[TangerineBeam]

I've been working with my T for 2 years, and always thought that she's a grounded and very scientific person. I'm not religious or spiritual myself (in fact, I'm openly atheist), I believe in science and scientific approach, and it suited me how we were alike in this matter.

But lately I started noticing things. She mentioned how "world changes on a quantum level and we should adapt" in one of her posts on Facebook. And I know for a fact that she knows nothing about quanum physics or any physics at all. Then she says to me that she believes homeopathy is working. Not for her, but it helped some of the people she knows. And now I see on her professional page that she started working as a counselor for some, let's say, "Human Development Center." Not only that, she finished two of their programs. I visited the webpage of this center and they claim they can help anyone in two sessions. Only two sessions needed so the person can change his or her life. And though they seem to use some valid psychotherapy techniques and say that everyone is different and needs different approach, I also see a lot of pseudoscientific nonsence. Pyramids, "quantum physics," torsion fields, you name it.

Mind you, she never said or used anything like that in our sessions. She never even mentioned it to me, I asked her first. What we do is just a typical therapy process, without any NLP or something like that. I haven't had the chance to speak to her about this yet (and I definitely will), but I don't like this one bit. I'm starting to doubt her critical thinking skills and get paranoid that she will inadvertently use some unconventional approach on me.

What do you think?

I think I'd be a little disappointed to find out my T believed in homeopathy and things like that. But I do happen to know he believes in spiritual things and has some religion which I don't at all. But he never mentions it in sessions and it's never gotten in the way of my therapy. I would say as long as she's keeping her opinions on that to herself in the therapy room, it probably won't affect your work too much.
That said, do talk to her about it if it is troubling you.

[Calilady]

Would you care if your T were of a different religion? Perhaps she's more eastern philosophy than western as far as her spirituality goes?

I'm very spiritual, but I don't talk to people who don't understand or believe in it, about it. My former t talked to me about tarot card readings and she's a typical therapist. No quackery.

As far as homeopathy goes, I'm still not understanding what the issue is? Does she fast, too? Vegan? Lol. I'm sure she can put on her work face for you and believe in her own bag of tricks. If she were to try and convert you or make you uncomfortable, I get it, but personally wouldn't be a big deal for me.

[Favorite Jeans]

I would find this troubling too. I don't know if it's directly relevant to how she conducts therapy but since it's your brain health that she's dealing with, embracing magic over science is not irrelevant either.

[Argonautomobile]

It's always weird when we learn something about a person that doesn't jive with the assumptions we had about them. Like finding out a person you respect voted for a politician you can't stand. I remember when I was a kid, I just sort of automatically assumed that anybody I liked as a person held the same X beliefs I did. Because, you know, people who hold Y beliefs are idiots, and I wouldn't like an idiot. Lol.

I've done this in therapy, too. Assumed T held certain X beliefs, because people who hold Y beliefs are idiots, and an idiot couldn't help me. Lol. How uncomfortable it was to pick up on things that made me doubt T thought X! Because what does that mean? That idiots can help me? That people who believe Y aren't idiots, after all? That it's a miracle this person's idiocy hasn't contaminated me yet - or perhaps that it already has, which is why I thought they were helpful in the first place?! Noooooo!

I think situations like this present a good opportunity to examine the assumptions we have about the world. Or perhaps the essential unknowability of other people.

[stopdog]

It would not worry me. First, I do not think psychology is as scientific as they pretend it is. Second, even those guys admit they don't know what works or how it works. And third, sometimes alternative medicine really does help. I would not think the therapist's personal views on such things mattered. I would be more concerned if they had an unflagging belief in western medicine.

I'd be bothered too yeah, TangerineBeam.

However, if she sets her beliefs aside and doesn't push them on you, it could be okay. People unfortunately don't always apply critical thinking to everything. (Myself included)

And you can always examine and research things she does with you and decline if it's pseudoscientific.

[Myrto]

I just want to say a couple of things: it's absolutely possible to be both religious and scientific. I don't understand why people often oppose the two. For instance, the guy who discovered the Big Bang was a Jesuit.
Just so we're clear: I'm a hardcore atheist so I am not talking about myself but I know two
scientists who are also Catholic. Catholicism as a whole is perfectly cool with science.
Also homeopathy is not totally bogus: it's based on plants, sure the effect may be limited but it sometimes works. The placebo effect is also a thing that exists.

So far your therapist doesn't sound like a quack.
I would be more concerned about the center she works for as a counselor. Could you ask her about it? Personally woo-woo nonsense would be a dealbreaker for me.
I understand your reticence about her possibly using one of those techniques in your therapy.
All that said, I agree with stopdog: psychology isn't a science. It's an art (as my ex T used to say).

[unaluna]

I would start looking for another t. You cant get along with everybody in life. I had? have? I'm not sure! a friend who i also thought shared my scientific beliefs, come to find out she didnt. And i think she couldnt understand me on a deeper level. Maybe it was because she was in denial about the deeper things, that she could accept the woo-woo (to me) stuff as true, idk; but the relationship eventually fell apart when i stood up for myself more.

