[firstmate]

While working in a mental health facility I realized that my husband has many characteristics of someone with a psychosis. Now I'm wondering how to deal with it.

Before I bore you with all the details, I want to know how I'm supposed to act. Should I encourage him or point out holes in his story - which he always comes up with an excuse for when I do. The whole situation is plausible, but not really likely. So do I call him on it or not?

Here's my story:

For the past five months he has been "talking to people" in the music industry. He used to spend hours at night in the bathroom talking to them - first claiming that he didn't want me to hear the ***** he had to kiss to get them to talk with him, then saying they were working on a surprise for me, and the latest thing is that they are music people and don't trust people they haven't met in person.

For about three of those months we got ready every weekend to fly somewhere for him to go to a studio to cut a demo only to have one thing after another come up and cancel our trip. Now he says one of them is going to fly through the city we live in and wants to visit him and meet me. Again, something weird happened and the trip was postponed.

Everytime it's a logical excuse, the total number of them makes me think it isn't true. Besides that, there is the fact that he hides in the bathroom or talks to them while I'm at work. I have never seen a text message from them, which he claims to get periodically. They supposedly have my cell number and e-mail but I haven't heard anything from them, but he says they keep saying hello to me and apologizing for keeping him from me and not meeting me. They know that he wants me to be his manager in the business, but he says until he makes the demo they only want to talk to him about everything.

My biggest concern is that while he's "communicating" with them, he's not working. My salary almost pays the required bills, but doesn't begin to pay off the financial hole he put us in. He also claims to almost get several jobs, which for some reason never call him back to tell him exactly when to start working. Then he says that any job he could get would not put up with him taking personal calls (from the music people) at all times of the day.

I'm frustrated and about at my end trying to deal with our financial situation and his promises that soon everything will be better.

Do I confront him and ask for proof they exist or continue going along with it and hoping things will get better?

[pachyderm]

Originally Posted by firstmate

While working in a mental health facility I realized that my husband has many characteristics of someone with a psychosis. Now I'm wondering how to deal with it.

Before I bore you with all the details, I want to know how I'm supposed to act. Should I encourage him or point out holes in his story - which he always comes up with an excuse for when I do. The whole situation is plausible, but not really likely. So do I call him on it or not?

...

Do I confront him and ask for proof they exist or continue going along with it and hoping things will get better?

I think you have answered your own question. "he always comes up with an excuse". I think it unlikely that confrontation will change that. Fear is a strong motivator to keep making up stories and not face the facts. Can you find a way, maybe with outside help, to deal with the fear that I am proposing exists? I don't think "going along with it" will work either. Nothing will get resolved.

[madisgram]

maybe consider seeing a qualified board certified psychologist could help clear this up. if u see the pshco.first talk to him about your concerns re your husband. then ask if he could see both your husband and you in some sessions to discuss your marraige concerns. i don't know if this would be considered unethical on the psych.'s part but you could find out. perhaps he/she could pick up on any psychosis that way. i know you have concerns about this and i agree the direct route may bring you no results. so idk, but thought i'd throw that out out u.

[tarabug922]

Firstmate,

I think you should give your husband an ultimatum, find a job or the consequence is _______ whatever you make it. Let him know that you can't support you guys alone and this music thing is not panning out so he needs to let it go. If it is illness he won't let it go, won't be able to, couldn't fathom it. In which case you could suggest he go for an evaluation at a psychiatrists office. Whatever his excuse you have the legitimate base of you need him working period. Regardless of anything else stick to the basic truth and things will work out from there.

Love and Hugs,
Tara

[firstmate]

Thanks for the advice.

I've been trying to get him to see a professional, but he refuses. He went through court ordered therapy as a teen and knows what to say (and what not to say) to mental health professionals. He is smart enough not to mention certian things when talking to others and knows what "the rapists" (as he calls them) are looking for. BTW - there is another MAJOR syptom of psycosis he talks about occasionally. I think he knows on some level that what he's thinking isn't right but likes the comfort of his delusions. Given that, he will never really open up to a professional, afraid that he might have to give up his delusions.

We can't afford to go to someone on our own and he refuses to be put on my heath insurance, saying he will get a job where he can get his own or get into the music business where we will be able to pay for any medical expenses out of pocket.

[wyrmhaven]

Originally Posted by tarabug922

Firstmate,

I think you should give your husband an ultimatum, find a job or the consequence is _______ whatever you make it. Let him know that you can't support you guys alone and this music thing is not panning out so he needs to let it go. If it is illness he won't let it go, won't be able to, couldn't fathom it. In which case you could suggest he go for an evaluation at a psychiatrists office. Whatever his excuse you have the legitimate base of you need him working period. Regardless of anything else stick to the basic truth and things will work out from there.

