[rainbow8]

I need to process what's happening in my sessions lately. T told me again about the baby/Mommy connection, how a baby looks at its mother, and how the mother is supposed to respond back. Apparently, this interaction didn't happen right for me, like many of us with attachment problems. T thinks my selective mutism was a way of shutting down, going inside, as a result of not feeling the necessary kind of connection to my mother.

She is reading the book, Mindsight, which I read when I started therapy with her but I forgot most of it. Has anyone read it?

So, T says, we have been trying to have a corrective therapeutic relationship, in which I can connect with her, feel safe, and gain a better sense of self that will transfer to my other relationships. I know that is what my therapy has been about, but now we are dealing with it more directly.

Today we kept stopping and T would ask if I felt connected to her. She also commented when she thought I wasn't connected. I'm not sure if this is the same as being present or not. Sometimes she was wrong, but mostly right. She had me look around the room at one point, saying that even babies gaze away from their Moms and back.

When I was leaving, I said being connected is more risky because I don't want to leave. That's where holding onto the connection comes in. I do have a secure connection, knowing she cares even when not in session, but the intimacy of the eye contact is addictive. I want more! I always felt like running away from it. I still do, but I see that T wants us to have this deep connection. I feel different from the past with T. I just hope I don't get hurt, or start feeling needy. I don't think I am. The connection is the most important thing! T said that. Can others relate to this? Running away from the connection but when you risk facing it, it's an amazing feeling?

[MessyD]

I don't think I can really answer your question but I think it's interesting and I can somewhat relate. I'm not sure how to know whether I'm connected or not. I get that it can feel good, yet you want to run away. I've been trying to look more at my T and eye contact does get too much for me sometimes but lately I've tried not to look away that much. Once I lasted for quiet a while and then he said take a break and I finally looked away with a little relief. Funny thing is that after couple seconds I looked right back up at him. And I didn't realize it until he said it, kind of surprised too. So altough to I kept wanting to run away, I still wanted to come back for more.

[ruh roh]

Did your children feel connected to you and vice versa? Just wondering how this works between generations. Sorry if that's too off topic.

[rainbow8]

Originally Posted by MessyD

I don't think I can really answer your question but I think it's interesting and I can somewhat relate. I'm not sure how to know whether I'm connected or not. I get that it can feel good, yet you want to run away. I've been trying to look more at my T and eye contact does get too much for me sometimes but lately I've tried not to look away that much. Once I lasted for quiet a while and then he said take a break and I finally looked away with a little relief. Funny thing is that after couple seconds I looked right back up at him. And I didn't realize it until he said it, kind of surprised too. So altough to I kept wanting to run away, I still wanted to come back for more.

Thank you. It sounds like you're acting the way my T said to act. Prolonged eye contact is too much so look away, and then go back to look again. Like babies do, she said. I'm not calling you a baby, just saying what T told me.

Originally Posted by ruh roh

Did your children feel connected to you and vice versa? Just wondering how this works between generations. Sorry if that's too off topic.

Good question, ruh roh. I'm not sure! I hope they did when they were little. It's scary how easy it is to "mess up." T and I know that my parents loved me very much but I still ended up with BPD and attachment problems. I carried over my mother's anxiety and I worried about my kids a lot. One of my children is a lot like me but the other one is not!

[MessyD]

[QUOTE=rainbow8;5887553]Thank you. It sounds like you're acting the way my T said to act. Prolonged eye contact is too much so look away, and then go back to look again. Like babies do, she said. I'm not calling you a baby, just saying what T told me

You could call me a baby it does make sense altough my T never said anything. We never talked about anything like that, I don't think I have attachment issues, I guess I might have trouble staying present and connected . So he appreciated me trying to look at him more. But there might be more to it, it sure is interesting, I like the work you're doing with your T

[zoiecat]

I totally don't understand this concept. It just seems like a painful way that enmeshes the client with the therapist. What is the goal of this. After so long are you supposed to eventually not need the attachment any longer, is it supposed to heal you and make everything normal again as if you had that healthy bond with your caregiver as child? I am not judging I'm just truly confused and trying to understand.

