[LadyShadow]

Hello everyone!

So I was watching the Devil's Advocate, and I know it is just a movie but it got me to thinking.

Al Pacino plays the Devil and he says that Vanity is definitely his favorite sin. So in other words if you love yourself TOO much or you are full of yourself it is considered "evil".

So what about us? The ones that hate ourselves and that have horrible self-image. Does that mean we are closer to God?

I'm very spiritual and I always believed in a higher power but this particular question really got to me.

Are we closer to God because we are not vain? Are we supposed to suffer?

[Anika.]

I am not a beliver in the devil or god, but what I do know of the god I think you are speaking of is that it is said he made us out of love. Do you think god would be pleased with you hating yourself and suffering ? I don't think this would be his goal or would make him feel happy. Isn't the body supposed to be a temple?

I think he would want you to find love for yourself, and appreciation for your body in all it's strengths and weaknesses. To me that is much different than vanity.

[Thunder Bow]

Vanity is usually thinking that you are better than others. It is OK to boost and like your self. That is better than conceit. Honoring yourself is not vanity. By the way I saw that movie on SyFy as well.

[LadyShadow]

Originally Posted by Thunder Bow

Vanity is usually thinking that you are better than others. It is OK to boost and like your self. That is better than conceit. Honoring yourself is not vanity. By the way I saw that movie on SyFy as well.

It's a great movie isn't it? I guess I took the meaning of vanity a different way. I see now what you guys are talking about, thanks!

[BrokenNBeautiful]

Humility is not the same as self-hate.

I can be humble and also have some healthy pride. I am working on that.

I grew up confusing the two.

Self-love is not vanity. I think vanity is like another form of self-hate, actually. Trying to feel better than others because of our own insecurity, maybe.

Just my take. Disregard or agree to disagree if you want.

Carol

[Pikku Myy]

I have always had very confusing thoughts about my self image.... and still do!!! Movies are movies, but you are a human being which means YOU deserve and sometimes need "vanity" to cope thru your spiritual issues Nothing wrong with this!!!

[bluecupcake]

I think a loving creator would want us to love ourselves realistically. I think a loving creator would want us to feel loved and good about ourselves, especially if we are acting like good people. I believe in a loving creator instead of a punishing one. When I was younger I had self-image problems, mostly because I was young and naive and didn't know or understand myself well. Also I think Hollywood is a bad influence on young people and their self-image. But as I got older I learned how to accept myself and all my flaws. Some days are better than others. Also I had negative self-esteem because of some evil people in my life who liked to tear me down. I learned how to stand up for myself and tell them to not say unkind things to me and they are no longer welcome in my life. There are over 7 billion people in this world, at least 100 of them should be supportive of me. Just have to find them. hehe. Peace

[avlady]

I know, what about all these magazines too, cosmo, and others, I used to try to be the skinneiest person in the world when I was in high school, as that was wht the magazines were portraying, now I;m pretty heavy, most of the weight gained when I had a child, never lost the baby weight but I can still say it doesn't bother me too much, ilove my son and if that's what it takes to have son i would tell myself back then to not worry about my weight, unless it was dangerously high in number.

[Mark56]

Not focusing on labels such as vanity, I strive instead to bring blessings to the existence of others. It has been quite the revelation greeting anyone with a response to "how are ya?" being "I feel blessed, thank you, how are you?" Since blessings are universal, not limited by faith or non-faith speaking in the language of blessing seems to be the world wide currency of healing. So, laying down my mirror, taking the focus off of myself, reaching out to folks I know or do not know, I have found life far more blessed when smiles come to the face of those I encounter just because I asked how there blessing meter is for the day.

All know blessings. Vanity is not frequently contemplated when one is counting blessings. My first blessing for today includes having come here and taken in the sharing freely given among all.

Ahhhhh.............
Mark56

[Gus1234U]

i like what Mark says. to me, Vanity is all kinds of self examination, both hateful and complimentary. to be always comparing oneself to others, or to some ideal, good or bad, is vanity. to be selfless is to not care how one is doing in comparison,,, only to be present in the moment and aware of what is happening.

what a good question Platinium~! best wishes to you in your spiritual quest.

[James_from_Idaho]

I just want to say, I am a very religious person.. Perhaps my view points will seem as pointed.. But I think that God really is love.. And that we find out who we are in the struggle.. And it can be a struggle.. I think everybody has vanity.. But I think the more you learn about God.. The more he is a part of you, you are transformed to his image.. We start out on milk until we are chewing meat.. And God is the only one that has it completely right for now.. I hope that makes sense.. God bless

[enlightenedM]

Originally Posted by PlatinumHeart

Hello everyone!

