[substancelessblue]

*Trigger warning* Please, I will mention a couple of details about this and I don't want it to hurt anyone.

I have been seeing T for 2.5 years now and had never mentioned this. Last session I mentioned an argument with my dad where I had escaped to my room and blocked the door so he couldn't get in (no locks). He was standing outside threatening me, etc, and all of a sudden I felt like a child, very small and helpless, and petrified that he would hit me as he did when I was younger.

T then assumed it was abuse, I think, although she didn't label it but asked me a lot of questions. I told her it was just for punishment, even though the idea of hitting children for discipline sickens me. But I accept that that was done then (I'm in my mid-20s), even though I still have a lot of feelings about it, and am angry at my dad and always anxious around him. She said, "It's not allowed now, at all" even though laws in our country still do permit it.

I suppose it's just confusing - does it mean I'm in denial? Was it really abuse? Will T make me see it as abuse? He would hit me repeatedly at once, but not leave permanent marks, just very sore raised skin and burning/stinging. He would also yank down my clothing a lot of the time. I had a lot of fear and would cry hysterically. But I more see it as an ineffective - and reprehensibly violent - way to control children.

Plus, I feel guilty thinking of it as abuse as it could have been much worse. I'm confused as I haven't mentioned it to T in all our sessions together and am torn between thinking that she's irritated I didn't mention it before - if it's had an impact on my current problems - and thinking she views it as unfortunate but normal and that I was just overreacting.

I'm sorry for the long post but I'm not seeing T for a while and need a little feedback.

[AllHeart]

To me, using excess force in anyway is abusive. What you describe above does sound like it was abuse, yes. Whether you classify it as abuse or not, it definitely seemed to cause you trauma. Did your t discuss PTSD or cPTSD with you at all?

[substancelessblue]

Originally Posted by AllHeart

To me, using excess force in anyway is abusive. What you describe above does sound like it was abuse, yes. Whether you classify it as abuse or not, it definitely seemed to cause you trauma. Did your t discuss PTSD or cPTSD with you at all?

Thank you, that's helpful. No, she hasn't. She's very anti-label in general, which I'm not too sure about, but I guess I'll figure out what she thinks through her questions.

[BayBrony]

1 . T's are quite used to people not disclosing things til late in the game. I am sure she understands that.
2. If you still have strong feelings about it in your mid 20s and from what you described, it sounds abusive. It is definitely not normal parental behavior
3. If your T pursues it you should ask how they think it jscrelated to your current issues.
4. Most Ts won't "force" you to label something as abuse but they will definitely encourage you to repeatedly examine things if they think they have had a detrimental effect on you
5. Its quite possible you are in denial. I still find it difficult to label my childhood experiences as abuse Even though they were by any standard abusive
Generally normal childhood discipline is forgotten and fades into the general fabric of our childhood. Things that stand out the way your experiences stand out are generally traumatic

[Argonautomobile]

I can see why your T would be concerned. I would definitely consider what you describe as abuse, and your current situation doesn't seem especially healthy to me, either. One should not have to blockade oneself in a room to avoid real or even imagined physical harm. I think your T was worried about you.

That said, it's not up to me, or your T, or anyone else to define your reality for you. You have the right to define for yourself what you consider abuse. I would discuss everything you bring up here with your T.

Good luck and stay safe.

Just want to say that I've experienced somewhat similar repeated physical punishment like you describe and identify with your struggles on "was it bad enough to be abuse?" despite believing that such punishment is reprehensible towards children.

Culture and laws permit it in my country too.

It's definitely a struggle in the mind.

[stopdog]

I have found therapists to over-react.

[healingme4me]

They haven't had my oldest to raise.

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[substancelessblue]

Hmm okay, I guess I shouldn't have mentioned it to her. I feel very silly now.

[awkwardlyyours]

At my first session with my T, I started off saying 'Yeah, so I had a normal childhood / family etc. I just need some help with blah blah blah..'. And, then I spoke about my childhood and family etc. At the end of the first session T just looked at me and categorically said that what I'd called normal was really abusive. I flinched then but didn't tell her anything -- she didn't mention the abuse word again for a really long time i.e., until I came to terms with it myself (which took the better part of a year).

I also grew up in a country and culture where this stuff wasn't even remarked upon (let alone seen as something bad) -- with my T, I explored the cultural stuff (I chose her in large part because she traces her heritage to that general part of the world, although not the same country as me). And so, I really wanted someone who wouldn't label everything as 'cultural differences' but at the same time, also would be sensitive about using a norm that's really US or Western-centric.

I'm happy to say that she's been pretty awesome on that front -- when she's unsure, since she doesn't know the specifics of my culture, she's often stopped herself and asked me if anything I was saying was part of a broader cultural phenomenon etc (usually, I'd use the examples of friends, other extended family members to tell her what I thought the norm was). And, so we figured out over time that using any cultural norm, the stuff I'd gone through was well past the realm of 'normal' and yep, abusive.

That's not to say at all that it'll be the same for you -- I totally agree with those who've posted saying that it's your journey to name things or not and no one, including a T, should force you to do that.

[divine1966]

I am sorry you endured this as a child. In my opinion what you described is abuse

My fiancée endured physical punishment as a child/teen. When he told me I fell so awful that I cried and felt disturbed, my parents aren't perfect but I can't even imagine them beating me up.