I was extremely abused and neglected as a child and I never had or experienced any type of bonding with my mother and my only memories of my father are of abuse and molestation. As a result I find it very hard to have eye contact with anyone especially my therapist that is almost non-existent. I do not have any sort of healthy attachment with anyone nor do I want to I prefer to be left alone and that deal with life's problems on my own because that is how I survived. I know this is not normal and it's not healthy but it's also not something I even think about trying to fix because getting over the trauma to me is much more important then working on healthy attachment. I guess I'm just trying to understand this whole concept and learn what working on this might do to improve my overall happiness in life.

[justbreathe1994]

I don't want to pretend like I know much about therapy, because I certainly still have a lot to learn. A lot of what I think has been influenced by what my therapist has told me, since I've been working with her on similar issues so closely for so long. I think connection is a big part of therapy, but I don't nessecarily think it should be the goal. What I mean by that is, it can be easy to get so addicted and focused on getting our connective needs met in therapy and to be frank, it's not going to happen all the time (nor should it). When we do feel close and really connected (my therapist uses the term "confluence"), that can for sure feel amazing and beautiful... but the goal should be to be able to move in and out of confluence smoothly without clinging or getting lost in it. That happens when we have an established sense of self and we aren't solely relying on getting all our needs met by one person. I get that many of us feel the need to have a maternal like figure if we've had hard relationships with our parents, but I don't think it's feasible for our therapist to meet all those unmet needs. Idk if that makes sense or anything, but I just thought I'd offer my two cents.

[wheeler]

I’m starting on to really ‘feel’ like connection and attachment are a big part of therapy.

I once asked my T is it possible to love my daughter too much, and she said No. It’s the love and support that you give your daughter that helps her grow and become confident in herself. She will not become overly dependent on you. You will always love her and she will always love you. And it’s this unconditional love that makes it easier for her to leave the ‘nest’, but the love you have for each other never leaves.

I have much comfort in that explanation and I am slowly, and confidently starting to see the possibility of life without always being in therapy.

[peaches100]

Hi Rainbow,

I like the way you and your therapist are working on connection and eye contact. I totally understand the feeling of wanting the connection, yet feeling that it is overwhelming and being afraid of it.

For me, I wonder if the conflicting desire for connection, yet fear of it at the same time, is another thing that makes email important for me. It's a way to connect, but from a distance. Have you ever noticed yourself using email as a way to connect because of fear of feeling too close in session?

I think being present is different from being connected. You can be present and have an awareness that you are with your t in the room, but that doesn't automatically mean that you will feel connected with her. To me, presence doesn't necessarily involve emotion, but connection does.

I think you and your t are doing good work!

[zoiecat]

Thanks Peaches. This whole topic of conversation just seems so foreign to me. I am struggling to just stay present not only in session but in life. Based on your response, I now realize I have NEVER felt CONNECTED with anyone. I wouldn't even know where to begin. I survive in my own little world with my sick, twisted head. T says he really dislikes the term "twisted head" but if he only knew what all went on in there I am sure he would agree. Hopefully I will find a way to escape my entrapment some day.

[rainbow8]

Originally Posted by zoiecat

I totally don't understand this concept. It just seems like a painful way that enmeshes the client with the therapist. What is the goal of this. After so long are you supposed to eventually not need the attachment any longer, is it supposed to heal you and make everything normal again as if you had that healthy bond with your caregiver as child? I am not judging I'm just truly confused and trying to understand.

I was extremely abused and neglected as a child and I never had or experienced any type of bonding with my mother and my only memories of my father are of abuse and molestation. As a result I find it very hard to have eye contact with anyone especially my therapist that is almost non-existent. I do not have any sort of healthy attachment with anyone nor do I want to I prefer to be left alone and that deal with life's problems on my own because that is how I survived. I know this is not normal and it's not healthy but it's also not something I even think about trying to fix because getting over the trauma to me is much more important then working on healthy attachment. I guess I'm just trying to understand this whole concept and learn what working on this might do to improve my overall happiness in life.

