Marriage may need to end: enormous grief and sadness

I don’t really wish to discuss my career or finances Right now, but I am fine financially and I have a good career.

I think Hope has the same career as before they’ve met. She didn’t quit her job when they got married.

Yes that’s true. And we don’t have children.

I make a very good living and I’m a financially independent woman, let’s put it that way. I can leave him, get my own apartment and be able to live on my own.

Everything’s pretty much back to normal, however, we had some tension last night over his father. He said that his father is being abusive towards the hospital staff and yells at them, flinging racial insults and slurs. So I made a criticism of his father being offensive, and made the comment that he also used to (and probably still does) yell at his mother. My husband got very defensive of his father and said I was judging him. So I stood my ground and said that yelling is NEVER ok, that his father IS offensive and that even HE says that about him. So he’s allowed to comment but I am not? I got angry and said I’m allowed to have my own opinions and it’s not like I’ve said something he hadn’t said himself, minus the yelling of course. Then he practically excused away his father yelling at his mother over her spending too much. I reiterated that yelling is NEVER ok. I also told him it’s ok to be critical of your parents and you can still love them.

This seems hopeless. If he even agreed to seeking therapy he has a long way to go. He’s SO defensive and defends his father’s own abuse. That is not a good sign.

And yes, we moved in too quickly together, we got engaged and married fast. Whirlwind courtships often spell trouble and are a major red flag. I knew better than this.

Defensiveness about oneself and one's parents strikes me as hardest to overcome. For example, I used to be extremely defensive about my mother's alcoholism. An accurate comment about her felt like an attack on me.

Perhaps the ground can be prepared by pointing out abusiveness in others, people he is not so invested in, when the occasion arises. Idk, perhaps he can see that first, without being asked to see a connection with himself.

That’s a tricky one. it’s quite common to feel defensive about ones kids and parents. It’s a sensitive topic. It hits too close to home

My dad is a pain in a neck. But I’d not want my husband pointing it out. It’s not because i am clueless or defensive, it’s because criticizing ones parents is one thing but hearing criticism from other people (who aren’t my dad’s kids) is a bit tricky.

My husbands dad was quite terrible, he passed away before we’ve met. When my husband share some things I listen but I am careful to comment unless he asks what I think. He wasn’t my father, he is not for me to criticize.

It’s the same with kids. I might have some critical thoughts about my daughter but I absolutely wouldn’t engage in such discussion with my husband (he isn’t her father) and I never criticize my stepkids. I listen if my husband does, but I don’t offer opinions (unless he asks what’s my take on it). These topics are always too sensitive and not every opinion is welcome

Your husband might see how badly his dad behaves but is not willing to discuss it. it’s a very sensitive topic.

I agree with Bill about bringing up a story or example of neutral unrelated people as an example of bad behavior. Then I’d expect your husband not to be defensive and acknowledge that certain behaviors are bad. Then he might be able to reflect on his own behavior.

It's because he's really now talking about himself and it's hard to face a character flaw. It's why only "he" is allowed to form an opinion about his dad. Anything you say is perceived as an attack on him.

I've been through this, too.

Thanks everyone.

I think what Lady said resonates the most for me. He takes it as an attack on himself because he’s just like his father. I’ve even made this connection for him in the past. So it’s accurate to say that he took it as an attack on himself and not just as a judgement of his father. I didn’t say anything different than what he’s said except for mentioning that yelling is never ok. In my opinion I should be allowed to state to my own husband that his father is abusive. But of course, I can’t because then that means he’s abusive too. Which is what I need to get at.

He’s able to point out in others that yelling and anger are meant to intimidate. He must know to some extent what he’s doing when he yells.

I'm glad you are financially independent and able to leave him.

Yes. This is important should I have to leave.

So, I almost left my husband 6-8 months ago -- I had a plan to save $5000 in total over several months time so that I could move out in June when our apt lease ended. Then things improved and changed all for the better for the next 6 months, and I became far happier, more settled and far more hopeful.

