[Misplaced_08]

Im ashamed to admit ive called God unfair at many points in my life. It isnt Always bexuse of whT I go through, sometimes I see others in pain and wonder if God really is fair...
For exMple, seeing the homeless on the stree and little children in slums really breaks my heart. I hear people say that only those who work bard achieve the luxuries in life, but what if u mever had amything to begin with? What if there wS never means of support?I wish I was in a position to help those poor souls.
But God is, he could flip the world and make everything better for them.

Please clear my head someone!

[vans1974]

My belief is that God is fair, just, loving and merciful! Only he knows why some suffer so badly and some not much at all. I believe all will be made fair in the next life and saved by there works and grace and knowledge. Only he can judge us. That's my belief. Hope it helps a little!

[Thunder Bow]

Religion is all about social order and control. Thus you are getting what you are quoting from. Religion has little to do with the Universe and all its powers.

[Citrine]

Dont be ashamed of your thinking. You may be right, you may not. None of us know anything really. What you think now may change in 20 years anyway.

I have thought the same and sworn I was hated by God/ whoever you want to say. I came to the conclusion that even the higher power rolls a dice. Theres a bigger picture and as if we will ever know in our earthly life what it isall about. JMO

[Misplaced_08]

Originally Posted by Thunder Bow

Religion is all about social order and control. Thus you are getting what you are quoting from. Religion has little to do with the Universe and all its powers.

Could you please elaborate on that thought?
Isn't it all supposed to be interlinked?

[Misplaced_08]

Originally Posted by Citrine

Dont be ashamed of your thinking. You may be right, you may not. None of us know anything really. What you think now may change in 20 years anyway.

I have thought the same and sworn I was hated by God/ whoever you want to say. I came to the conclusion that even the higher power rolls a dice. Theres a bigger picture and as if we will ever know in our earthly life what it isall about. JMO

There is a bigger picture, indeed.
The world can be quite confusing for some of us :P
I pray those of us who know God and believe in him start acting upong blind-faith - it seems to be less and less in everyone these days including me.

If god made everything instantly better people would think they can rule themselves and that they don't need to live by His rules.
Where would faith be if we got everything we wanted?

[nicoleflynn]

I have had the same thoughts. I understand that adults suffer, but babies and children? They have no resources. I hear horrific stories of abuse as moderator of an abused survivors' group.....babies and children who are raped; unbellievable.

[IndieVisible]

IMHO it is what it is and we only see a small part of the picture and if we go by what we see only of course we will question if God is just or even if there is one. As for why bad things happen to babies and children, it is very difficult to imagine why and how a just God could allow such horrors, and what about the holocaust? We would go crazy trying to explain all that. The why's and how's is not known to us. The rain falls on the just and the unjust. Bad things happen to good people and children. You can lose everything in a minute. There is no way for us to explain all this. Either there is a Just God or there is no god, depends where your faith or lack of take you, but either way, there are no answers.

[Misplaced_08]

Originally Posted by kelly4519

If god made everything instantly better people would think they can rule themselves and that they don't need to live by His rules.
Where would faith be if we got everything we wanted?

I believe you, but its just I see some people go through a LOT of misery - like I talked about the homeless or the beggers...really depresses me. What sin could they have committed to have to deal with punishment of such intensity?

[Thunder Bow]

Originally Posted by Misplaced_08

Could you please elaborate on that thought?
Isn't it all supposed to be interlinked?

It Is All Interlinked, and You are Part Of All There Is. Honor Yourself. Know that you are part of the Universe and all its powers.

[krisakira]

To the OP, No. "God" is not just.

[mzunderstood79]

Originally Posted by Misplaced_08

I believe you, but its just I see some people go through a LOT of misery - like I talked about the homeless or the beggers...really depresses me. What sin could they have committed to have to deal with punishment of such intensity?

God's plans are not to be questioned. Read Job in the Bible. I have seen a lot of tragic things in my life. My dad's last words on his deathbed were, "when the Lord's light comes, we'll all laugh in splendor." He wasn't a religious man but he believed. Hope that helps.

Sent from my KFTT using Tapatalk HD

[krisakira]

I think you have the right to question God. Who's to say we have to blindly follow a god? Question everything.

[mzunderstood79]

I won't say that I never question God, it is only natural to question Him sometimes. But I just have to believe that He knows what He is doing.

[mzunderstood79]

Exhort one another daily, while it is called Today; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin
- Hebrews 3:13

We cannot help but notice from this exhortation the deceitfulness of sin, the swiftness with which it can deceive us, and the urgency with which we must battle against it.

