Similarities between seemingly unrelated disorders

Thanks BirdDancer for that information. It may be worth getting checked out myself. I've never had mood swings and I've never experienced depression or even mania before this. I was about to turn 38 when all of this started for me. My doctor mentioned something hormonal or adrenal might have caused the episode. I wonder if women go through a shift at that period in life.

I spoke gibberish as well at times and had several violent outbursts. I literally kicked a wall down in my home. I remember that part of the episode. I had a lot of blackouts too. I just read amnesia is common with TLE. I also experienced auditory hallucinations as well as visual hallucinations. One of the hallucinations prompted the kicking down of the wall. I also thought the pictures on the wall were moving and I smashed them. That's the point my husband had to call 911 to have me detained. It was all very surreal and scary. My kids witnessed some of it. My husband was so amazing and somehow kept us all safe physically. I pray every day that it will never happen again. It traumatized us all. We're all in therapy.

That does sound scary, fern! A hormonal issue may also be addressed by perhaps a different type of doctor. I would get any proper recommendations from a doctor on who to consult.

I like the Johns Hopkins brief description of focal seizures (aka simple/complex partial) at Focal Seizures | Johns Hopkins Medicine The simple type can easily turn complex. Their description of the simple is more detailed than the complex. When complex, the memory of them disappears, to my knowledge. I know that I have had situations with blackouts. I'm not sure if they were seizure-related or dissociation. I do know that I've asked people I was with what happened during my "blackout" periods. They said I was seemingly not having a seizure. It is my guess that I once said something quite disinhibited during such a period. I have also had several hallucinations and illusions during such periods. I once became convinced of something and I would not let it go. My psychiatrist insisted I was wrong. I pushed until he was pretty much yelling at me and I was crying. It was severely disturbing.

Hi BirdDancer, Thanks for you response. I was/am genuinely concerned about having taken the thread "off course," which can sometimes "disturb the flow" of , or can derail, the thread. I have been known to, unintentionally, do so on occasion.

The topics raised, both religiosity and/or spirituality, as we know, can be very controversial and might, depending upon the experiences/knowledge/feelings of the membership, have a chilling effect. I did not consider this before I had written the post. My sincere apologies if my post had any similar type of a chilling effect upon this very interesting topic/thread you've created.

EDIT: OOOPS! I had written this post before I was aware of the fascinating and the important exchanges by both fern and BirdDancer!!!

I find this entire thread quite fascinating... and I could/might get carried away! If I do get carried away, please reign me in!

Thanks again!

Ideally, everyone would have an extensive neurological work up prior to reaching any diagnosis. I am sorry this is, too often, not the case.

I, too, have had repeated testing for TLE. I have had approx. 20 EEGs, over the years, looking for TLE. We have never been able to document TLE activity.

This is a condition that is difficult to diagnose. As I understand this, there is not yet an adequate method for optimal testing for TLE. There are Temporal Lobe leads which are used in an EEG evaluation; however, these leave much to be desired when it comes to accurately diagnosing TLE. It is, therefore, quite likely there are many testing results reflecting false negatives.

Please correct me if I am wrong, BirdDancer.

I know of a case in which a young man had sustained a concussion. At some point, his doctor had considered the young man recovered from the concussion.

The young man had continued to have many symptoms, including all types of dissociative symptoms. He had to stop playing high school football. He could no longer keep up with social activities and he'd eventually lost his friends. He became increasingly isolated, increasingly depressed and quite hopeless.

His family doctor had referred him to a psychiatrist, who then diagnosed him with anxiety, depression and a dissociative disorder.

I was a friend of the family and had continued to express the need for a neurological assessment.

The psych meds, and there were several, only made this young man feel much worse. His psychiatrist had then diagnosed him with a "treatment resistant" variety of mental illness.

A consultant had theorized the young man was suffering from a post-concussion syndrome and had opined that the young man's condition would improve with time.

The young man became very hopeless and suicidal. He was eventually admitted inpatient at a university hospital where he'd received a full neurological assessment.

He was diagnosed with TLE and has been successfully treated with anticonvulsant medication. Last I knew, he was living a much more normal life and was thriving, once again, is both sports and in academics!

It was never clear as to whether or not the TLE was a byproduct of the concussion or if the existence of both conditions was mere coincidence. I am not sure anyone would know the answer to that question.

Just an example of how a full neurological assessment can, at times, make all of the difference.

I had terrible migraines too. The worst for me is perfume. I could just pass by a scented candle and have a 3 day migraine. In the 70s and 80s when people wore tons of perfume, I'd almost pass out in church from all the smells. I had migraines every Sunday. I haven't had any lately, and just realized that it's been 6 years since I had many migraines. I was put on lamictal 6 years ago. Coincidence?

@Wild Coyote and @Phoenix_1, thank you so much for sharing these stories. They may have had a sad beginning, but the endings make me feel happy.