So I was watching the Devil's Advocate, and I know it is just a movie but it got me to thinking.

Al Pacino plays the Devil and he says that Vanity is definitely his favorite sin. So in other words if you love yourself TOO much or you are full of yourself it is considered "evil".

So what about us? The ones that hate ourselves and that have horrible self-image. Does that mean we are closer to God?

I'm very spiritual and I always believed in a higher power but this particular question really got to me.

Are we closer to God because we are not vain? Are we supposed to suffer?

Keep in mind that what you saw was just a movie that reflected the opinions, understanding or simply script to make it sound more intriguing. What you need to look is not so much unto plainly adopting the ideas of others but within yourself and what resonates with you. I believe you have to love yourself before you can love anyone else. Real love is unconditional and it trancends all energies, the love they were describing as in vanity, is Ego-based love, not heart-based love.

Val G. "Positive Thinking Works!"

[happiedasiy]

Originally Posted by BrokenNBeautiful

Humility is not the same as self-hate.

I can be humble and also have some healthy pride. I am working on that.

I grew up confusing the two.

Self-love is not vanity. I think vanity is like another form of self-hate, actually. Trying to feel better than others because of our own insecurity, maybe.

Just my take. Disregard or agree to disagree if you want.

Carol

Dear BnB,
I liked your points you made about vanity / self love/ self hate.
Trying to feel better than others, to uplift our own self insecurity.
All are about ego not spiritual.
H.

[(JD)]

Vanity is wrong. Hating yourself (because we are made in the image of God) is also wrong. I don't see them as opposites, but thoughts and emotions gone awry?

Conceit is not good. Caring for oneself is good and proper.

"Cleanliness" is not next to "Godliness" <---mythbusting.

I do find that too many people think that taking care of themselves is being selfish and conceited when it most definitely is not. Even the secular people know to take care of oneself first is very important so you can take care of others. (Think about the flight and pressure loss in the cabin... MOTHERS, put your own oxygen mask on first and THEN your child's!)

IMO God only asks that we do the best we can. This isn't the best we have ever done for all time... but the best we can do today, this very minute. This includes positive regard and thinking... What more can anyone do?

[spondiferous]

I believe, first and foremost, that it is sometimes difficult, when living with mental or emotional illness, to fairly appraise ourselves. I think that self-doubt or self-hatred are missing the mark, just as to have vanity is to miss the mark. Neither one of these things gives us a true appraisal of ourselves; it merely reflects the state of being in which we find ourselves. In my own experience, I sometimes wonder myself if I am somehow being punished with mental illness for something I have done wrong. But I don't really believe that, and I have to work really hard sometimes when my symptoms are at their strongest to hold onto that.
Today I read that if life is all easy, you've strayed from the path of faith and good works. If life is difficult and obstacles abound, it means that essentially you are facing the truth in all things and are thus closer to God. I don't necessarily believe this, but I do think it makes an interesting point. Most people assume that if we are doing 'well' then things are 'easy'. I think it can just as easily be the opposite. There have been times in my life where everything is fine, I am taken care of, surrounded by people who love me, and I couldn't be more miserable. Then there are times when I have no idea what's going to happen to me from one day to the next, and my life is full of doubt and uncertainty, and I don't know whether to trust what I am seeing or hearing or thinking, and at the same time in those moments I feel closer to a divine presence than in anything else.
There have been times when I have suffered immeasurably, despite being the best person I can think of to be.
To me, faith is a journey. Spirituality, I believe, is reflected by all things, not just by the truth of how God (however you wish to define that power/presence) has made us or views us, but by our own experience here on Earth. I don't know what I believe, ultimately, in terms of doctrine. But I believe that no matter how I judge myself, the Creator has a place for me and it is my own. Of this I am sure. And I do not believe that any God who created me would do so and then have me suffer because God wills it, or chooses it because of any set of actions I have performed or choices I have made. It is my work in this life to come to terms with what that means for me, and how I can apply that to my life in a meaningful and healing way.
There has been a lot of wisdom posted here. I always enjoy hearing what other people think about faith and spirituality. Good point to raise, Platinum.

[Dante'sStoker]

What intrigues me about religious discussion is having been told we are incapable of truly knowing god. Faith covers that unknown. Yet, people give authoritative opinions on what we cannot know.

