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Legendary
Member Since Jun 2007
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Nov 14, 2007 at 10:15 PM
#1
I wonder if the stresses and pathologies and cruelties and distortions characteristic of humans is a result of our separation from the other animals. What other animal would set sail with its fellows in a wind-powered wooden boat to explore the unknown? And with the development of science and technology, could actually venture outside the earth's atmosphere and to the moon and beyond? How strange.
If we were to find another "intelligent" species in outer space, would the very fact of its having to separate itself from its animal ancestors to such an extent stress it so much that cruelty and all other kinds of disorders would be inevitable companions? Maybe some day we will find more than one such species so we can do comparative studies and answer the question... __________________ Now if thou would'st When all have given him o'er From death to life Thou might'st him yet recover -- Michael Drayton 1562 - 1631 |
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Pandita-in-training
Member Since Sep 2006
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Nov 14, 2007 at 10:20 PM
#2
Maybe the other outer space "humans" wouldn't have as many other animals to provide the separation. What if they had to be more "separate" than we are based on color, race, nationality, gender, sex, etc. You read much of Ursula LeGuin?
Interesting thoughts, pachyderm! __________________ "Never give a sword to a man who can't dance." ~Confucius |
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Wise Elder
Member Since Jan 2006
Location: Florida
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Nov 15, 2007 at 12:43 AM
#3
</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
pachyderm said: I wonder if the stresses and pathologies and cruelties and distortions characteristic of humans is a result of our separation from the other animals. </div></font></blockquote><font class="post"> IMO....... I think we have become the humans we are today for we have separated from our TRUE SELF - now HOW to find him/her? |
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Legendary
Member Since Jun 2007
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Nov 15, 2007 at 10:02 AM
#4
> You read much of Ursula LeGuin?
Yeah. Not recently. I used to read a lot of SF. She was one of the better authors. __________________ Now if thou would'st When all have given him o'er From death to life Thou might'st him yet recover -- Michael Drayton 1562 - 1631 |
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Magnate
Member Since Oct 2007
Location: Fayetteville, AR
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Nov 15, 2007 at 10:41 AM
#5
pachyderm - do you like elephants or is the name a coincidence?
no other animal has logic skills like we do. in evolutionary terms we are the most derived mentally but the least physically able to survive which is funny considering we rule the earth. without these minds and vocal chords we probably wouldnt be alive right now. cause think about what physical traits we have to survive. not a lot of hair or subcutaneous fat, no claws, no camo...nothing. we dont really fit with nature at all. so its our intellect that separates us. no other animal can communicate like us. no other animal has the processing skills that we do. i think if there were another species that would take our place it would be cats. theyre so curious lol so im sure they would be out exploring like us.  i think any animal would if it, too, had the mental capabilities that we do.
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Pandita-in-training
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Nov 15, 2007 at 03:34 PM
#6
Pachyderm means "thick skinned." Rhinoceroseses :-) and hippopotami are also pachyderms.
__________________ "Never give a sword to a man who can't dance." ~Confucius |
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Magnate
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Nov 15, 2007 at 03:57 PM
#7
not anymore. thats not actually a term used in phylogeny anymore. elephants are in their own group called proboscidea and rhinos and hippos are ungulates. they used to be grouped together because of their thick skin but then scientists found other morphylogical characteristics that separated them. sorry, my major is in zoology specifically evolutionary zoology lol
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Magnate
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Nov 15, 2007 at 04:07 PM
#8
i went back and read my post and it makes it sound like rhinos and hippos are in the same group still. ungulates is a grandorder that consists of smaller orders, 2 of them being arteriodactyla (even-toed ungulates) and perissodactyla (odd-toed ungulates). arteriodactyla includes hippos and perissodactyla inclueds rhinos.
sorry......im %#@&#! lol |
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Wise Elder
Member Since Jun 2005
Location: WV
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Nov 15, 2007 at 05:52 PM
#9
Wow! What a fascinating thread! Perna asked about reading Ursula K. Leguin. I haven't read her work for many years, but I have one of her books acquired from a free bookshelf at my school I intend to start reading.
Though we have the ability to think, rationalize, speak and rule the earth, I think we are not too separated from the "lower" species in much of our behaviour. Watch a nature film about sexual dominance among primates, like chimpanzees, and one can't help but identify similar behavior among humans, though in more "sophisticated" terms. Also, I think what we perceive as "superior" regarding ourselves compared to other species may be a misperception. Who knows what elephants or dolphins are saying to each other??? Patty |
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Magnate
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Nov 15, 2007 at 05:57 PM
#10
humans try to separate ourselves. seems like many people forget that were still animals. and if it werent for our technology we wouldnt be at the top of the food chain. primal instincts will always be there but everything else is fabricated. yes other animals have chains of command but they just duke it out lol maybe thats what we should have done. let george w. battle in a wrestling match or something.
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Wise Elder
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Nov 15, 2007 at 05:59 PM
#11
Right on!, Salukigirl!
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Magnate
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Nov 15, 2007 at 06:07 PM
#12
cant say that too loud.....im in republican country! lol
when i moved to illinois my stepdad came to me and said "great, youre gonna be in a damn blue state!" and i went SWEET!!! then i remembered that chicago makes up over half the population of illinois and thats where all my kindred spirits are lol. down here kids get out of school for the first day of hunting season. and people drive around with their trucks painted camo with dead deer in the back. fun times! sorry if i offended any hunters/republicans/conservatives.
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Wise Elder
Member Since Jun 2005
Location: WV
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Nov 15, 2007 at 06:13 PM
#13
Hey, I live in rural WV hunting country. They get out of school a whole week for hunting season here!
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Magnate
Member Since Oct 2007
Location: Fayetteville, AR
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Nov 15, 2007 at 06:21 PM
#14
we drove through WV to go to NC (i used to live in dayton) and we stopped in a place called Mossy to get gas. it was like the most stereotypical hick place I have ever seen in my life. pictures of graduating classes on the walls of the gas station and the pictures had about 10 people in them lol. i would go insane in a place like that. i only have hope now because i will eventually graduate and then go to vet school which are all in pretty big cities. plus people suck at driving out here.
damn i gotta leave work lol. this is what i do at work all day. nice talkin with you today
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Legendary
Member Since Jun 2007
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Nov 16, 2007 at 11:32 AM
#15
The name pachyderm I chose mostly by coincidence. I had to come up with something quickly and that was it.
To comment on another comment, maybe our relative weakness compared to other (earth) animals is an advantage, in that it forces us to depend on our intellect more. Gains from losses. __________________ Now if thou would'st When all have given him o'er From death to life Thou might'st him yet recover -- Michael Drayton 1562 - 1631 |
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Magnate
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Nov 16, 2007 at 12:07 PM
#16
never thought about it that way. maybe thats why im science minded and not philosophy minded. now if we could only combine the 2......
well about 60-120,000 years ago is when our make up really made a difference. the neanderthals had a much heavier skelton with thicker legs and much more insulation around their bodies. but once the ice age started to come and the forests cleared out they had to hunt in open fields. and obviously, some big, ungraceful man is not going to hunt very easily in an open field. thats where we, modern humans, came in to play. we have much lighter skeletons and are much more graceful than previous humans. that gave us an advantage over them. we could run faster and hide easier than them. but at the same time, that agility took away from our natural defenses. so maybe youre right. we gave up some natural defenses for intelligence. good thing those several thousand years was long enough for us to develop mentally the way we did. if we wouldnt have developed our intellect as we have it now we wouldnt have survived. good topic. |
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