[venusss]

spin off CZJ thread...

am I the only one who finds the "there's help" phrase eyeroll inducing.

I don't know. It's just too much focus on the "help from others" and too little focus on strenght of the person struggling. And hardly ever we hear what helped the person announcing that "there's help". It seems kinda... forced, empty, vague... and reinforcing that the person is kinda doomed unless others enter the picture.

or maybe it's me being against "help". Even "do you need anyhelp" when carrying huge bag (cause us tough chicks can carry our **** ourselves).

Sometimes, I think, the person trying to help gets more out of it than the person being helped. That is not always true, but I think it's what you are talking about based on what you said about hardly ever hearing what helped the person announcing that 'there is help'.

the best help that I have had, and I follow this model, is to really listen. Listen and if you can, relate it to your own experiences. I will explain how the things I listen to have been there in my own life and my experiences with them. That is good help I believe. But, without personally relating, there is only empathy.

I hear you. there is no room for self defeat with this condition.

[Anika.]

What's the CZJ thread Venus?

[venusss]

thread about catherine zeta jones.

[Anika.]

Ohh ok would be the last thing I would have thought of haha. Didn't read it. Curious now tho.

[venusss]

dan...i can hardly relate to people.... ever. I guess I am too special effed up snowflake

But that is ok! It's only a problem, like you said, if you were out there promoting that you have all the answers and that you could help us all! lol

[venusss]

well, maybe AstraZeneca could help me why one of the downpayments for my condo...

J/k

......lol!

[Anika.]

Did CVJ help anyone with bipolar. She is newly dx'd right? For some reason I think it takes a while to fiqure out your own bipolarness. God took me like more than half my life to date. And I am still working on it. What I don't like is the ..."there is help, there are doctors and meds and treatment" mind you that I am sure the treatment part is limited to dr's and meds in alot of these statements. And I am not saying CZJ said that cause I wouldn't have a clue. But does make me wonder when a celeb is newly dx'd how long it will be till the "treatment" that they are new to and at this point have a lot of faith in seems too stop working for them. K I am being a negative nancy this morning, didn't get that coffee yet. Just doesn't seem like they give the treatmemt enough time to really know the effects and outcome. Seems pre-mature.

Yeah telling people there is hope only from others is pretty dooming. Yikes if that was really the case. Wouldn't want to be in that position. Helping others to help themselves seems more ummm helpful.

I think just by knowing that your not alone and having the ability to share honest experiences with others who know what you are talking about and that have been there is the most helpful thing a person can receive!

Ugh... all that in one breath lmao

[venusss]

It seems the "help" refers to shrinks and therapists... but we don't hear "how" it helped. And when celebs say "there's help"... they probably don't get how "help" goes for poor folks in rural areas.

and to imagine i waltz in office of my doc (which i haven't see even for basic check up in YEARS, cause I felt he always makes take my shirt off just to see my with my shirt off) that I am depressed or bipolar... he'd probably want me to take shirt off and be useless. And I can't afford a decent therapist as it is now although I really might use some help at the managing life and relations front... maybe. Maybe ticket to India and staying for a bit would be cheaper in the end (and it worked for Alanis). I am just bit distrustful.

don't worry Venus, there is help! Ha! Just kidding

I think... Ok, yeah generally you need to enlist some kind of professional help at some point to get symptoms under control, learn and utilize coping techniques, manage your life in a way that caters to your strengths and doesn't target your weaknesses, blah blah blah.

I do feel VenusHalley has a point, though the one I see may or may not be the one that was being presented initially.

When all you do is hand people so called solutions on a silver platter, they don't expect that any personal work or commitment is involved or necessary for any degree of success. So you have "Dot" [or whatever its called], the little cartoon Pfizer blob that could. Within the span of a thirty second commercial it goes from miserable and alone to smiling and surrounded by happy bird friends.

People go from sad and withdrawn peeking out a window into the rain to playing frisbee on the beach with their dog.

In advertising and in pop culture, there is little to no emphasis or even much mention at all of any type of personal work that one might need to do to improve one's mental health.
There are also many people who are just sort of passed through treatment- "helped along"- without much focus on coping skills, learning independence, self soothing, things like distress tolerance and decisions making, any basic fundamentals of HOW to work on improving your own prognosis.

And I'm not suggesting people don't attend therapy. For a lot of people though, therapy begins and ends in the therapist' s office door.

So it's like you are chained entirely to your providers, you have no way to help yourself.
We end up with people plateauing or worse because they aren't taught basic ways to help themselves or even that as an option.

Self-empowerment, as VenusHalley seems to suggest- though I don't want to put words in your mouth- is not a priority as often as it should be.

It is not often seen as cost effective, but this results in impatience with medications, poorer insight and self awareness, lower self esteem, more difficulty with provider- consumer communication, and in my humble opinion, less optimal outcomes over all.

Yeah,so... tangent.

But ya know... just sayin'
Heh.

hope I made you laugh. we all could use a laugh sometimes!

[Anika.]

Yeah you did

[Fuzzybear]

I like that!

You know, sometimes I wish that it was true....
that the only form of help would come from someone else!
The weight and responsibility off of me...
trusting in another that this can be handled, dealt with and fixed.

but I tend to run and hide lol. so of course I would like that idea lmao

[venusss]

Originally Posted by landskaperdan

don't worry Venus, there is help! Ha! Just kidding

and then there's India.

but that is a backup plan for when things get worst for me.

[venusss]

When all you do is hand people so called solutions on a silver platter, they don't expect that any personal work or commitment is involved or necessary for any degree of success. So you have "Dot" [or whatever its called], the little cartoon Pfizer blob that could. Within the span of a thirty second commercial it goes from miserable and alone to smiling and surrounded by happy bird friends.

People go from sad and withdrawn peeking out a window into the rain to playing frisbee on the beach with their dog.

Oh yeah. Then there's that Abilify commercial known for "dat azz" woman

I am not against "drugs" completely (although I prefer different kind of mind altering subtances then the ones doctors give you)... but peeps should realize what drugs can and can't do. They can make you feel somewhat better, but then... they cannot make you do something. Just like back in Uni days when I downed few cans of RedBull or sketchy looking Speed8... I knew I will have enough energy and concentration for allnighter. There was never a garantee it's gonna go into studying or writting paper... instead of playing Pharaoh all night long or watching Tyra Show. So unless you get the right attitude... the drugs alone will not help you.

People don't like to hear they have responsibility, because the post-diagnosis "not my fault" is so tempting. But once you are aware... you gotta do something. Life is hard... for everybody... and by refusing to take responsibility one can make it even harder.



In advertising and in pop culture, there is little to no emphasis or even much mention at all of any type of personal work that one might need to do to improve one's mental health.
There are also many people who are just sort of passed through treatment- "helped along"- without much focus on coping skills, learning independence, self soothing, things like distress tolerance and decisions making, any basic fundamentals of HOW to work on improving your own prognosis.

Yeah, pretty much this. Thing is... many people are capable of it. I hate when people say "we can't control our behaviour". Eh, we may not be able to control our moods (but that can be done to a degree if one is self-observant), but we def can control our responses to them. And by learning to damage control... we make lives so much easier for ourselves.

Self-empowerment, as VenusHalley seems to suggest- though I don't want to put words in your mouth- is not a priority as often as it should be.

Indeed.

Thanks for your well thought reply

It's like a conversation with yourself

lol!

I do agree with Black Font a lot. The point of being helped along without much emphasis on some really good lifestyle traits is impressive to me.

I love what pink font said about about controlling our responses to our moods too.

Sometimes though, I stay in control, barely until it lets up and then I can more follow the advice on here.