[kecanoe]

Last night I told with T3 that I had reconnected with someone I knew years ago-from AA, actually-and we are going riding together. I don't actually remember her, but she remembers me. For me to reach out to someone I maybe used to know and make plans to ride is a sign of improving mental health. We all agree with that.

I said something about I would not schedule a second ride if this person is the type who is an angry rider. There are people who, in my opinion, are too rough and harsh with their horses. I don't want to be around people like that. T3 said that is me being avoidant. Fair enough.

Here's where we differ (T3 and I). I said that if this person swears and calls her horse a m-f-er and stuff like that, I would do my best to ignore it, enjoy my horse and nature and not ride with the person again. T3 says she would say something to this person. "I notice you swear at your horse a lot, but I think there is more depth to you. Would you be willing to curtail your language around me" or something like that. Thereby giving person the chance to change and the potential friendship to grow. She says there is nothing really risky about doing that. Worst case is person gets mad at me and at her horse and we don't develop a friendship. I say, why put myself out there instead of just backing away.

Do people really confront other potential friends like this? Would you?

I don't. Which may be why I don't have a ton of friends....

[atisketatasket]

This reminds me of when CW told me I should have called out a member of one of my writers' groups for making a joke that made me uncomfortable (it wasn't aimed at me but it was related to my disability). She insisted that the whole group should have a discussion about it. I don't see that being a good thing in terms of outcome, or a typical thing to answer your question.

Therapists to me sometimes seem to live in a cushiony-soft ideal world where you could say that to a potential friend or I could say that to my group and everything would be a-ok. What I wonder is would they do it in our positions?

And not riding with someone again because of the how they treated their horse is not avoidant to me. It's just a principle you live by. I mean, if you said your test was did this person make racist jokes and if she did you wouldn't associate with her, would your therapist object to that?

Sure there are silly reasons for avoiding people. I don't think animal maltreatment is one of them.

[awkwardlyyours]

Yeah, I'm not sure what I'd make of that personally, coming from a T.

But, is that typically the sort of stuff you get from T3? Is she typically Pollyanna-ish?

Both current T and former T (and pretty much every other T I met) would classify me as highly avoidant.

But, both have strongly encouraged me to get the eff out of -- like really just cut it off -- friendships / relationships that I've usually been inclined to stick around in (but with a lot of misgivings). Like don't say anything / don't try to work it out / don't be polite etc but just get out, as soon as possible. So, if anything, they've said that I'm inclined to ignore a whole lot of stuff and be way too forgiving / stick around way more than anyone should despite feeling like I shouldn't.

At the same time, both -- especially current T -- have noted that I have few, if any, friends locally. So, it's not like I've had a whole set of friends to choose from when they've given me this advice.

[skeksi]

I cannot imagine asking an acquaintance something like that. Like you, I would use it as a barometer of whether I felt comfortable in being closer friends or not.

[growlycat]

I guess if she was speaking that way to the horse you could point out that they pick up on tone of voice and body gestures. For her own safety she might want to be more gentle

[InnerPeace111]

I suppose other people confront potential friends like this. I wouldn't. I would handle it like you --- just not schedule more rides with people who are too rough or harsh with their horses. I see absolutely nothing wrong with this. I tend to confront people as little as possible (I have many reasons for not doing so) and I still have plenty of respectable friends in my life.

I often have this discussion with t(ex t). I often will say something about a colleague in work and she will something totally ridiculous. I really think a lot of ts are out of touch with the real world, they develop a fantasy world we're everyone is polite and communicative and open for connection. This is complete opposite to my workplace, so I told her to get real, this is not how my world is. She was taken a back but it needed to be said.
In relation to your situation, I would not call boy wanting to spend time with someone who was abusive to animals avoidant I would call it looking after your emotional health. You know the way she talks to the horse, why risk confronting a practical stranger on her behaviour, to me that's just nonsense. It is an avoidance but a healthy avoidance

[feileacan]

I don't ever confront people like this. But I'm avoidant too and other than my H I don't really have any close friends.

I would do exactly the same as you plan - if something in the person doesn't fit me then rather than confronting I would just drop the idea of hanging out with her more. I think this is actually reasonable because people typically don't change their conduct when someone says something like this, especially when this someone is a half-stranger. Rather they get defensive and either express it openly or just think to themselves that you're minding something that isn't your business.

Also, when someone I've just met would confront me with something she doesn't like me I probably wouldn't say anything but I definitely wouldn't try to pursue a friendship with this person. But again, my judgement is probably clouded by the fact that I'm extremely avoidant too.

I remember when I went to abroad for a while and temporarily started seeing a T there and the T asked if I had started making any friends yet (I had been in this country a bit less then a month) then I was shocked about his question. It seemed completely unreasonable to me to assume that someone who has arrived to a country just a month ago would have started to make any friends already. I told him that I don't expect to make any friends during the whole time I'm there because one year is just too short a period for that. But I realised that to himself this kind of question seemed completely reasonable.

[unaluna]

I guess this is why we are all in t. Are they for real?? Have they never had a friend (or spouse) where, if you mentioned the thing to them, it just made the situation worse?

I just started telling my t, "no, because im picking up on SOCIAL CUES, Im not acting all aspergery, thats a good thing, right?" Gotcha, ahole. We're picking up on social cues. Guy marching with a tiki torch and chanting - thats your social cue right there.

[kecanoe]

Thanks for all the replies. And the affirmation that I was correct when I gave t the "you have got to be crazy" look as she calls it. She does not tend to be Pollyanna-ish; she is super smart and I think probably pretty assertive IRL.

I have a formal diagnosis that includes "mixed personality disorder, dependent, avoidant and schizoid traits" so clearly I am confused about all this relationship stuff.

But as I think about this, I think it is in part a question of power. If one of you guys were to come riding with me on my horses, I'd have no problem at all giving instruction or coaching. Whether a stranger or good friend, I'd be fine with that. I would have the power because I know the horses. But somehow telling someone how to ride their horse seems more like telling someone how to raise their kids-at least to me.

Well, we'll see what happens. Probably this person will be completely nice and pleasant and I won't even have an opportunity to try to decide how to handle it.