[Qurat]

Originally Posted by PlatinumHeart

Hello everyone!

So I was watching the Devil's Advocate, and I know it is just a movie but it got me to thinking.

Al Pacino plays the Devil and he says that Vanity is definitely his favorite sin. So in other words if you love yourself TOO much or you are full of yourself it is considered "evil".

So what about us? The ones that hate ourselves and that have horrible self-image. Does that mean we are closer to God?

I'm very spiritual and I always believed in a higher power but this particular question really got to me.

Are we closer to God because we are not vain? Are we supposed to suffer?

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[LadyShadow]

Originally Posted by spondiferous

I believe, first and foremost, that it is sometimes difficult, when living with mental or emotional illness, to fairly appraise ourselves. I think that self-doubt or self-hatred are missing the mark, just as to have vanity is to miss the mark. Neither one of these things gives us a true appraisal of ourselves; it merely reflects the state of being in which we find ourselves. In my own experience, I sometimes wonder myself if I am somehow being punished with mental illness for something I have done wrong. But I don't really believe that, and I have to work really hard sometimes when my symptoms are at their strongest to hold onto that.
Today I read that if life is all easy, you've strayed from the path of faith and good works. If life is difficult and obstacles abound, it means that essentially you are facing the truth in all things and are thus closer to God. I don't necessarily believe this, but I do think it makes an interesting point. Most people assume that if we are doing 'well' then things are 'easy'. I think it can just as easily be the opposite. There have been times in my life where everything is fine, I am taken care of, surrounded by people who love me, and I couldn't be more miserable. Then there are times when I have no idea what's going to happen to me from one day to the next, and my life is full of doubt and uncertainty, and I don't know whether to trust what I am seeing or hearing or thinking, and at the same time in those moments I feel closer to a divine presence than in anything else.
There have been times when I have suffered immeasurably, despite being the best person I can think of to be.
To me, faith is a journey. Spirituality, I believe, is reflected by all things, not just by the truth of how God (however you wish to define that power/presence) has made us or views us, but by our own experience here on Earth. I don't know what I believe, ultimately, in terms of doctrine. But I believe that no matter how I judge myself, the Creator has a place for me and it is my own. Of this I am sure. And I do not believe that any God who created me would do so and then have me suffer because God wills it, or chooses it because of any set of actions I have performed or choices I have made. It is my work in this life to come to terms with what that means for me, and how I can apply that to my life in a meaningful and healing way.
There has been a lot of wisdom posted here. I always enjoy hearing what other people think about faith and spirituality. Good point to raise, Platinum.

I am going to reply here because this post stirred up a lot inside me. A lot of well points made. I realize when I made this post I was living a different life and a lot has changed over the past few months. A lot of things that were clouded in doubt has been brought into the light and I am dealing with it. I am closer now to acheiving my goal of self discovery, with my flute by side sending harmonies out into the universe.

It is a different time for me these days. A time for me to shine.

[happiedasiy]

Originally Posted by PlatinumHeart

I am going to reply here because this post stirred up a lot inside me. A lot of well points made. I realize when I made this post I was living a different life and a lot has changed over the past few months. A lot of things that were clouded in doubt has been brought into the light and I am dealing with it. I am closer now to acheiving my goal of self discovery, with my flute by side sending harmonies out into the universe.

It is a different time for me these days. A time for me to shine.

Dear platinum H.

I would like to say, The comparing mind is mind that is in a combative state. Filled with doubt and confusion that will not give you clear truthful answers. I am glad that you were aware and were able to move on!
Harmony and Hugs to you.
H.

[winter4me]

Originally Posted by BrokenNBeautiful

Humility is not the same as self-hate.

I can be humble and also have some healthy pride. I am working on that.

I grew up confusing the two.

Self-love is not vanity. I think vanity is like another form of self-hate, actually. Trying to feel better than others because of our own insecurity, maybe.

Just my take. Disregard or agree to disagree if you want.

Carol

I think you nailed it! Thank you.

[Rose76]

I am inclined to be vain. Until recently, I didn't understand how anyone could hate themselves. Having racked up failure after failure in my life, I now am l finding that I do hate myself. I think it is connected to vanity. A lot of my failures involved being rejected. It seems to me that I wouldn't have gotten so rejected, if there wasn't something really awful wrong with me. I'm convinced of that.

It's awful. It seems like this is life paying me back for having thought too highly of myself.