My fiancée said he knows it caused him a lot of emotional damage ( he is afraid to speak his mind to people and he married and stayed married to physically abusive woman) but he still says his dad just didn't know better and it was a common thing in his circles (he grew up in poverty). We are same age yet it's not common in my family or anyone I grew up with.

My t believes any treatment that's not perfect is abuse. She always says "it's abuse" about any minor thing. Certainly if I ever mentioned physical altercation she would say it is "abuse"



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[kecanoe]

Originally Posted by substancelessblue

Hmm okay, I guess I shouldn't have mentioned it to her. I feel very silly now.

I hope you don't feel too silly. IMO you were right to mention it. Now you can explore if it was traumatic to you. If yes, you can work on that, if no, then you can move on to something else.

[CantExplain]

Originally Posted by substancelessblue

Hmm okay, I guess I shouldn't have mentioned it to her. I feel very silly now.

I think you were right to mention it.

[feralkittymom]

It sounds to me as though you know emotionally how badly it affected you; cognitive acceptance takes longer. I will say that when discussing similar issues of physical punishment with my T, he specifically asked whether clothing was removed before hitting me because that indicated a different abusive dynamic.

[stopdog]

I have not heard that about being clothed or not. The two I see have not really asked about a lot of detail. I am curious about the reason a therapist consider it indicated different abusive dynamic.
I never considered the corporal punishment abusive. I mention this because, although the therapists gasp some if I give them a brief overview, I don't think it was unusual for the times and don't remember it as all that bad.
So I always am wondering if the idea of something can be abusive if not considered so by the parties involved.

Originally Posted by substancelessblue

*Trigger warning* Please, I will mention a couple of details about this and I don't want it to hurt anyone.

I have been seeing T for 2.5 years now and had never mentioned this. Last session I mentioned an argument with my dad where I had escaped to my room and blocked the door so he couldn't get in (no locks). He was standing outside threatening me, etc, and all of a sudden I felt like a child, very small and helpless, and petrified that he would hit me as he did when I was younger.

T then assumed it was abuse, I think, although she didn't label it but asked me a lot of questions. I told her it was just for punishment, even though the idea of hitting children for discipline sickens me. But I accept that that was done then (I'm in my mid-20s), even though I still have a lot of feelings about it, and am angry at my dad and always anxious around him. She said, "It's not allowed now, at all" even though laws in our country still do permit it.

I suppose it's just confusing - does it mean I'm in denial? Was it really abuse? Will T make me see it as abuse? He would hit me repeatedly at once, but not leave permanent marks, just very sore raised skin and burning/stinging. He would also yank down my clothing a lot of the time. I had a lot of fear and would cry hysterically. But I more see it as an ineffective - and reprehensibly violent - way to control children.

Plus, I feel guilty thinking of it as abuse as it could have been much worse. I'm confused as I haven't mentioned it to T in all our sessions together and am torn between thinking that she's irritated I didn't mention it before - if it's had an impact on my current problems - and thinking she views it as unfortunate but normal and that I was just overreacting.

I'm sorry for the long post but I'm not seeing T for a while and need a little feedback.

I want to reply to this but will have to wait til i get home. For now - i relate.

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[Lauliza]

Originally Posted by stopdog

I have not heard that about being clothed or not. The two I see have not really asked about a lot of detail. I am curious about the reason a therapist consider it indicated different abusive dynamic.
I never considered the corporal punishment abusive. I mention this because, although the therapists gasp some if I give them a brief overview, I don't think it was unusual for the times and don't remember it as all that bad.
So I always am wondering if the idea of something can be abusive if not considered so by the parties involved.

I think it's possible for a situation to be abusive even if abused person doesn't agree. That said, I think there are situations that vary by the culture of the family and the context. Many people believe that spanking children in any way is abusive, but technically it's not. In those cases I think that Ts should back off the label of abuse unless the client gives them reason not to.

[substancelessblue]

Oh, I hadn't seen these sensitive replies - thank you. I felt very foolish after two responses earlier so gave up on this forum. I feel a little better now, although still very insecure. Thank you everyone for the effort.

[stopdog]

Perhaps I am confused - were you upset the therapist thinks it is abuse or were you meaning something else? Certainly physical acts to a child can be abuse and often are. I thought you meant the therapist was over-reacting and I was agreeing I find that they do so to what I report and so I find it completely possible for a therapist to overreact in general. On the other hand, if things were bad for you and the therapist is trying to agree with you - I would say go with that - no need to think it wasn't that bad or it was normal.

[MobiusPsyche]

Originally Posted by stopdog

I have not heard that about being clothed or not. The two I see have not really asked about a lot of detail. I am curious about the reason a therapist consider it indicated different abusive dynamic.
I never considered the corporal punishment abusive. I mention this because, although the therapists gasp some if I give them a brief overview, I don't think it was unusual for the times and don't remember it as all that bad.
So I always am wondering if the idea of something can be abusive if not considered so by the parties involved.

Humiliation of removing clothing as well as corporal punishment. Taking away dignity by removing clothing is not necessary to administer corporal punishment. Just my interpretation.

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[stopdog]

Originally Posted by MobiusPsyche

Humiliation of removing clothing as well as corporal punishment. Taking away dignity by removing clothing is not necessary to administer corporal punishment. Just my interpretation.

Sent from my mobile device using Tapatalk.

Ah - for me I always understood humiliation to simply be integral to the whole thing.
But as I misunderstood what the OP was going for, my take on it is not as closely aligned as I had thought to the OP. I don't disagree that what the OP described would be considered abusive today.