I think that in your situation the lack of connection and your not wanting connections is normal. You're right. Getting over the trauma is much more important! Maybe down the road, you will have a desire to form connections. We each have our own path to follow. For me, connection is crucial; for others it's not. As far as enmeshment, my relationship with my T is teaching me that I don't need to be enmeshed. The connection is healthier. I thought I might need her more after my session this week, but I didn't even email her! I can remember the feeling when we truly connected, and am holding on to that. That's the goal. I'm going on with my life because T and I connected that way.

Originally Posted by justbreathe1994

I don't want to pretend like I know much about therapy, because I certainly still have a lot to learn. A lot of what I think has been influenced by what my therapist has told me, since I've been working with her on similar issues so closely for so long. I think connection is a big part of therapy, but I don't nessecarily think it should be the goal. What I mean by that is, it can be easy to get so addicted and focused on getting our connective needs met in therapy and to be frank, it's not going to happen all the time (nor should it). When we do feel close and really connected (my therapist uses the term "confluence"), that can for sure feel amazing and beautiful... but the goal should be to be able to move in and out of confluence smoothly without clinging or getting lost in it. That happens when we have an established sense of self and we aren't solely relying on getting all our needs met by one person. I get that many of us feel the need to have a maternal like figure if we've had hard relationships with our parents, but I don't think it's feasible for our therapist to meet all those unmet needs. Idk if that makes sense or anything, but I just thought I'd offer my two cents.

You're definitely correct! My T always focuses on my relationships outside of therapy. She has never wanted me to use her in place of others, which had been my pattern. But this work is different! My former T's didn't let me attach and connect with them in the way this T does. We have a relationship, and it's okay to call it love. It's okay for me to feel T's caring and love because it's giving me something I never had. It's building my sense of Self. T told me that and I believe her.

Originally Posted by wheeler

I’m starting on to really ‘feel’ like connection and attachment are a big part of therapy.

I once asked my T is it possible to love my daughter too much, and she said No. It’s the love and support that you give your daughter that helps her grow and become confident in herself. She will not become overly dependent on you. You will always love her and she will always love you. And it’s this unconditional love that makes it easier for her to leave the ‘nest’, but the love you have for each other never leaves.

I have much comfort in that explanation and I am slowly, and confidently starting to see the possibility of life without always being in therapy.

I agree with your T. I'm glad you're seeing things differently. Me too! I am moving in the right direction BECAUSE of the connection I have with my T.

Originally Posted by peaches100

Hi Rainbow,

I like the way you and your therapist are working on connection and eye contact. I totally understand the feeling of wanting the connection, yet feeling that it is overwhelming and being afraid of it.

For me, I wonder if the conflicting desire for connection, yet fear of it at the same time, is another thing that makes email important for me. It's a way to connect, but from a distance. Have you ever noticed yourself using email as a way to connect because of fear of feeling too close in session?

I think being present is different from being connected. You can be present and have an awareness that you are with your t in the room, but that doesn't automatically mean that you will feel connected with her. To me, presence doesn't necessarily involve emotion, but connection does.

I think you and your t are doing good work!

Thanks, Peaches. Yes, I've used email often in the way you describe, like when I tell T how important she is to me, and write "I love you." I can't look at her and tell her in the session. It's too intense. Looking at her directly in the session is scary, and so is talking about it while I'm doing it. But the risk is worth it! I feel like this is the most important work I've done in therapy, and so does T.

Others have asked why I'm in therapy, and being in it for the connection was often criticized. Now I don't care what anyone thinks because my T is the one leading this kind of work!

Yes, I see how you can be present but not connected. Thanks for explaining.

It's really interesting to read all of the different responses on this thread. Connection in therapy has always interested me. I wonder why I connect to some therapists and not others. I wonder why I can connect with some clients and not others.
I agree with Rainbow for me it is the most important part of therapy, if there is no connection there is no therapy.
My t has asked me to look at her more to try and connect with her. For me eye contact is extremely hard. I sometimes over compensate and stare into people's eyes but I am not really there, I have left emotionally because it's too difficult. I am practising staying present and being connected but it's bloody hard.
I look into my ts eyes and sometimes I see kindness and want to connect and other times I don't want to connect because she has said something to annoy me. Those times I look but not really notice or stay present. On my training that was a way of staying present was to look around the room and notice other people's faces and make eye contact. This was excruciatingly hard as I link shame with the eyes, I avoid eye contact because I don't want anyone to really see me because it's too scared and I don't trust they will like what they see.
I hope you continue this work with your t Rainbow, it doesn't matter what others think about your therapy, if it helps you, that's all that matters

