taking away out of session contact

As some of you may know I've written about this in other threads. For most of my relationship with my t he has been very responsive to me outside of session. Text emails phone calls all of it. Until last year. For whatever reason... I've speculated a lot of different things ... he had started to respond less and less until now he does not respond to most everything. We have discussed this many times, and he has explained.to me what his thinking is. He did admit to Me that he should have been more clear

This is not a therapy horror story though. Yes it hurt like hell when I slowly realized he was pulling away in this manner. I was distraught about it for over 6 months in varying degrees. but, through this process I have started to really see the nature of our relationship differently. I became very comfortable with the fact that my t was close to me and in such a way that I felt special and truly cared for in a parental way. When this started happening for me, I began to become disillusioned with the whole reason I was in therapy. Suddenly, all I cared about was my therapist and how he felt about me. I think what happened with me was that I got caught up in the details of the relationship and I could not see the forest for the trees.

So anyway, I have actually started using my therapy now as I was in the very very beginning. I am looking for help and guidance in bettering myself and my life. I do still find myself getting upset about the relationship and what I think has transpired in my mind based on my emotions alone. But that quickly passes for me now or quicker than it used to for sure. And then I get back to work.

I had a great session with him today. At the end he said this is good. This is stronger, more "down the road", work.

Sometimes change can come in an alarming and destructive way. I believe in the power of our innate adaptability to adverse circumstances, and using those opportunities to take a step back and really, objectively, look at the whole picture

Thanks for sharing this and the positive outcome it's ultimately had for you. Out of curiosity, is he still OK with you contacting him if needed, like if you were in crisis? Or if a session went really badly?

When we have a good relational bond, we can weather any storm. Much like our earliest years-the maternal bond and care gives the child a base for handling future stress and traumas. I think it's like that outside of therapy too (eg marriage)

I experienced something similar when my therapist and I quit emailing and texting emotional content a couple of months ago-things got better in our therapy too. This is why i didn't have such a hard time with it, though I still get a bit upset when I think about us making an agreement to email once a week or when things get rough. But he most always fits me in to his schedule when i email or text for an extra session. Though i didn't have as many cared about feelings as you as i never had that closeness (going to his house for games, etc), there was a time when i was feeling really young attachment feelings, and he would text me just a quick note in response to my longings and distress that made me feel like he picked me up out of my crib, soothed me, and put me back down. Amazing what a quick text could do then. I'll never forget that. That was years ago, but I hold on to that, and now that I'm thinking about this, this attachment memory is one of the main things that still keeps me going with him. (though now i have a bigger obstacle-the giving my session away rupture to work through....)

Interesting things worked better for you too after the emails/texts were gone. So glad things are picking up for you.

yes... he has responded to some things. i know if i really needed him, he is there

I experienced this too. It was hard when my T stopped responding to emails, I felt like I had done something wrong, that T was getting fed up with me. But now I see it as a positive thing and it has pushed me into practising using my own resources.

Thanks for sharing this. I'm glad things are getting better for you.

I found that I was getting jealous reading many things on this forum because it seems like so many people get out of session contact and a lot of it. I get check in calls when my t is in the office, but that's it. No emails, or texts. I've always been told that it's not about her not caring, but more that she knows she needs her time to maintain her energy, and that if I'm in a true crisis I need to access emergency services. It's made me upset in the past, but your post reminded me that I need to reframe my thinking a bit. My T is a good T. And ultimately, it has taught me to utilize my own resources, and I need to remember that I do survive. I can make it through.

I hope that makes sense!

Since i like to play devil's advocate... is this a vindication of therapy, or is this you making use of something generally destructive? I've grown a lot in some ways since being jerked around in therapy, but i dont credit therapy or therapists for that. Abusive relationships can be great teachers.

I think as soon as a therapist decides it's their role to take things away, It's possibly a toxic relationship.

Congrats on the forward progress though.

This is great, jDNA! I also experienced similar with both of my therapists and with the second one, gradually reducing email communication was actually essential part of my therapy for obsessions and distractions. It was unpleasant at first but really worth the end result.

yes budfox, i wondered what you might think about this

i considered the fact that i'm just glossing over the potential toxicness.

it's hard to describe a person to someone on the internet. i've been with a truly terrible therapist, for 7 years i met with him... i think most of us know my story about that. my T i know now is different. and believe me, i have questioned myself over that repeatedly. how do i know i can trust him?? has probably been in my mind since day 1. i've been with my current T for going on 7 years now. i just know, man. i just know in my mind and in my heart that he is a good person. do good people flub **** up and hurt others? yep, i think so. i've certainly done that.

just because he is a therapist and has years of education and training doesnt make me see him any less human. yes, he is doing a job, yes it is his livelihood, and yes he has an agenda. but, as far as holding him to some standard that is 'better' than me, i just don't. maybe my former T is why? i did see him that way. he was 20 yrs my senior... i met him when i was 16 yrs old. he was the embodiment of power and authority to me, and could do no wrong in my eyes- even when things were very wrong

