I went to a psychiatrist 5 days ago and he gave me a depression diagnoses and another one which I strongly disagree with.

Careful, this is triggering (I don't know how to use the "hide/show text" feature yet)

I talked about it with my therapist today, and he told me that "diagnoses are for life". He elaborated "While one can recover and not appear to have the diagnoses, it's a matter of states in life. Such as when depression has a tendency to appear in specific moments of life, or when specific personality traits appear at specific moments of life..."

At that moment I understood what he meant. But right now I feel frustrated from that statement.
Though he said that kind of statement, I talked about erasing that diagnosis from my record and he said that's not something difficult to do, though in case of depression it's more difficult since there's an AD prescription. It's ok, I don't really mind the depression diagnosis. I pointed out that I should pretty much ignore that diagnosis, and he agreed, that it doesn't really mean anything...

While I sanely know that those diagnoses are just titles, I'm very frustrated when he implied that other diagnosis still has a hold over me. It was a story of the past!

[chihirochild]

I respectfully disagree with your therapist. People in the mental health field put waaaaay too much faith in the DSM-5 and its ability to identify and distinguish between different diagnoses. Furthermore, there is some subjectivity involved in the diagnosis of mental illness (as there is in any clinical diagnosis), which leaves room for error on the end of the "diagnoser." So it's not impossible for a diagnosis to be mistakenly applied. Furthermore, people change. Sometimes people are initially given a diagnosis of one thing, and then develop further symptoms at which time it becomes clear that a different diagnosis is more appropriate (e.g. someone who first presented with depression and then has an episode of mania will lose their diagnosis of depression and gain a diagnosis of bipolar II).

And this stuff changes with each revision. That means that peoples' diagnoses change when a whole bunch of dudes sit around a table and argue about it. For example, here's a table comparing the DSM-IV to the DSM-5 with regards to personality disorders: http://www.psi.uba.ar/academica/carr...terial/dsm.pdf. (Not to mention the fact that the change from DSM-IV to DSM-5 led to the replacement of "chronic pain" with "somatic symptom disorder," which implies a psychiatric cause for many people who have pain of physical origin https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4459242/)

[Erebos]

..what chichi said.

On a simpler note, diagnosis and methods for attaining them are constantly changing so that kind of sweeping statement is unhelpful if not damaging.

I have seen several psychiatrists, and had three different diagnosis, only two of the5 in agreement.

My current pdoc has refused to diagnose, simply treating symptoms as they arise, and helping to provisioning techniques to my more stubborn behavioural traits.

I guess I am saying it depends on who you see.

[VanGore28]

I am glad my psych nevr diagnosed me when I was 18 because they spoke to my parents behind my back even though they really should have asked my permission first.
She diagnosed a psychotic break, not the schizoaffective label now have. My parents would have more than freaked. My mother would have reaped the sympathy in telling people mind you. They wouldn't have wanted me staying with them.
I guess a diagnoses is necessary evil, so you can be treated accordingly

[The_little_didgee]

Diagnoses are often wrong. The attitude that they are for life can be very damaging especially in this circumstance. Condemning one to a wrong diagnosis indicates to me that the clinician cannot think critically, is rigid and lacks optimism.

When I talked to him about that diagnosis on the phone a few days ago, he said that sometimes psychiatrists mark a two-letter mark near a diagnosis for instance, to indicate uncertainty about the diagnosis, and that it doesn't really mean anything.
It's very odd to me that all of a sudden he point out a different perspective.

My mind understands that statement, yet my feelings hate it. I didn't feel bad about it during the meeting, only afterwards.

I'll get to the point - how much should I listen to my feelings regarding my therapist? While he's given me great tools, such as being more assertive, I have mixed feelings about him and things he says at times. I mean, I don't care, he's just a therapist. But... can anyone help me out on deciding?

I remember in one of our first meetings, I stated that I am frustrated with how the mental health system has an impact on governmental careers and that I want to change that. He said "The question is what are you gonna do about it?", "I admire your fighting spirit, but it's just that there's not much you can do about it", something like those quotes.

Is he being "realistic" with me, or putting me down like I sometimes feel he does...?

[chihirochild]

Ack. That's a dilemma.

Personally, I believe that many therapists fail to appreciate narratives of inequality and social justice, and therefore fail respond appropriately when clients bring up these issues in therapy (e.g. government stigma against mental illness like you mentioned; another common one is the psychological effects of racism, which has been studied a bunch). However, this view is not always shared by the folks in charge, for some reasons that I agree with and some that I think are stupid. (To me, it makes sense that you don't want to ostracize your clients by, like, insulting their political party, which is particularly relevant for the tabula rasa folks... and a T using their close relationship with a client to influence their political views/voting is just gross... but also some people just don't see and understand inequality and dismiss it out of hand, which is stupid). Anyway, this controversy means that this stuff is not often taught to therapists in training.

