Schizoid learning to connect with people - have you ever seen this?!

I noticed this on wikipedia reading about SPD:

"Guntrip observed that the preceding characteristics result in loneliness: "Loneliness is an inescapable result of schizoid introversion and abolition of external relationships. It reveals itself in the intense longing for friendship and love which repeatedly break through. Loneliness in the midst of a crowd is the experience of the schizoid cut off from affective rapport." This is a central experience of the schizoid that is often lost to the observer. Contrary to the familiar caricature of the schizoid as uncaring and cold, the vast majority of schizoid persons who become patients express at some point in their treatment their longing for friendship and love. This is not the schizoid patient as described in the DSMs. Such longing, however, may not break through except in the schizoid’s fantasy life, to which the therapist may not be allowed access for quite a long period in treatment.

There is a very narrow range of classic DSM-defined schizoids for whom the hope of establishing relationships is so minimal as to be almost extinct. The longing for closeness and attachment is almost unidentifiable to such a person. These individuals will not voluntarily become patients, as the schizoid individual who becomes a patient does so often because of the twin motivations of loneliness and longing. This type of patient believes that some kind of connection and attachment is possible and is well suited to psychotherapy. The psychotherapist, however, may approach the schizoid patient with a sense of therapeutic pessimism, if not nihilism, and may misread the patient by believing that the patient’s wariness is indifference and that caution is coldness."

So. What are your experiences with this?

For me it was a gradual (few-month long) process that left me as a schizoid at age 18. Then a decade later, a sudden mental event as a response to an external signal turned everything upside-down. That's when the status quo of the schizoid life ended. I suspect there was always a hidden vulnerable spot that when hit upon like this would come out. By stumbling upon it by accident, I was rather ...unlucky or lucky?

So. I wonder if such a spot exists for most schizoids. I want to hear from others, whether anyone else experienced or noticed in some other way such a thing.

Connecting with people has emotional benefits.

Lol that wasn't exactly the question here. Are you SPD?

So no one's posted yet.

Then let me post first. Apparently I'm learning to connect to the affective experience of being with people, friends, romantic stuff...

It's a terribly slow process. Painful. Tedious. Keep feeling like I'm about to give up. So yes, many difficulties overall.

And I have no therapist for this as I haven't found anyone so far who fits my needs, especially someone with experience in this issue (and other problematic areas).

But I'm maybe seeing some tiny progress. I'd like to think I'm not wrong about this as I have recently actually felt something that was long forgotten and also felt things that were new in the sense that I never actually experienced them with actual people in actual reality before.

There are side effects so I'm not sure yet how this will end up long term.

But if someone else has gone through this, I'd like to hear from them

Nothing? This is not too common I guess?

Hi Tiger , I have " traits " of SPD as part of Trauma. Working on it all. Suggest looking at Pete Walkers website and books where this is talked about and " Self in exile " website. Hope that helped.

I've not been diagnosed but can relate heavily with the mentioned characteristics, especially the conflict between always wanting to be outside society, and the loneliness and insecurity that can bring. I have a marker in the sand between "wants to be a total recluse" and "wants to be in society and have all the normal things - but very much near the fringes". I move between them, now and then. Weirdly, the only thing that matches the loneliness of being disconnected is the anxiety of being connected....and there's the paradox. It's hard to serve two masters.

I've no expertise so....good luck. It can work with a lot of understanding I think and the right people.

A few years ago i went to a lot of trouble to obtain guntrip's book. Ive been seeing my current t for almost ten years. The first several years i googled and read, read, read. The last few years have been more about idk relating? Applying what i learned from my reading? Now i would like to review what i read and see how ive changed. Cuz like now i watch old twilight zones or even more current movies - there was one in particular recently, cant remember offhand what it was - where i am just amazed at how differently i react; at what seems important that did not at all before. Birdman of Alcatraz comes to mind - but i dont think that was it. But stg like that. Maybe Bye Bye Birdie!

Thanks a lot for the resources. What sort of trauma caused the SPD traits to come out? If I may ask.

Being in society and having all the normal things but not center of everything socially sounds fine by me. I don't feel the need to be a total recluse anymore, the way my SPD thingie started originally was that, I did want to be a total recluse and I did fully withdraw, I essentially quit society. I did not find it lonely, I did not feel insecure either. It was rather comfortable. I did communicate with and helped people online and did my business online as well but that was about it. I didn't connect with them for the sake of connection even online. However I never changed my original goal of having a proper long term romantic relationship.. I just did not think about it for a while I guess.

You talk of anxiety of being connected, this is interesting as I do not experience it as such but I may have hidden anxiety... it could make sense.

Which book is this, what is the title?

Can you give examples of what seems important now that did not before, in those movies, etc?

With your therapist, is it psychoanalysis or what is the method that worked?

The last question is the most important one

Thanks.

Sustained trauma from my Mother ( until her death ) emotional neglect and rejection , verbal abuse and repetitive trauma into adulthood usually in the form of inappropriate responses. The Pete Walker book I mentioned talks about the traumatologist John Brere , who says the DSM could be reduced to the size of a small pamphlet.

Thanks.

Haha wait say more on the latter sentence. I mean, explain it more.