[Erebos]

That soundboard like life coaching than therapy. And in my expect they use all sorts of philosophies to get through to people, it's much more dynamic and open.

It has little bearing on her skills as a therapist. I am pretty sure me And my pdoc have VERY different views as far as faith, how the world came about, spirituality and all that. (I was raised But that has nothing th do with his ability to treat me as a pdoc.
Advertising is full of utter gumf, irrelevance, nonsensical catchphrases they use to catch unsuspecting punters. The life coaching business is no difference, if that is what she is involved with.

But as they say on here, if it bothers you ask.
Personally I don't give a toss what they are doing outside of our sessions.

If someone wants to pay them silly money to listen to them waffle nonsense, good on them for finding a market for it.

[LonesomeTonight]

I see an integrative doctor who is an MD, and she's recommended some homeopathy to me to help with anxiety and other issues. I think some of it has helped. And I wouldn't really call that pseudoscience. I don't think your T believing in it would affect whether she's a good therapist for you.

[healinginprogress]

My T has some beliefs that don't completely jive with me, but I trust her judgement in terms of her therapeutic methods. She deals with a lot of different people who have a lot of different beliefs. I used to be completely anti anything non-western medicine. But honestly, as I've gotten older, my gold standard is peer-reviewed and evidence based, but I'm come to accept that as an adjunct some of the pseudoscience can be helpful as a placebo affect.

If your T is able to tailor your sessions to you, I, personally, would be OK with that. But if you're not, there's no reason you shouldn't find someone you're more comfortable with.

Hi Tangerine. I've read a lot of scientific research about how the mind affects the body and how powerful the placebo effect is. I think that doctors should try to harness this power more, and I think that homeopathy is a good way of doing so. Placebos can really help people. I wouldn't be put off by my T believing that homeopathy can help, but I might be bit put off by the other stuff that you have read that your T is involved in, though you area bit vague in your description.

[TangerineBeam]

Originally Posted by Calilady

Would you care if your T were of a different religion?

Depends on religion, but not really. I would be a little uncomfortable, but that's it. I guess I was not completely clear, but I generally don't care what other person's beliefs are. That's not beliefs I'm talking about. It's if and how she applies them. If she uses some questionable techniques in her "other" work, I have the right to be worried it may somehow creep into my therapeutic process. It's my mental health we're talking about. If you need heart or brain surgery, would you go to a surgeon who practices psychic surgery on the side? Or some other unconventional techniques? And claims that they work?

Originally Posted by Argonautomobile

I think situations like this present a good opportunity to examine the assumptions we have about the world. Or perhaps the essential unknowability of other people.

I thought about this and how she may be not the person I imagine her to be. Thank you for your reply.

Originally Posted by Erebos

That soundboard like life coaching than therapy. And in my expect they use all sorts of philosophies to get through to people, it's much more dynamic and open.

It has little bearing on her skills as a therapist. Advertising is full of utter gumf, irrelevance, nonsensical catchphrases they use to catch unsuspecting punters. The life coaching business is no difference, if that is what she is involved with.

Yeah, I think this might be the case. I'll know more when I talk to her.

[Ididitmyway]

I don't want to get started on how "scientific" psychotherapy is and how "unscientific" alternative healing practices are. If you believe psychotherapy is solidly based on science and that quantum physics doesn't reveal something scientific about spirituality and also that there is a contradiction between spirituality and science then you are uninformed about the latest scientific discoveries and, basically, are not in touch with science at all. I don't want to dig into all this because then I'd have to spend a few days typing long posts and I don't have time for that, but, most importantly, all this is irrelevant.

Regardless of what you believe about science and homeopathy and anything else, if your T does an overall good work with you and you have been satisfied with her work, what difference does it make what she posts on her social media pages? Why can't you separate it from your work with her?

I understand that it might be disappointing to see that people who are important to us believe in things that we reject, like when they vote for the politician we despise, or when they like people we don't like, or when they life their lives by different standards then ours and believe in things that we consider nonsensical. What I don't understand is why people can't be mature enough to go beyond those disappointments and to give other people freedom to live their lives however they want, to believe whatever they want and to express their beliefs publicly if they feel like it.

Did you T do something in her work with you that you consider unscientific, not approved by her training, unprofessional and such? If not, relax and get a life.

I know this sounds rude, but I am sick and tired of hearing these kinds of judgments from people everywhere. It is not related just to therapists. People stick their noses in other people's business everywhere for no good reason. It'd not be so disturbing if they just resorted to gossiping. But they take it much further. In my neighborhood there is lots of "vigilantes" who call to arms (literally call for buying guns and shooting people) as soon as they see someone who looks even slightly suspicious to them according to their standards of "normalcy". People's careers get ruined, not just therapists but any profession, when they post something on social media that someone else considers troublesome, even when they are skilled professionals and get along with co-workers just fine.

I am not saying that tolerance should be unlimited. There are certain messages that openly call for violence against certain groups of people. These should not be tolerated. I'd also understand if you see your T posting something on FB that violated your moral values, like if they are doing a trophy hunting and post a photo of themselves with the dead animal they just killed, if you run away from that T because I would. But to be "worried", "concerned" or "disturbed" just because the T happened to have a different opinion, a world view that is different from yours and they have the "audacity" to feel free to talk about it openly? Gimme a break. Grow up and get a life.