Wild Coyote, I can't believe you had to endure 20 EEGs and then still have no result. I'll just hope that finally means you don't have TLE. Or if you do, I do hope your current medications help. That's all that really matters in the end. As you may recall from my story, my diagnosis was called "not definitive" by the epileptologist I went to. At least my "weird" symptoms, as I call them, disappeared. I don't say I never had simple partial seizures, but I don't assign that diagnosis to myself anymore. I just don't know. I'm just so happy those symptoms are gone. I still deal with bipolar disorder, though. That has been present my whole life, and is present in many of my family members'. Was there a relationship between the two? Heck, I don't know! All I know, is though I only had four EEGs, I understand the stress of multiple tests and doctors. I had multiple MRIs, the PET scan I mentioned, and just oodles and oodles of doctors appointments for various things. I refer to all of that as my "psychiatric and neurological avalanche" period. There sometimes comes a time when all of it is just so overwhelming. I understand when people want to stop (medications, doctors, tests, and therapy). I quit some, but have left the ones that keep me at least where I am now. My psychiatrist prescribes my Tegretol XR and beta blocker. Two meds that could have been also prescribed by two other doctors.

I agree that people should have full medical workups before being casually diagnosed with a serious disorder, with serious medications. I remember during my first psych hospitalization, I had a full physical, lots of blood tests, and a very long interview with the hospital psychiatrist. He was wonderful! Later down the line I started going to him privately. He was the one that initiated many other tests. Life has not been a bowl of cherries for me, but I haven't been hospitalized in almost 8 years, and have made very good progress over this time. Some may think it not enough, but I know where I've been. I've made good progress.

When I had my first manic episode in my 40s, 11 years ago I was also having migraine headaches activated by florescent lights. I was put in an isolation room in the hospital with bright florescent lights. They would not turn off or dim the lights and took away the broad rimmed hat I had to protect myself from the light. I hid my eyes under a blanket in the dimmest corner of the room and then I passed out. (I think I had a seizure.) When I woke up I was in another isolation room in a psych ward.

OMG!!! Tecomsin!!! I am sorry you were treated in that manner!!!
We all need some help with eye "protection" when having migraines.
It's only humane!!!

It's quite possible you did have a seizure of some type. It would all be enough to cause a seizure!!! Goodness!!!

Hey there, BirdDancer!

I'd had so many EEGs because I had started them approx. 35 years ago. Every time I'd started care with a new Primary Care Doc, a new neurologist and/or a new pdoc, back to the EEG suite I'd go!!!

I was very fortunate to have had my first hospital admission be in a very good hospital. Every admission was worked up over and over. I'd had 4 EEGs from that admission, alone. My dissociative symptoms have, often, been predominant and this has caused docs to keep ordering EEGs over the years. (I tend to think I have a brain that kindles quite easily, be it from migraine activity, BP and/or trauma.... and, of course, very sensitive to stress!)

I have also had horrible, relentless and frequent migraines, auras and migraine equivalents. : eek: I used to frequently end up in the ER with Status Migrainosus! I have had a drastic decrease in migraines since taking lamotrigine(for BPII).

Spirituality? Yes, always, yet to varying degrees. Some of this might depend upon a factor as simple as the amount of time I'd had to invest in such at any given time. I've always been interested/fascinated/drawn to mysticism, theology, philosophy and to spiritual endeavors. (Whatever that means.) I have learned I am much more balanced and much better off staying grounded and in the Present Moment! I have learned ,too, there is a great deal of "grounded" spirituality in everyday life.

So, yes, many EEGs for me!!!
Thanks so much for this thread!

I have long believed that the disorders you mentioned in your OP, Bird, are related. My thought is that someday, medical science will discover it. Someday....


Since I was seven years old I have had disabling migraines. I have bipolar disorder and when the strongest "attacks" occur I feel entirely out of control. To me, that feeling is a "mood seizure." I definitely have symptoms of fibromyalgia (and have considered the possibility that I have fibro, altogether). Anyway...yes.


Oh - and I saw a neurologist, years ago - highly perceptive and intelligent man. He told me that his belief was that bipolar disorder is a type of seizure disorder.

I've had a ton of EEGs too. The first one was back in the 60's when they still used little hooks along with a vile smelling glue that gave me an instant migraine. I was so scared they were going to electrocute me. The tech was so nice to me because she could see how scared I was but still I thought they were gonna fry me. It wasn't till my late twenties after I had a seizure in my sleep while I was ip that they did a sleep deprived EEG and found a diganois. I believe sleep disorders are also included in bipoar illness. As a child I often woke the house screaming in my sleep and often I waited for everyone to fall asleep then sneak out of the house and go be with my pony and dog.

summerfields and Nammu, thanks for sharing on this topic.

summerfields, it's interesting that your past neurologist had the same view on bipolar disorder as the psychiatrist I once consulted with.

Nammu, EEGs are strange. Though they aren't painful, they are very uncomfortable, especially the ones where you have to wear the getup for 24 hours or more and have a video pointed at you. It actually did irritate my skin. I had several red marks on my skin for days.

Hi summerfields,

Welcome to the Bipolar Forum of PC!

I hope you find the information and the support you may be seeking.

You might find the work by Oliver Sacks quite interesting. He authored a book entitled, Migraine. It is a very detailed book and is not for everyone. (It is available on Amazon in paperback).

I am glad you have jumped in here!
Please do make yourself at home.

I hope to see you around the forums.