Love and Hugs,
Tara

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Please Don't follow this advice! right now it sounds harmless, But can anyone predict what his reaction will be if forced to face it? This sounds beyond a simple matter of pride or fantasy. and it will be very painfull for him to face it down when / if he can get the help he needs to break through.

[firstmate]

Thanks for the support. Right now we don't have the money to see a professional and even if we did, he wouldn't go. When he was younger he was ordered to see a psychologist. He knows what to say, and more importantly what not to say.

He has since gotten a part-time job, I think. So far he has worked a couple hours a day for a week, but always while I'm at work and he still answers my messages right after I send them. I don't think I will totally believe that until I see a paycheck.

Right now I'm trying to figure out how to deal with the music thing. I don't know how to tell him I don't think it's real without him thinking I don't like his music or that I'm not supporting his dream. How long do I request communication with the music people (and get refused) before some type of "prove it to me" ultimatum?

If it is really just hallucinations, how can I get him back to reality?

[pachyderm]

Originally Posted by firstmate

Right now we don't have the money to see a professional and even if we did, he wouldn't go. When he was younger he was ordered to see a psychologist. He knows what to say...

Are you sure? Maybe the truth is what to say?

[firstmate]

Originally Posted by pachyderm

Are you sure? Maybe the truth is what to say?

That's the problem, he wouldn't tell them the truth. He has already told me that he knows his truth is so bizaar that no one would believe it. If he were talking to a professional he would not tell them about what his spirit supposedly does while his body is sleeping. If asked directly about it he would probably deny anything to the professional and get angry with me for telling someone about it.

He says he gets in trouble from his bosses (the spirits who direct his disembodied spirit) if anyone else hears about it. Supposedly he was punished for even telling me and when I ask him about it he says he can't tell me details because then he will get in more trouble and be asked to do even worse things or have consequenses in the physical world. Part of that "punishment" includes his inability to get a job and every thing else that does not go as we planned.

How likely is it that he uses that as an excuse for things that are out of his control - like getting a job when he doesn't have good references but does have large gaps in his work history.

[pachyderm]

Originally Posted by firstmate

That's the problem, he wouldn't tell them the truth. He has already told me that he knows his truth is so bizaar that no one would believe it.

A good therapist might not "believe" it but would still listen carefully. Now, how to find that good therapist who listens...

[kaytibear]

This is a complex question. Your husband doesn't seem to be oriented in reality. It is always good to try to be supportive during illness but at the same time you need to look out for your self .
You could try saying I love you but this can't continue to go on. Yes it may sound harsh but sometimes it is the only way to get someone to get help. I am glad he is working at least part time.
A trained therapist could most likely see through his delusions. I know he doesn't want to go but putting your foot down may be what inspires him to get help. You could try therapy for couples. That way he won't feel singled out.
If you can't get him to go into treatment you need to ask yourself what your limits are. What are you willing to put up with and what are the consequences for his actions? I am not telling you to leave him but it might be time for a very frank talk.
I hope this helps and I wish you well.

Kayti

[linzscotland]

Is your husband on any Statin medication?

[spiritual_emergency]

I'm not sure how I managed to do so but this was a duplicate post. I've left the other one in place, directly below.

.

[spiritual_emergency]

Hello firstmate,
I recently came across the following in a book I was reading that I think may be applicable to your husband's situation...

Tell me all your thoughts on God
And ask her why we're who we are
Tell me all your thoughts on God
'Cause I'm on my way to see her...

Dishwalla - Counting Blue Cars

~*~

Perhaps the most severe manifestation of a fixation on the static masculine/dynamic feminine polarity is acute schizophrenia. When the family system, supported by culture pattern, is dominated by an excess of the static masculine such that the ego's experience of the static feminine is utterly truncated or damaged, the weak and embattled ego is vulnerable to being overwhelmed by an acute schizophrenic process in an effort to find the static feminine.

In such acute schizophrenia of a nonparanoid type, the symbolism of hallucinatory and delusional processes follows the pattern of the dynamic feminine in the image of giving way of the existing static masculine world order, through world cataclysm, chaos, and death, to the birth of a new world. At the center of this new world is the fragmented ego personality in an inflated identification with the Self as a messianic figure...