So... I think I get why your therapist is saying "there's not much you can do about it" because realistically you by yourself cannot change the existing situation about mental health and government hiring. But an alternative way for him to respond to that would be like I dunno "that's hella frustrating and unfair. I believe that's part of a whole cultural narrative about how mental illness is bad and shameful. Are there other parts of your life where you experience this kind of thing?" " Or "I agree--people with mental illness have a lot to offer, and it's dumb that the gvmt chooses not to hire people based on their diagnoses. Do you have any thoughts about how to put your 'fighting spirit' into action?" I think that this approach does a better job of validating your feelings (which are legit) and exposing some of the harmful underpinnings of our society (which makes them easier to fight, easier to choose not to believe).

Buuuuut I don't actually have any real expertise in this, so maybe ignore me and/or tell your therapist how you feel when he says crap like that and see what happens? Or maybe check out these folks who actually know what's up:

https://counseling-csj.org
http://www.txca.org/images/tca/Templ...ng_concern.pdf
PsySR: Psychologists for Social Responsibility

[chihirochild]

(sometimes I think my most accurate diagnosis would be "major depressive disorder with socialist features"...)

I highly appreciate your informative and supportive response, but please do not diagnose me. While my mind understands it, my heart can't take it anymore.
I realistically by myself can truly do nothing about it. It's obvious it requires union. The problem is however, that the mental health profession is global, so it has to start from the internet.

In one of the first meetings, I talked about how I feel I don't really have social anxiety. He asked "Why do you think that way?", looking at his pad, writing.
I explained with lots of details, but he just continued to write without responding. He's keeping diagnoses of me inside him without telling me. He's trying to mask it with "I don't use diagnoses", but when I once vented about my anxiety diagnoses, he said "But the anxiety is not you!".
Makes me feel like he's keeping negative views about me inside.

I REALLY feel like terminating. I'm sick of his hidden negativity.

[chihirochild]

I meant my diagnosis for myself; like what I think my own diagnosis should be. I was being silly.

Originally Posted by chihirochild

I meant my diagnosis for myself; like what I think my own diagnosis should be. I was being silly.

It's ok.
I have to say you've been very informative to me. I loved your replies.
Can we discuss privately about the matter as it's off topic?

Just my opinion from observation:

If you don't feel comfortable around him for whatever reason, then you can always get a new one. It's an option, and that's okay. Plenty of people do it. I mean, there are plethora of therapists out there, some of whom you'll click with and some of whom you won't. I'm not going to say "well, you should really stick with this therapist because of XYZ." Every therapist has his or her methods and demeanor. But I do think he means well (my opinion); it's just the manner in which he chooses to word things you don't like (and I can see why some of his clients like yourself may feel that way).

That said, I don't think any therapist keeps negative views about their clients unless the client specifically does something worthy of a negative view, namely lying or exaggerating for personal gain. For example, lying about having ADHD to get stimulants. But I don't think a therapist would hold a negative view of you just because you disagree with something they said. (Just my opinion.)

Good luck wth whatever you decide

[CantExplain]

Originally Posted by Vibrating Obsidian

I went to a psychiatrist 5 days ago and he gave me a depression diagnoses and another one which I strongly disagree with.

Careful, this is triggering (I don't know how to use the "hide/show text" feature yet)

I talked about it with my therapist today, and he told me that "diagnoses are for life". He elaborated "While one can recover and not appear to have the diagnoses, it's a matter of states in life. Such as when depression has a tendency to appear in specific moments of life, or when specific personality traits appear at specific moments of life..."

At that moment I understood what he meant. But right now I feel frustrated from that statement.
Though he said that kind of statement, I talked about erasing that diagnosis from my record and he said that's not something difficult to do, though in case of depression it's more difficult since there's an AD prescription. It's ok, I don't really mind the depression diagnosis. I pointed out that I should pretty much ignore that diagnosis, and he agreed, that it doesn't really mean anything...

While I sanely know that those diagnoses are just titles, I'm very frustrated when he implied that other diagnosis still has a hold over me. It was a story of the past!

They say you never stop being an alcoholic, but you CAN stay sober.
Perhaps that's what your T meant?

Originally Posted by CantExplain

They say you never stop being an alcoholic, but you CAN stay sober.
Perhaps that's what your T meant?

