[clara0clear0eyes]

hello,

my name is clara. and ive been trying like crazy to get some help/feedback on some issues. i was hesitant to come here to survivors of abuse because i really didnt want to disturb you guys with this stuff seeing as how you already have more than enough stuff to deal with. but i dont know where to "go" on psychcentral or who to talk to.

i just posted my question on "ask the dr" but i realize that there is really not much chance itll be acceptable in that forum - why did i push submit? stupid! well, its done now.
and i asked my question in sexual issues but absolutely no response.

i am trying here for those of you that might have the knowledge and/or expertise to answer this type of question, offer advice.

**NOT FOR THE FAINT OF HEART. Please, Do not read if you think it might offend you.
please be forewarned that the following is pretty TRIGGERING, im sure:
****

i dont have a good sex life. been married for 10 years, together for 15. im 36. never been pregnant that i know of. always kind of wanted children but get very freaked out at the thought of one being in my body - like its wrong. like i wouldve done something wrong if it happened. i think i'd have a nervous breakdown. but i dont have to "worry" because all these years without protection . . .no baby.
but thats not really what my question is.
sometimes i use sex to escape undesirable emotions. like i use it to punish myself or to try to figure out why i feel so bad. i cannot "get there" with my husband. i only do that myself. and i have to fantasize about abuse and very sick and twisted stuff to accomplish that. (although i wasnt abused). . .(i was "assaulted" when i was 18 but this form of gratification started way before that.) afterwards i feel so bad, so ashamed, so sinful. i want to cut off my abdomen or slit my throat or stab myself in the head, things like that (i would never do those things) but i hate feeling that way. i feel so sick, sick, sick.
i hope you guys dont hate me for posting this here - i was taking a chance that someone might understand or could help?
what is wrong with me!?

or should this go in self-injury or should i just go away bc the whole thing is inappropriate. maybe i should just forget about?

[madisgram]

Originally Posted by clara0clear0eyes

or should this go in self-injury or should i just go away bc the whole thing is inappropriate. maybe i should just forget about?

clara, i am glad you shared with us about this concern. i'm a member like you but IMHO you may find more feedback in the "self injury" section. i'm not knowledgeable in this area but i am familiar with it. i hope you can find some members that can relate better than i and i'm sure you will get some supportive reponses. can you copy this to self injury and see if you get responded to? meanwhile let's hope someone reads it here. hugs to you and this topic is not inappropriate to ask. that's why we have this forum.

[Sannah]

Hi Clara, what were you taught or what messages did you receive about sex? Previously in this culture some/many? people taught their daughters that sex was bad in hopes to keep them from getting pregnant......

Hi clara

It is brave of you to confront this once and for all, that is a good sign for sure.

I don't know if I am able to help or not, but I would like to ask you a question...Have you always used this as a way to pleasure yourself, even when you were first discovering sex? I ask because sometimes what can happen is people start off being able to get pleasure out of something easily, like sex, but after a while they are unable to be pleasured, so they try something else to pleasure themselves. It's hard to explain what I mean by this. The best way I can think of is to put it in a different context. If you imagine an alcoholic who drinks alcohol regularly...after a while the small amounts of alcohol they drink become pointless and have no effect, so they drink more, then when that has no effect they drink even more. It is an easy circle to fall into, and it relates to many things. People who watch porn for pleasure, for example, find the same thing - after a while, soft porn doesnt arouse them so they find more graphic porn, until one day the only thing that arouses them or pleasures them is hardcore porn. The reason for this long explanation is that I want to ask you if this is how you started off, and whether it had developed over a certain period of time.

I'm sorry for the long windy answer, it's just hard to explain it properly so that you can understand - sometimes I know what I'm trying to say but can't always say it very well.

Stay positive and have faith that you can deal with this, because it is something that you can definately deal with.

Simon

Hi Clara,

sometimes i use sex to escape undesirable emotions. like i use it to punish myself or to try to figure out why i feel so bad. i cannot "get there" with my husband. i only do that myself.

Im a survivor, Clara and some things resonate to me from your post. I see this is an abuse forum but sexual abuse is not listed So Im not sure these issues are discussed here.

Try to get in touch with what these undesirable emotions are and write them down . The punishing and feeling bad are common with sexual abuse

Don'y worrry about not getting there with your husband. Many women cannot because getting there for many is not vaginal its clitoral . and one has to be comfortable with working that out.

If you have that as a known then these thoughs that you are bad are intrudding while your trying to get there . And that is interupting your focus. If the intrusive thoughts are just shame for your method of what you think and visualize . Then you may just need reassurance that many people visualize or fantisize and You need to give your self an Its okay for you to do what you do .

It could be more.

I may wish to seek out a therapist who works in the area of sexual abuse.

Sexual abuse can be deepy repressed. I know It happened to me . I was clueless as an adult because the clues came from age 4 or 5. So when you say you were not sexually abused as a child that does not mean that you were not.

I hope this doesn't scare you or alarm you. One thing I found myself doing was silently leaning forward any time the therapist said i may have been abused . I truely had no memory of the event but the signs were there.
we hit paydirt unfortunately and fortunately.

Crying and shame are still with me at times .