Sin lies to us, causing us to harden our hearts and draw away from God in unbelief (12). When we give in to any sin, we are not able to think as clearly and joyfully and trustingly as before.

Whether the sin is lust or anger or pride or greed, sin deceives us into thinking that satisfaction is found somewhere else than in God. It promises fulfillment through sensual pleasure, or putting others down, or lifting ourselves up, or gaining more "stuff."

But this is a lie. True and lasting joy is only found in the path and presence of the living God. Everything else is just a dead, limp substitute that has been painted and polished and perfumed to look enticing.

But how swiftly we give in to the lie! The writer reminds us that we need daily exhorting, lest sin have its hardening effect on our hearts. We can walk faithfully for a week, a decade, or half a lifetime and then suddenly fall in a day! Constant vigilance, and the exhortation of others, is needed in order to avoid sin's pitfalls today, no matter how successful we've been so far.

Finally, the writer presses the urgency of our situation. It is only called "Today" for 24 hours! Then tomorrow will come, and soon the end of all days. Do not put off the vital work of repentance and faithfulness. Today is already almost over, and our Lord that much closer to returning.

[Grey Matter]

I do not believe God (if there is one I am honestly apathetic with religion) is just. Someone mentioned the story of Job here, but the story of Job has been vastly watered down among religious teachings. Some religious institutions going as far as not sharing the story of Job. What it boils down to is a bet between Satan and God. And when it gets out of hand, God back peddles and tells Job he lost everything because he dared to question his power rather than admitting himself sinned.

The one thing I heard over and over again when my 23 year old brother died was that "it's in god's plan". Well, god's plan for us it quite bad since it has left my mother in bed since August. It caused my depression to spiral out of control. Logically, there was no "reason" for him to die besides his illness. My family has not murdered, stole, etc. So why is my dad facing 5 years of life left if he doesn't get a new kidney, why am I am chemotherapy, why is my mom physically disabled? I stopped questioning religion and told myself that it is all random. The universe is random. To assume everyone who is struggling has sinned so horribly that they deserve to suffer or that you can't dare question scares me a little. If we do not question, how do we learn? If we do not question, how do we begin to understand?

I live a happy life accepting that there may not be a place for me after I die. I am at peace with dying and I have never feared it. I don't think it's fair to say the only joy is found in religion. I am happy for those who find religion as a joy, I am happy for those who do not. Respect those who live as they live and question.

[Webgoji]

Um ... is this thread really appropriate for this forum? Not saying in particular response is, but this just seems like a real emotional hot topic.

[Misplaced_08]

Originally Posted by mzunderstood79

Exhort one another daily, while it is called Today; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin
- Hebrews 3:13

We cannot help but notice from this exhortation the deceitfulness of sin, the swiftness with which it can deceive us, and the urgency with which we must battle against it.

Sin lies to us, causing us to harden our hearts and draw away from God in unbelief (12). When we give in to any sin, we are not able to think as clearly and joyfully and trustingly as before.

Whether the sin is lust or anger or pride or greed, sin deceives us into thinking that satisfaction is found somewhere else than in God. It promises fulfillment through sensual pleasure, or putting others down, or lifting ourselves up, or gaining more "stuff."

But this is a lie. True and lasting joy is only found in the path and presence of the living God. Everything else is just a dead, limp substitute that has been painted and polished and perfumed to look enticing.

But how swiftly we give in to the lie! The writer reminds us that we need daily exhorting, lest sin have its hardening effect on our hearts. We can walk faithfully for a week, a decade, or half a lifetime and then suddenly fall in a day! Constant vigilance, and the exhortation of others, is needed in order to avoid sin's pitfalls today, no matter how successful we've been so far.

Finally, the writer presses the urgency of our situation. It is only called "Today" for 24 hours! Then tomorrow will come, and soon the end of all days. Do not put off the vital work of repentance and faithfulness. Today is already almost over, and our Lord that much closer to returning.

Beautifully said
So, your point could be explained by saying that maybe - just maybe what we see going around us is like a "test" to see for how long we hold on to our faith?

Ill admit, no matter how much close I become to God seeing certain examples around me make me lose my faith.

I guess it really is difficult to imagine/plan the way God does. We may try our best, but we're his creations after all; who could outdo the creator?

Thanks!