So, question - when T's do this, it is in theory (bad experiences put aside) to help the client grow and make steps forward, but when the client does it... it is distancing and bad? I say/ask that because it is I that is stopping between session contact (for now). It took her months and months to get me to feel like it was ok to email her between sessions. I no longer feel that way and am choosing for now to only reach out to her for logistic or extreme crisis. It is not that I no longer want to email her, I no longer feel like it is ok to want to email her and not ok to act on that want. What makes my decision and reasons any different than hers (theirs)? Why should I fight these internal arguments (trust/believe her or don't trust/believe her) only to have her to decide "the when" to instigate the separation; especially, where in my case, I have let her know and down right begged her to let me do it in my time and in my way.

What down right sucks is that I don't want to grow up yet, but I don't have a choice. It is time to stop indulging these parts of myself; if I ever should have in the first place.

This might not be the case for everyone with attachment trauma, but I think the emailing and texting keep the client living in the relationship of the past. I look at it as a semi-enmeshment. (This is opposed to the notion frequently discussed on this forum that it fuels dependence-think it's more often than not something entirely different).

When you keep it in the sessions, it contains the relationship of the past, sort of your childhood mindset in the session and so you live out your adult mindset outside of the session. It has a containing effect.

Quitting the frequent contact also helps you move to the separation-individuation development stage. Maybe that is part of it that is related to what people refer to as 'dependence'.

In theory, I've read that more frequent contact = stronger transference, which could be another way to state my first point.

Elio, I personally wouldn't make a judgment of good or bad if the client initiates the contact change. If it's healthy for you, then I would say it's good. In my past, I've had to keep boundaries with my last therapist, though they were not related to this topic. I did role reversal where I felt I had to become the therapist and ensure things were safe.

Whatever it is for you, maybe a trust issue as you mentioned, it could be worth exploring with your therapist.

In theory I guess I agree with you, Skies, but then I think of my current experience and I'm not so sure.

I'm not able to contact my T outside of sessions and yet I am as attached as I could possibly be - I don't really think about anything except him. That's why I'm here so much - it's my only way of feeling connected to him somehow I guess.

I suppose I doubt that being able to text or e-mail him would somehow lead to me becoming less attached... but I don't see how it could make it any worse at this point.

I dunno. I dunno what I'm trying to say really. I wish I could contact him, but I guess I know that it wouldn't really be a good thing.

I think I know what you mean, and when oversimplifying things, it sounds contradictory to me too. Or maybe what I said is contradictory, sorry if i'm being confusing.

Can use my experience to explain what I was thinking-

No contact is like the unavailable neglectful parent, so I felt always in a state of longing, need, abandonment fears, anxiety. The lack of contract makes transference worse for people with this attachment style- like blank slate does. For those with dismissive attachments, it might make you feel less anxiety.)

But when you add frequent contact, it makes the childhood relationship come alive outside the session-it's the interaction. Now your both in the world of the past rather than the client, and it's easy to turn into enmeshment.

I think my therapist is on the right track with thinking 2 or 3 times a week sessions work best with these issues for me. I also think having a set time/day for email or texts can help avoid problems (which I want but am now not allowed to do). But containment is a huge issue nonetheless.

One encourages transference and the other encourages enmeshment, I think but it's not cut and dry. I have an article somewhere that might explain it better than I can. Not saying I'm right or wrong, just my thoughts.

How in the world does one know what is and is not healthy when you can look at a behavior such as me cutting contact as either.. entering the developmental stage of separation or if it is a severing of a connection to protect from hurt/harm.

I want to add that this is solely my experience. I'm not trying to advise others on their own therapy

Yep. I know thanks for sharing your experience (T statement right there). Honestly though, thanks for sharing. It is important that we see these things from many different perspectives and experiences... to know that there is no right/wrong/one way of things unfolding or affecting us.

I desired contact between sessions because I am a human being, not because my wounded child needed reparenting. If a therapist assumes this is a problem with the client's "transference" rather than a direct effect of the process and basic needs, then they are just an unthinking and dimwitted bundle of conditioning.

therapist: I'm here for you.
client: What about when the session ends.
therapist: No, stay away.
client: That will be a problem.
therapist: Transference violation! Acting out! Bad boundaries! Mommy said no! Privileges revoked!
client: I feel humiliated.
therapist: We'll need to spend 6 months analyzing that.

I agree that there is a level of basic human needs that happen in this process that should be respected as part of the out of session contact.

Speaking solely for me and based completely on some experiences I have had/felt, there is a part of a wounded child that does need/craves limited reparenting.

I think knowing, respecting, and working with both of them is a key.

but, what if there are both parts in one person? first and foremost i am human, but i also had a pretty bad childhood, and young adulthood...where most of my issues are rooted

i do see what you're saying though, and i know there are others out there that do not have wounded child parts within them... and then they get that response from their therapist and it's like, wait, what?????