[rainbow8]

Originally Posted by monalisasmile

It's really interesting to read all of the different responses on this thread. Connection in therapy has always interested me. I wonder why I connect to some therapists and not others. I wonder why I can connect with some clients and not others.
I agree with Rainbow for me it is the most important part of therapy, if there is no connection there is no therapy.
My t has asked me to look at her more to try and connect with her. For me eye contact is extremely hard. I sometimes over compensate and stare into people's eyes but I am not really there, I have left emotionally because it's too difficult. I am practising staying present and being connected but it's bloody hard.
I look into my ts eyes and sometimes I see kindness and want to connect and other times I don't want to connect because she has said something to annoy me. Those times I look but not really notice or stay present. On my training that was a way of staying present was to look around the room and notice other people's faces and make eye contact. This was excruciatingly hard as I link shame with the eyes, I avoid eye contact because I don't want anyone to really see me because it's too scared and I don't trust they will like what they see.
I hope you continue this work with your t Rainbow, it doesn't matter what others think about your therapy, if it helps you, that's all that matters

Thank you, Mona. Yes, eye contact is very difficult! I am more aware that I don't make eye contact with ANYONE too much. I tried it with some friends today and I got a headache! I am scared of people seeing me too, and worried they won't like me. I've always been like that.
I appreciate your support. Yes, I'm going to continue the work on connection because it's what I need. None of my other T's worked this way, except maybe my first one, but I was much too inhibited to really focus on my connection with her.

My therapist has always said the way I "gaze" has an "infant-like quality" and I know, like you that I missed out on that kind of relationship with my mother. So I can relate very much. Like you I find myself wanting more. I sometimes look at his eyes in his photograph just to look into them. It's not the same but it demonstrates the level of the need.
I just try to be kind to myself about this stuff and not to pin too many expectations on myself. It will undoubtedly change in time but I think the key is patience and empathy with yourself for what you have missed. It's okay to be this way.

[rainbow8]

Originally Posted by Runcible Spoon

My therapist has always said the way I "gaze" has an "infant-like quality" and I know, like you that I missed out on that kind of relationship with my mother. So I can relate very much. Like you I find myself wanting more. I sometimes look at his eyes in his photograph just to look into them. It's not the same but it demonstrates the level of the need.
I just try to be kind to myself about this stuff and not to pin too many expectations on myself. It will undoubtedly change in time but I think the key is patience and empathy with yourself for what you have missed. It's okay to be this way.

Thanks for understanding! I never realized how much I need the eye contact, and how that's the key to connection. It seems obvious, but I guess I was always too afraid of people to risk it. I am extremely grateful to my current T for her modality that encourages this kind of work!

[rainbow8]

Here it is Tuesday and I see T tomorrow. I didn't email, not even once! That hasn't happened in a while. Many people are skeptical, but I know it's the connection and eye contact. I can feel it! It wasn't a great week, either. I was disappointed about something, but the urge to contact T wasn't there. So apparently this focus on connection works for ME, maybe not for everyone though.

[alpacalicious]

For me the connection with the therapist is really really important. Since I started therapy I feel a bit better because I feel like my T is supportive and there for me, like an anchor. I search eye contact with him, because I like to make eye contact, I think because I want that connection, and I noticed that he tends to mirror me (for example when I'm on the chair and I lean on the left side, he tends to do that too and sometimes I dont even notice because I'm talking and looking around, then I make eye contact with him and he's in front of me basically so I feel his presence), and he's giving me the message that he's there for me, and is always engaged. I feel more grounded also. I think I had attachment problems with my parents, my father was present but totally absent and verbally aggressive, my mother was overprotective...I feel like I never had a connection with them. I'm not able to express them my private thoughts etc I don't feel secure enough. I think in therapy I can have this possibility of finding this bond, this connection.