this kid I knew when I was little, who was about five or six, and to punish him his parents would pick him up without warning and carry him to the closet in their room and lock him inside. This was apparently done for "his own good," to "keep him safe," "help him calm down" when he was crying, etc. But this kid was terrified of the dark and of small spaces and he would cry and cry and cry and no one ever came to comfort him until he'd "stopped being defiant" (crying), which sometimes took hours.

And even though I know it's irrational to feel this way, it feels like T is picking me up without any warning whatsoever (and refusing to give me any warning whatsoever or any rules to follow so this won't happen) and carrying me to a dark closet that I'm terrified of and locking me inside until I'm ready to "be good" (not crying, not emotional, etc.). Probably this stems from some bad experiences of being restrained and physically harmed or threatened with physical harm in hospitals if I was crying or having serious anxiety, which T knows about, and I am absolutely terrified of being held down because my mother used to do that to me when I was little until I would have a panic attack and start hyperventilating.

And I've had that exact same experience in a psych ward, of crying so hard I couldn't breathe and then being restrained to "calm me down" instead of being comforted, which is what I needed at that moment. And even though I know T was just trying to do the right thing, it's SCARY, and I don't know if I can work through this with her if I'm always scared that doing the wrong thing (or if she feels like I'm doing the wrong thing, and maybe I won't even know what that wrong thing is) will lead to a super traumatic situation. I just feel so exhausted...

Sending hugs...

What were you thinking she'd do when you told her?

I ask because I cannot imagine a rational, professional, safe course of action other than the one she chose. The mobile crisis team can't treat an overdose. An overdose is a medical emergency. I don't think a decent therapist (or really any decent person with good judgement) would be willing to bet your life on your assessment as to what may or may not constitute a non-lethal overdose. And I think on some level you must know that.

It sounds like you might be trying to replay something from your past in hopes of getting what you need this time. Maybe this time you'll be comforted. Maybe this time your attachment person will come through for you the way you need her to. But this isn't a safe way to do that. Can you talk to her about finding another way that she can give you the reassurance and comforting that you need?

The only thing I see that comes out of that sort of thing is interference, sometime aggressive and police state sorts. Telling those guys, unless one wants interference, is not something I would recommend. There is nothing wrong with wanting them to interfere, but if a client does not want it, don't tell them.

What was the purpose of telling her?

Yeah, as hard as it sounds I kind of get her reaction- if you let her know after the over-dose she didn't have much options left, did she? If you two discussed it beforehand, she could have reacted differently (at least told you what she'd do). Did you discuss this possibility beforehand so she knew it's not an attention call?

I consider myself very lucky that I have found a T that lets me talk about anything/everything and yet won't interfere with my choices. We spent several sessions discussing that and I know he can deal with knowing I'm probably going to do stg "stupid" and he understands that I don't want him interfering when I tell him. It helps me tremendously to be able to discuss even this without the fear of repercussions (I understand it puts extra pressure on my T to know there is a possibility that I won't come to our next session).

However, we have a different legal/medical system here. In my country, when you pay for T out of pocket (therapy is covered by insurance so very few ppl do that) there is no official record of you seeing a T- i.e. no legal action if a client commits sui- and it is up to a T to decide whether he can live with that or not.

I didn't tell her on purpose; she asked me I'd slept the night before (she usually asks me this, and the answer is usually no), and I said no, and she asked if I took the sleeping pills, and I said yes, and she asked how many (because pdoc said if one didn't work I could take two or three) and I said a couple times the dose pdoc suggested, but not enough to do any damage at all, which I knew because I had looked up exactly how much you could safely take to cause sleep without causing harm. She asked if I thought I should go to the hospital, I said no, and she dropped the subject.

If at that moment she had said she was very concerned about me and I needed to go to the hospital and call her when I was there, I would have gone. Even if she had told me in that moment that she was going to call a mobile crisis unit (accessed through 911 but not as traumatizing as police) and let's discuss ways to stay emotionally safe in the hospital, that would have been okay too. But she didn't give me any warning, and that was the problem.

And for the record, I was at the hospital for less than two hours; they didn't seem to think taking a few too many sleeping pills was worthy of their time/taxpayer money. They asked me how many I'd taken, if I was trying to kill myself, if I wanted to kill myself now, and if I'd noticed any side effects, to which I said no. They didn't even do a blood test. They just sent me home, because in the quantity I took it, the medication will NOT hurt you. So it was a moot point.

So she called the police without letting you know. The police came to her office?

Sounds like you're in a painful place. It's hard when people only see the actions and not the person behind them.

No, they were waiting at my door when I went home after my session. If she'd called them to her office after telling me she was going to do that, I probably would have been a lot calmer.

I know that she did what she did out of care, and I'm not mad at her about it, and I still do appreciate the role she has in my life. I just don't feel very safe right now. That's all. I know it's irrational, but it's how I feel.

T and I had discussed it in the past and she had told me many times that if she ever needed to call anyone, she would tell me first...and then she didn't. And she says she might or might not in the future, which just feels scary to me. I can't handle other people making decisions for me and feeling out of control without them even talking to me about it. It's just triggering. Irrational, yes, but it's how I feel.