This latest incident of him yelling at me again, for the first time in 6 months really, has set me back emotionally and propelled me forward into motion again.

I should have known or seen that this was coming again. But things were going smoothly, he was all lovey dovey with me, treating me like a princess all the time, and I felt good about things. That's when i posted on here that I was happy.

This all threw a total monkey wrench into the equation.

Last night he was very careful not to turn our tense conversation about his father being abusive into something ugly. And it could have become that, but it did not. I noticed him visibly trying not to fight or argue.

I really do not know how to feel. Should I feel somewhat hopeful? I feel more reticent than anything. I feel reserved and objective, with a very "we'll see" approach and attitude.

And he's treating me like a princess again. The contrast is too much for me to handle. At least I know my dealbreakers and when I must leave, if I must leave. That makes me feel better. But it's definitely a "wait and see" scenario.

Yesterday he made another mean "joke" directed at me about me not taking good care of our cats. I take very good care of them, even though they're HIS cats that he brought into the household, I treat them as our cats. I feed them and change their water - we share this responsibility. He is in charge of changing their litter, since I do all the dishes in the house. It works out well. But his cutting remark made me angry, and I once again told him that mean jokes are NOT funny, that they're put downs, and that we had already discussed this. I also said "ok then. I will make mean comments about you, and see how you feel being put down, cut down and treated unfairly." He became quiet then and said again that he won't joke with me in that way.

Women on other abuse support forums where I am a member always tell me to leave him. They tell me "you're going to be dealing with this issue for the rest of your life - it's exhausting and demoralizing." These women have suffered at the hands of verbal and emotional abuse for many many years and never left, so they're speaking from experience.

I guess I have a TINY TINY sliver of hope left. It's ever so small, but it's there. Most of me feels like it's hopeless and that it's going to end. I want to be realistic.

At the same time, I HAVE seen changed behaviors in him, after I've called him out on something and after I put my foot down. Yet, is that just temporary change, and then he slips back again into his old ways? And then I have to start all over again with him? Or can permanent changes with therapy actually occur? These are hypothetical questions that no one can really answer.

And now? Now he's sort of in a love bombing phase, I think? He's showering me with love and affection. And this morning, he told me "we're meant to be together" because we snuggle together all night, totally intertwined, as though he's trying to solidify with me that we cannot separate, or trying to convince me.

I've read that after an incident of abuse, that they "love bomb". So is that all this is? The good behavior and all the loving behavior is actually a deliberate manipulation, done in order to keep me "hooked"?

I am questioning everything right now. Everything.

I don't have experience with this sort of thing, but it does sound very confusing.

Thanks so much, and I understand.

It can be confusing. I know I need a therapist's assistance. I am going to call today to see if I can schedule a virtual appt.

I'd think so. To his credit, he's afraid to lose you. You're a good person who is on top of his behaviours and I suspect he's aware he's a better person by being with you even though it's not enough and it's still damaging.

I'm in the same situation. This morning I woke up with multiple "I love you" notes taped to the walls, fridge, mirrors.. over compensating.

Gottman Institute sends out weekly emails (Tuesdays and Thursdays) about relationship strategies. He talks a lot about the Four Horsemen that is the death of relationships. Both my partner and I receive them. It might be worth a look?

A standard part of the cycle of abuse is a period of kindness, often fueled by fear that the person being mistreated might actually leave.

I agree that the Gottman Institute is excellent!

You're very on top of these behaviors yourself! I love your posts and insights. Thank you so much.

Yes it's overcompensation. I can sense that he doesn't want to lose me and now is afraid he might. Those multiple post it notes may as well be my husband's as well. He's overdoing it.

I will take a look at Gottman Institute -- thank you!

I made a therapy appt for myself for Wed to discuss my marriage with my therapist finally. I haven't had an appt in 6 weeks or so now.

Thanks, Bill.

Yes, I can see this in action now. I do worry that it's not genuine, though I feel his love coming across in a genuine way.

But the sudden hatred towards me makes me question everything.