I would give your self an A plus for achieving what you can . And as Sannah touched upon you got the messages from somewhere that there is something shameful about your method . Thats not helpful .

I hope you have a loving caring giving spouse . Its important to be able to talk about this . Its uncomfortable and a loving partner is key .

Take care

Aurora

[Zelev]

I know my reply might not be popular but I think I understand. Sexual arousal is not uncommon during abuse. Abusers purposely chose young children because they know children are easily manipulated and confused. That doesn't mean they aren't victims or that the abuse was any less demoralizing and humiliating.

Part of the reason some children don't tell is because they feel they deserved the abuse and are ashamed of their response. Later on they associate the abuse with sex and it's hard to experience intimacy with another person.

Have you ever thought about volunteering to help abused children? Sometimes helping others will help you understand your own pain and confusion. It helped me.

[Berries]

I'm so sorry you feel so bad about the thoughts you have. That is hard. I can relate to having thoughts that are very difficult to have. I can relate to feeling guilty about them too.
But I have learned something. Thoughts are thoughts. They aren't actions or behaviors. You can't hurt anyone with thougts.
I'm not saying I've conquered all this, but reminding myself of this does help.
Also, I can relate to the type of thoughts you are having in order to "get there". I have very S&M thoughts too. It shocks, confuses and frightens me, because I am not a violent person, nor have I ever wanted to hurt anyone.
(except, maybe my abuser)
So, I keep reminding myself that I haven't really hurt anyone with those thoughts. It helps. Not completely, but it helps.
I was not sexually abused as a child. Thank god! My spouse abused me sexually a little. Manly, it was non-related sexual abuse.
I am so glad you posted this. I felt alone with this. Now, I don't. Thank you.

[clara0clear0eyes]

to all of you who took the time to respond
Thank You so much. i have been considering your words.

i thank you all for your advice and concern. your words have helped me sort out some things.

*******
i cannot remember a time in my life when i was not tuned into sexual things. i guess it was the normal play that children engage in. i had a brother who was very slightly older than me so that was a way to play.
i just felt like i took things too far. (i know i wanted to take things too far with him). at the same time i was trying to be spiritual. the combination really did a number on me. i cried myself to sleep a lot praying and repenting. but i would do the same things again. i'd cry and pray forgiveness again. vicious circle. i had these constant compulsions that i could not seem to overcome.

when i was very young i had a good friend who was being abused by her father. i knew her from kindergarten until she moved away freshman year.
i knew of the abuse i guess around 7yrs old or so. but she swore me to secrecy. being a child i kept the secret. oh, how i wish i had told. near the end of junior high her mother did leave the father - moved all the way across the street. and for a whole 2 months! then she moved them back in. by this time my friend's older sister had run away to marry and one of her older brothers had committed suicide. the other brother became a police officer. but they moved away pretty soon after that. i think he was afraid his secret might get out. he was a boy scout leader and a member of the church choir and i was always shocked to think of him that way.

is it possible that i hold a lot of guilt over this? like survivor's guilt?

there are other little things along the road of my growing up that were unpleasant but i wouldnt say that anyone abused me per se. but i always felt abused for some stupid reason: knocked-down and groped by some neighborhood boy, spied on through a peep-hole by a friend's older brothers. even spied on by a friend's mother's boyfriend who crawled in bed between us . . .that was creepy.stuff like that. my father didnt allow me privacy while dressing - that always got on my nerves. i'd dress in the closet with the door shut (and this is not a walk-in closet). he'd come through the closed bedroom door and swing open the closet door. i just prayed i had enough on before he came. was always struggling with pantyhose and slips bc it was on sundays before church. one time he unlocked the bathroom door and came right in while i was in the tub and just stood there like he had some question to ask me. there i am trying to cover myself with a washrag and he's just looking at me kinda stammering while i yell at him to get out. stuff like that. but those are just not the things that haunt me, i dont think. could they alone be responsible for all of this?

and the thoughts i have now are not just taboo thoughts that make me wonder if i am normal. i dont really care so much about that. i do care about the fact that they make me unhappy. i dont like having to think of someone (usually young girls or women) being objectified {to put it nicely} to get my dirty kicks. its like i dont even like it. thats why i have the reaction afterwards. to me sex is violence, sex is objectification, sex is dominance and rotten... its manipulation.
its never been any other way except for maybe with my first love i tried but we didnt really have all that much out and out sex. but we did love each other very much.

i just dont want to be broken all my life.
i dont want to hate my body, hate intimacy with my husband.
i dont want to be scared of little children or feel like i dont have the right to love them.

[Sannah]

Clara, all that you have explained certainly sounds like it has affected you and brought you to where you are now. Being "normal" IMO is being comfortable with yourself and functional. It seems like you still have some sorting out to do with your thoughts, feelings and beliefs and you are very capable of doing this.

I think that some women are just more sexual than others and this can start at a young age. You must have heard some religious messages that sexuality is bad? And then you had to keep a sexual abuse secret.

That is creepy about your father. Certainly a lack of privacy and boundaries for you. And the other creepy things in the neighborhood which were boundary violations.

Would going to a sex therapist be an option for you or at the very least a therapist?