[Misplaced_08]

Originally Posted by Grey Matter

I do not believe God (if there is one I am honestly apathetic with religion) is just. Someone mentioned the story of Job here, but the story of Job has been vastly watered down among religious teachings. Some religious institutions going as far as not sharing the story of Job. What it boils down to is a bet between Satan and God. And when it gets out of hand, God back peddles and tells Job he lost everything because he dared to question his power rather than admitting himself sinned.

The one thing I heard over and over again when my 23 year old brother died was that "it's in god's plan". Well, god's plan for us it quite bad since it has left my mother in bed since August. It caused my depression to spiral out of control. Logically, there was no "reason" for him to die besides his illness. My family has not murdered, stole, etc. So why is my dad facing 5 years of life left if he doesn't get a new kidney, why am I am chemotherapy, why is my mom physically disabled? I stopped questioning religion and told myself that it is all random. The universe is random. To assume everyone who is struggling has sinned so horribly that they deserve to suffer or that you can't dare question scares me a little. If we do not question, how do we learn? If we do not question, how do we begin to understand?

I live a happy life accepting that there may not be a place for me after I die. I am at peace with dying and I have never feared it. I don't think it's fair to say the only joy is found in religion. I am happy for those who find religion as a joy, I am happy for those who do not. Respect those who live as they live and question.

Grey Matter, I am sorry for your loss and for the pain this life has put upon you. I wish you and you family well
I'm at a loss of words, I understand how it is to have unfit parents....all our lives they look after us and when its our turn we find our whole world shattering.

Nevertheless, there is the love we share - the memories we make. Each day we see them we get the oppurtunity to create a new history with them.

Glad that you're not bitter, glad that you're hear looking after yourself and others

Thanks and take care

[Misplaced_08]

Originally Posted by Webgoji

Um ... is this thread really appropriate for this forum? Not saying in particular response is, but this just seems like a real emotional hot topic.

Hey Webgoji

The moderators actually edited the part where I mentioned the Bible and a certain other religious topics - my bad Im new so I had no idea where to put the boundaries.
So I guess its okay now..

I come from a conservative family where no one I know would clear my doubts, also, my friends arent from the same religon as me so I would usually get responds that were according to their beleifs.

And believe me I had to find out the answers!
But I believe, for the most part, everyone is still just as lost as me...

[Webgoji]

Originally Posted by Misplaced_08

Hey Webgoji

The moderators actually edited the part where I mentioned the Bible and a certain other religious topics - my bad Im new so I had no idea where to put the boundaries.
So I guess its okay now..

If they're good, I'm good.

I don't know why but I still want to try to explain something, its all only my opinion okay? It bothers me very much too to see so much suffering. But if we understand that God is not the ruler of this world it explains a lot.
Job didn't end like that. he was blessed with another family and many riches. Job never lost his faith. Satan was allowed to test his faith. Satan is the real ruler of this world. He is being allowed to test us, and yes it is Adam and Eves' sin that resulted in the wickedness in the world which results in sickness and suffering. Time is needed for it to be proved that humans cannot rule themselves, and that Satan is not right that we don't need Gods loving rules. Humans have tried every form of government possible and with things only worse. At the right time God will undo all the injustices of his faithful followers.

[IndieVisible]

Yes but it is commonly accepted that Job was a fictitious story to illustrate a greater point. So we prolly should not take it literally. I still say that since we can't see the whole picture, regardless if you are atheist or theist, it is impossible to arrive at a satisfactory answer to this problem.

If you say God is not in charge of this world or not in control, then god is not a God at all for he would have limitations. If you say he is in complete control then the just question nags us. If we say there is no god then we are still faced with the problem of explaining if there is no intelligent design then why is there not total chaos? There does seem to be order in this universe and in life, there are the laws of physics for example. If there was no god then how can one explain such order with laws that can not be broken and DNA being a complete language in it's own right. So you see, regardless which model you choose, with god or without god, there are problems and that's because regardless which model you feel most comfortable with, we do not have the whole picture or all the pieces.

How does it limit Him because he is allowing time for humans to prove that they cannot live without a loving God to direct them? You don't have to answer, I like your ideas Indie....but it just doesn't make sense. He is not limited because of His choices.I didn't say He is not in control. I said he is not the Ruler of this world. How is he not god at all if he has allowed Satan to have the world?(for now, to give humans time and for it to be proven we cannot rule ourselves) Remember, Satan offered to Jesus all of the world and whats in it if Jesus would bow down to him. That clearly shows that the world belongs to Satan. Jesus clearly says he is no part of the world.
There are problems because people choose to live by their own freewill, and often that includes things that God who loves us would tell us not to do for our own good.