Hmm, in my case, I can't say it was trauma per se. It's hard to understand actually. It was something about not being able to get involved in my new high school back then. So I just got disconnected into my own little "bubble" which was a terrible experience but not traumatic as no one tried to harm me or anything. People were actually pretty nice at that new high school. Just no real interactions like in the previous high school even though those interactions there mostly consisted of conflict. I enjoyed even that conflict stuff more than this total non-involvement. The other thing contributing to me becoming full blown SPD (trait-wise at least) was a problem with my experiences in a romantic relationship -being pretty much a beginner at the whole thing- but it was not traumatic again, I just had the same issue of not getting involved... Hmm weird anyway.

My t said guntrip only wrote the one book about schizoid.

I asked him about the last question, but we got distracted. Probably Rogerian. Unconditional positive regard.

OK thanks. Did the book help you?

The only "connect with people" thing that kinda bugs me, is that I'm extremely clumsy(verbally) when strangers casually try to interact with me at say a grocery store, park, or gym. If I do manage to actually add a psychiatrist and therapist to the group of people who are supposed to keep me alive.... I think working on that basic conversation skill could be the easiest and most useful "icebreaker" with the therapist.

I have learned that I can avoid awkwardness with random strangers (like at the grocery store) by asking them questions. How is your day, enjoying the weather, have you been busy today, that sort of thing. Most people actually like to talk about themselves. By asking the questions, they get what they want (attention, I guess) and I get what I want (not feeling put on the spot).

I find this too kecanoe, I just ask people questions about themselves and how they are feeling because I know that people like to talk about themselves, even if I cant make myself relate to what they are telling me. Its not that I don't care per se... but I'm generally not really fussed with whether people are appreciating the weather or not lol.

I have been diagnosed Schizoid amongst other things and I am nearly a text book example apparently as i fit nearly all the criteria for it (you only have t match a set number of criteria for a diagnosis). Looking back over my life with my therapist, I have certainly had schizoid traits from a very very young age, as young as i can really remember (4 or so certainly by the time i was 6). I am not very good at making relationships and even worse at maintaining the ones i do have... I don't think that will ever change. i highly doubt i'll ever manage an intimate relationship with anyone. I don't know that I would say I ever feel a sense of loneliness either but i do sometimes feel a sense of longing that things were different, i had a relationship once because i felt it was expected of me but i felt nothing at all.

interesting thoughts and comments posted above.

where to start?! I have depression, probably mostly my whole life. it was my p-doc for that that said I have SPD traits. my childhood, I don't remember at all or much. [that's a giant red flag, I know so jumping right past it] I'm the middle child out of three, and some of my relatives have told me that I mostly played by myself and the other two played together - even that I chose to be by myself when asked to join in. and I was an 'outsider' in school, mostly because of how I looked and dressed.

what I'm saying is mine was maybe a 'learned' thing. I was never emotional, especially in front of others - still am now! I'd cry by myself in my room, never in front of my family or others. still remember at age 13 when my grandmother died, I never cried at her funeral. alone by myself, I did. I always joked that I was the shoulder everyone else could cry on! and that 'lack' of emotional expression which is why I joke with some people that my 'poker' face is unbeatable! (always on and ready to go)

I'm really shy and especially when you first meet me. but there was a time period (like a few years) where I had a bunch of friends, and I did do movie parties or bowling or things like that. I was sooo good at hiding my depression and acting like nothing was wrong that maybe I got a chance to see 'the other side' of things & life. that didn't last long though. I held myself together as long as I could before things really crashed.

I'm sure other things factored into my personality becoming what it is now. the 'second' hardest thing (i'll call it that for now) was probably my family and siblings. so reading about the schizoid personality tendencies made sense for me. it's not that I didn't empathize with my family or understand the emotions & emotional things happening and they were going thru, it's just I didn't know how to show that or was never comfortable doing so.

and yes, [the 'most' hardest thing was] romantic relationships basically never happened for me. and now that I'm over thirty, it's almost like I missed my window, so to speak. I am that 'newbie', who (in the past and even still now) doesn't know what to do or what to say or misses the hints others are putting out there.

someone asked me about that the other day (just a random person online), asked if I wanted a boyfriend or was actively looking for one [something like that]. and it honestly hit me - I had to stop and think about it. I mean, I'm the odd one out at everything, especially when it comes to family and family occasions. I mean, here's my family: d&m (married almost 40 years), one half-sister (married 25 years and has two teenage boys), one older sister (married almost 10 years and has a 2 year-old girl), and my younger sister- who just got married last summer to the guy she'd been dating for nine years!

so I get reminded of that 'loneliness' really really often. but I've been 'alone' most of my life so I'm use to it. and even if I wanted that to change, it's hard to think that's even possible. yes it would be nice to not always be the 'odd one out', to have someone to share things with (maybe even my life, all or part of it), but the reality is my personality is the way it is.

and for me, it doesn't bother me too much to smile at a stranger or make basic small talk with people I don't know. but the whole 'connections' thing is extremely hard, even with my family. and someone mentioned it earlier but asking questions is a good way to go. I have like nothing in common with my family or relatives, which is probably why my half-sister's husband rarely says anything to me! but I started the whole 'questions' thing with my two sisters. if nothing else, if I ask questions about things it makes it seem like I care and am trying to understand or relate.

but that's a tough road as well, in my experience. I mean, I have three sisters and three brother-in-laws and they basically never call me! so it's really hard to try connections & relationships if you're the one always putting the first foot in (so to speak), or the only one putting in the effort. don't they want to connect with me?! but maybe that's where my MIs complicate things...

I don't know if personality traits can change or if you reach a point in life where there isn't much hope for that. what I am saying is I understand what it's like to be like that and to feel those things. and it su***...

->sorry about the lengthy rant