I blelieve that if a person truly believes something is going to work, it usually does in a positive way. The placebo effect has a lot of mileage with me. The mind is a powerful healer and science is just now getting around to understanding how to use it as a natural cure.

But, you have the right not to have alternative methods practiced on you with out your consent. I would discuss it with her until you got answers that were satisfactory to you.

[TangerineBeam]

Originally Posted by Ididitmyway

I don't want to get started on how "scientific" psychotherapy is and how "unscientific" alternative healing practices are. If you believe psychotherapy is solidly based on science and that quantum physics doesn't reveal something scientific about spirituality and also that there is a contradiction between spirituality and science then you are uninformed about the latest scientific discoveries and, basically, are not in touch with science at all. I don't want to dig into all this because then I'd have to spend a few days typing long posts and I don't have time for that, but, most importantly, all this is irrelevant.

Of course I'm uninformed, since you didn't provide any information. Until you do, this is really irrelevant.

Originally Posted by Ididitmyway

I know this sounds rude, but I am sick and tired of hearing these kinds of judgments from people everywhere. It is not related just to therapists. People stick their noses in other people's business everywhere for no good reason. It'd not be so disturbing if they just resorted to gossiping. But they take it much further.

Don't project your thoughts on me. Funny how you talk about tolerance and then say how others (including me) should behave and feel. How do you say? Gimme a break, grow up, and get a life.

[atisketatasket]

If she's not pushing any of this stuff on you, and has been helpful, I seriously would not be bothered by it. I also don't think having different viewpoints on whatever, from politics to religion to alternative medicine to science, can keep people from "getting" and helping each other (provided the different viewpoints are of the non-murderous type). It's harder, sure, but worth it to get past the differences. And sounds like she might be worth it?

I'd also like to float the possibility that some of the things you mention are how she takes care of herself, so that she can be in the best possible state herself to do her job.

[growlycat]

I am an atheist too and do not tolerate any woo in my therapy. I don't care what t wants to believe as long as they are not pushing it on me This type of thing you are talking about would worry me too. It's the same kind of pseudoscience promoted by that group that puts out bs movies like "what the bleep do we know". They hide behind scientific sounding terminology but are promoting something else. Just be careful.

[stopdog]

I think all therapy is woo -how does one decide what is woo or too woo in a vacuum? I mean I know what I will and will not do and their language, to me, can range from the touchy feely woo to nonsensical blather. I would rather tolerate some open woo over cbt which I think is woo that tell the client they are an idiot. But some people like cbt-so on the woo scale - I think one simply decides which type is or is not for them and go with that

[growlycat]

Woo vs scientific -- in science results need to be quantifiable and repeatable. There is a clear distinction between woo and science.

[growlycat]

ps when alternative medicine is proven to work it is just called medicine.

[stopdog]

Originally Posted by growlycat

Woo vs scientific -- in science results need to be quantifiable and repeatable. There is a clear distinction between woo and science.

I understand we disagree on this.

Originally Posted by growlycat

ps when alternative medicine is proven to work it is just called medicine.

Depends on who you ask. I have had acupuncture and sacral cranial energy work on me-there was physical response one could see -change in a body part with each. Ask an md -and often they will call it woo. Ask a chiropractor what they do? Ask an md about chiropractors. Ask people who have been helped by any of them. I think western medicine is a lot more woo than it admits. Certainly therapy is in my opinion -and yet some people claim it has helped them.

[Pennster]

Originally Posted by Ididitmyway

Did you T do something in her work with you that you consider unscientific, not approved by her training, unprofessional and such? If not, relax and get a life.

I am not saying that tolerance should be unlimited. There are certain messages that openly call for violence against certain groups of people. These should not be tolerated. I'd also understand if you see your T posting something on FB that violated your moral values, like if they are doing a trophy hunting and post a photo of themselves with the dead animal they just killed, if you run away from that T because I would. But to be "worried", "concerned" or "disturbed" just because the T happened to have a different opinion, a world view that is different from yours and they have the "audacity" to feel free to talk about it openly? Gimme a break. Grow up and get a life.

I think everyone should feel free to express their worries and concerns here, even if they are about a different sort of thing than what someone else might worry about.

As for the whole quantum spirituality thing, there's a lot of skepticism about it among physicists. It's hardly settled truth.

[growlycat]

Originally Posted by stopdog

I understand we disagree on this.

Depends on who you ask. I have had acupuncture and sacral cranial energy work on me-there was physical response one could see -change in a body part with each. Ask an md -and often they will call it woo. Ask a chiropractor what they do? Ask an md about chiropractors. Ask people who have been helped by any of them. I think western medicine is a lot more woo than it admits. Certainly therapy is in my opinion -and yet some people claim it has helped them.

Western medicine has its problems alright, no disagreement there. For example, the push to medicate but not cure anything.

Not defending all of therapy or western medicine, just saying that science does have parameters.