This new world is a utopian manifestation of the static feminine as the divine goddess of nature. That is, the acute schizophrenic process is an attempt to initiate the ego into the static feminine/dynamic masculine polarity, which has not been sufficiently part of its experience. Acute schizophrenia is perhaps the most vivid illustration of the tendency of the dynamic feminine to move toward rebirth in the static feminine, leading to a new order of selfhood and a new authenticity of purpose.

Source: Masculine & Feminine: The Natural Flow of Opposites in the Psyche

I have found the work of the Jungians to be most insightful in terms of working through and understanding my own experience so this is what I tend to share with others.

Within a Jungian model, schizophrenia and/or psychosis may best be understood as the collapse or fragmentation of the egoic structure; the ego comprises our sense of known identity and also serves to order the larger psyche. When the ego/one's sense of self-identity collapses, content floods forth from the personal and collective unconscious, including archetypal figures thus producing what we call "psychotic content".

Based on what you have shared here I'm going to assume that at some point before this unusual behavior of your husband's began there was an event or series thereof that produced a number of blows to his egoic structure. The archetypal figure that most commonly arises at that point is one that is typically associated with greatness, such as a messiah or redeemer -- what is often interpreted as grandiosity but might be better understood as a heroic effort of the ego to save, redeem and rebirth itself.

In terms of your husband, it may be as if he is in two worlds at the moment -- the first is the "regular" world we might accept as reality; the second is the "mythical, emotionally-laden world" (the dynamic feminine) where god-like archetypal figures reign. The language of that world leans towards the "irrational" and "metaphoric" such as that frequently expressed in music and poetry.

If your husband has been reluctant in the past to work with mainstream clinicians he may be open to working with a Jungian therapist who could help him to better understand the process of ego fragmentation and re-integration. There is also a wealth of free information on the net that can be utilized for self-help purposes.

I think what would be ideal in this instance is if your husband could maintain work, if only in a part-time position, and perhaps attempt to work through this process with your support, various self-help tools, and an empathic therapist. Occasionally, medications such as anti-anxiety agents, anti-depressants and possibly anti-psychotics can be helpful. Your family doctor may be able to offer some assistance in this matter however it's also possible he/she would impose treatment on your husband. Given his past experience, he likely would not be open to the same.

The continuing oscillations of compensatory movement from one pole to the other on the static masculine/dynamic feminine polarity is, for the ego personality identified with the static masculine pole, elementally experienced as a conflict between discipline and control and disorder and impulse. For the ego personality identified with the dynamic feminine pole, the conflict is between perfectionistic expectations and standards, and feelings of unworthiness, self-loathing and despair, accompanied by depression and disorienting affects.

Release from a fixation on the static masculine/dynamic feminine polarity lies in a submission to the watery initiations and a resulting shift to the static feminine/dynamic masculine polarity. For the ego personality dominated by the dynamic masculine-feminine pole, this transformation results from giving up perfectionistic expectations and self-loathing in order to dissolve into a loving acceptance of oneself as one is, reflected in the mirror of the static-feminine side of the Self.

For the ego personality dominated by the static-masculine pole, the watery initiation flows from yielding the security of the static-masculine orientation to the terrifying inner experience of disorientation, potential madness, suicidal fantasies and symbolic death. Rebirth in the static feminine is the joyful experience of wholeness, a reconciliation of the static masculine/feminine opposites, which the static masculine has split in its search for perfection.

Source: Masculine & Feminine: The Natural Flow of Opposites in the Psyche

~ Namaste

See also:
- How To Produce An Acute Schizophrenic Break

- An Outline of Analytical Psychology

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[firstmate]

I have enough training and experience to understand what's going on with him. He was abused by his father and ignored by his mother as a child. As a teen he acted out (hense the mandated therapy) and was in foster care until he reached the age of majority.

My question is how to deal with him. When I try to point out "holes" in his story, he changes the story to match the new information, or says there are things he can't tell me.

Recently he suggested I go to therapy, saying he would go along. The problem I see is that he is not covered under my health insurance so if I try to get him in therapy by himself we won't be able to pay for it.

Still looking for suggestions.

[cybermember]

Originally Posted by firstmate

I
Recently he suggested I go to therapy, saying he would go along. The problem I see is that he is not covered under my health insurance so if I try to get him in therapy by himself we won't be able to pay for it.

Still looking for suggestions.

As a suggestion... find a therapist that can work with you regarding your insurance and perhaps they can also work with you on a sliding scale fee with regard to your husband. I think you mentioned that you had worked or do work in a mental health facility, so basically you really have resources at your fingertips. Finding resources can be an arduous task, but they are out there.