*trigger warning, venting too*

It's not really about understanding what he meant. That statement he said was TOO bold! "Mental diagnoses are for life" - no one wants to hear that! That's an out-dated pessimistic outlook!
Why am I frustrated with that statement?
Well, it's a personal case. I'm frustrated with mental "health". Why? Because you're literally considered mentally healthy so long as you don't go to a mental health professional. Once you do and get a diagnosis, according to my therapist, "You are ill for life." It's like a double punishment - you get hurt, you stay that way!
I'd also go through the usual criticisms inside therapy about behaviors. I mean, there are many positive feedbacks, too, but sometimes mental health treatments feels like "You have a problem, we're gonna have to put you in chains so you won't go wrong", yet many people outside do wrong things and are usually not "chained" for that. They are let loose. I want to grow stronger, not just feel like I'm chained on a mental health support machine when I also want out.
I was to meet my therapist yesterday, but unfortunately my bus didn't arrive at all. Would've talked to him about this, but I'll have to wait till Sunday.

[Dawntreader]

So a bunch of 'mental health professionals' (most of whom are far more ill than their clients ever will be) write a book in which they make up labels which go a little like this:

Is it yellow, round and hot? Well then it is the sun. Forget that there are yellow, round and hot things that are not the sun (like the base of a light bulb, or a pancake in a pan) and forget that the sun isn't really yellow. According to the DSM, if it's yellow, round and hot, it is the sun.

The DSM is written below the level of a children's book.

Most therapists are charlatans, and nobody should ever let one dictate their reality. 'Mental illness' is still mostly misunderstood, hence the stupid symptom cluster system of their so called 'diagnosis'.

This is why most people who like therapy are attached to their therapists. Therapy offers nothing more than somebody who pretends to care in 50 minute increments for people who really want to pay someone to pretend to care.

The whole thing is a lie built on a delusion.

I draw attention to the statement about 'diagonses for life.' I agree with this. One doesn't get cured from their mental illness although they can be in a state of recovery which I take to mean the stage approaching stability. I am never going to not be bipolar. I have had to accept that.

*as less triggering as possible*

My only concern is regarding politics, government works and other workplaces, which take those superficial labels... very deeply. It's sad, and I feel like fighting this. It's one of humanity's disgraces, we're should be civilized and united, not kick each other out because of increasingly self-centered lifestyles (gen Y+) and foolish stigmas.
I'm also concerned about the statement my therapist said. It's too bold, raises many feelings and contradicts his statements of not following mental diagnoses...

Right now I have some feelings of laughing about him and saying to myself "Boy... how stupid he is... (the therapist)".
Although sometimes I wonder if he has a hidden purpose with all this mind and feeling-rambling.

[kecanoe]

I have a diagnosis that many people would think weird-but I have no intention of telling my employer nor the government about it. I guess if I were to apply for disability benefits, I would have to tell the government. But other than that, it is none of anyone else's business. I do think that a potential employer would hesitate to hire me if I was completely honest.

So I guess I don't understand what your t meant about it following you. I mean, it's not like I have to wear a sign saying "I have DID".

Originally Posted by kecanoe

I have a diagnosis that many people would think weird-but I have no intention of telling my employer nor the government about it. I guess if I were to apply for disability benefits, I would have to tell the government. But other than that, it is none of anyone else's business. I do think that a potential employer would hesitate to hire me if I was completely honest.

So I guess I don't understand what your t meant about it following you. I mean, it's not like I have to wear a sign saying "I have DID".

My therapist is to blame. He said things which only induce such anxiety I'm having.
Overall, it seems my therapist is only increasing my anxiety and keeping me more stuck, I'll tell him that I feel like terminating because of all the feelings he's putting me into.
Another thing I don't like about him, is whenever I talk about an interpersonal scenario I experienced, he'll often "jump" with critical remarks like "that shows hostility", or "I'm not sure if that was a good thing to say", without asking me why!!
This is emotionally frustrating!

Yesterday I had our session.
I talked about his "The diagnosis are for life" statement. He kept denying he ever said it. I kept insisting that he did, and that I have a phenomenal memory of conversations. He replied with an "OK", looking side-downwards.
I ranted about that and other things.

This is another thing which I find frustrating. I don't feel frustrated, but something in me tells me I should.
He either tries to deny it, or talks so casually during the session that he can't remember or doesn't even know what he's saying.

I need help on this, I don't want to be stuck up with someone who may be a fraud. I still have mixed feelings about and in myself.

[lucozader]

That's not good, denying that he said something is far too close to gaslighting...

One thing I don't get about therapy is why on Earth does one have to go downhill to get better?
It's been like this with my first therapist, too (saw him at ages of 13-17). But this time it just doesn't feel right at all.
And why does it have to take so long after laying out as many cards as possible? Is he fudging the sessions on purpose, for the money?

[kecanoe]

i would be questioning his skill, saying dumb things like "your diagnosis follows you for life" and then saying he didn't say that. Or maybe just a bad fit for,you if he can't say things so that you can hear what he really means. Some people just don't express themselves well, which doesn't make them an awful person, but would make them not my t.