A mobile crisis unit = a nurse and a police officer specially trained in crisis intervention. They will come to your home or wherever, do a risk assessment, and transport you to a hospital if necessary. BUT they are trained to minimize the traumatic potential of such an action because they are experts in crisis situations like suicide risk, ie they will be calmer and less threatening. And I will repeat, T could have still called whoever she wanted but told me she was going to do it and then discussed things I could do while in the hospital to feel safer.

I don't understand what you mean in your last paragraph. Can you explain?

I'm so very sorry this happened, I find her behaviour ridiculous... So much so that it'd be a reason for me to terminate. Sorry, I know it's not much helpful but man I'd be so angry, hurt and betrayed by this (over)reaction and I'd never be able to trust her again.

Maybe you should be spending the same amount of time looking at your actions that you have been on what your T should have or not should have done. It wasn't about the amount of pills you took, it was about the total picture. You are not sleeping you acted impulsively and without caring about the consequences.

Next time what do you need to do to get different results, the results you are looking for?

You say you're are not a child but your actions say other wise, you had a tantrum and wanted someone to cuddle and care for you. Your T did care for you, you just don't like the way she did it. It sounds like you were playing games, presenting one thing to your T then turning around at the hospital and denying everything. The hospitals don't care, if you want to deny things they will accept what you say at face value, there're many people who want help that they would rather deal with. your T does care. You keep saying she should have told you, but from your previous post it doesn't sound like you were listening. You did not leave her with much in the way of options.

I don't think it's irrational. It sounds perfectly sensible to me that you'd feel that way. It would also bother me that she won't discuss with you why she chose the option she did rather than calling a mobile crisis team.

If she is part of a group practice, they may have rules about what a therapist has to do if she thinks a client is in danger.

She could have called a poison control hotline or your pdoc while you were in her office to verify whether or not you needed medical attention.

I suppose it depends on how much she helps you and how strong your attachment is to her, but I think I would have to change therapists. I don't think I'd be able to trust that she wouldn't do the same thing again in the future.

Oh - I think that 20 years old is an age when we are really beginning to expect to be treated as adults and are maybe extra-offended when someone doesn't do that, or we feel like they don't. I think that's a healthy part of growing up.

T was worried. She had a right to be worried; it's understandable that she was worried; I don't blame her for being worried; I'm not mad at her for being worried. But the simple fact is that I don't feel safe with her anymore. I don't know if it's possible for me to just turn that feeling off, even though I KNOW the feeling is irrational. So what do I do? I recognize where she was coming from, I empathize with that, but I still feel the way I feel.

Also, just for the record, pdoc would never give me any type of pill (or enough of any pill) that it would be dangerous in overdose, and T knows that, and she's talked about it with him. Pdoc usually gives me a one to two week supply of pills; the sleeping pills he perscribed for me yesterday he gave me would require about 300 or so to be even a little bit dangerous upon overdose, and he gave me only 21 (because I can take up to three per night, but even overdosing on those (which I'm not planning on doing) wouldn't hurt me. If I took all 21 in one night, I might feel dizzy, maybe a bit nauseous, but that's the most it would do. Pdoc isn't an idiot and knows better than to give me any pills that could seriously hurt me.

Your are right, the person who I quoted above.! Here is something my ex threaten suicide or to kill me (taking too many pills of anything is dangerous and if I knew someone who did that and didn't go the hospital I would call 911, Because I'd automatically think suicide ! ) I had to call his family member and the police on him!!!

It's dangerous to take more the recommend dose of any medication, she did this because she cares and doesn't want anything to happen to you!

I'd called emergency services on any who told me what you told your T, because I don't want someone to die as I'd care about humans and do not want to get sued for criminal negligence.

What you did could be dangerous and those are consequences, because any medication can harm you!!! Why did you take so much? Maybe look at that many other things you can take to help
You sleep! ?!?



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Something doesn't add up here. You took 6 measly pills the night before, then attended your therapy session the next day, all was fine, but when you got home, there were police there to greet you and took you into custody and forced you to the hospital?

And now your therapist says she is not qualified to help you?

Something else happened or is going on.

No, I took maybe fifteen pills. More than I should have, but definitely not enough to kill me. I think it just scared her because it was a reckless thing to do...or maybe she genuinely thinks I was trying to kill myself and didn't believe me when I said I wasn't (even though I really wasn't, and if I had tried to kill myself I probably would have been much smarter about it).

I think it just scared her, because I've had lots of sui thoughts in the past (but never acted on them), and it was probably reasonable for her to be scared...but she also could have called pdoc and asked him if taking 15 of those pills (or even all the pills he had given me, which was a two week supply) would seriously harm me. He would have said no (I talked to him about it yesterday and he said yeah, I shouldn't have taken an overdose of those pills, but no, they wouldn't actually so much damage at that dose other than making me a bit dizzy). That would have been the end of it. And if she was so worried that she thought I needed to go to the hospital, she could have just said that to me and I probably would have gone, or at least to a walk in clinic.

This is the T who said that she couldn't help you anymore?

If so, did she say that before or after this incident?

Yes, after.

Gosh. Trust is such a precarious thing. I'm sorry. She could have warned you.

Again though, more may be going on. Maybe your T lost a former client to a sleeping pill overdose?

That would NOT have been the end of it with my pdoc or my therapist. They take these kinds of self-destructive actions very seriously and should as far as I'm concerned. Even if the amount was not lethal, the action would have been considered serious and probably would have warranted hospitalization because, if this had been me, something would have been seriously out of whack.