[cboxpalace]

For me.. I’ve come to the conclusion that when the spirit has been broken, for me most likely back in 2008, that it’s difficult if not impossible to fix. For me.. I believe it’s impossible, and I also have come to the conclusion that I don’t think I can learn as an adult what should’ve been learned naturally as a child. For me… Their realizations that I have to accept, no matter how much I don’t want to.

I have a knack for meeting people where there’s a natural connection. It’s not forced, and doesn’t have to be worked at. It’s just there, and when it’s gone… it hurts like hell. I should be clear these are friendships, and nothing romantic. In some instances the fault lays with me, and in some I have no idea why they ended. I know they like my company, even though they may say otherwise now. One friendship ended at the beginning of Sept, one in Dec, and one today. All 3 hurt like hell when they ended. Obviously, this is a pattern in my life. One that I can’t control and one that I can’t fix. These are MY issues with bpd.

DBT has helped to some degree with the daily stresses of life, but with interpersonal relationships it has failed me. I didn’t have close friends growing up, and I just didn’t learn this skill, and I’m not able to as an adult. I don’t like it, but I’m content to accept all of this, and just say ****it and walkaway. If you want to think I’m quitting.. That’s fine too, because ultimately I really don’t give a **** what you think.

We ALL have our own issues in how bpd affects us.. you have yours, and I have mine. These are my issues with bpd, I'm tired, I'm wore out from trying. It’s beat me, and I'm content to givein.

[amaviena]

MBT. Look it up perhaps.

[tattoogirl33]

Cbox.. not that it matters much.. I just want you to know, you are my Borderline Hero..

[athena2011]

Sorry you're hurting so much Cbox. I feel like this a lot of the time too. How I drive people away is different than how you do but the end result is much the same.

As always, I don't believe that someone who bothers to make a thread has quit 100%. Otherwise, why would they have taken the time to post? This is good news, however. It means that part of you, however small, wants to change.

But that's the thing - change requires work. If we constantly tell ourselves that our BPD symptoms are too much to handle, so we might as well accept it and be miserable...then it's likely we'll stay stuck in that mindset. This goes for other mental illnesses as well, of course.

Amanda provided a useful link - MBT sounds fantastic for BPD. DBT and CBT are both good as well. I highly recommend attending therapy and working at change. Change does not happen to us - we cannot expect our symptoms to lessen in severity if we lay back and do nothing about it.

It concerns me because you seem so tied up in your illness - the king of borderlines? Why do you feel the need to have this label attached to yourself? It is not at all helpful, and could actually be hindering your progress. You have BPD, just like anyone else with it on these forums. Sorry to say, but your BPD symptoms are not any more severe or "special" than anyone else's. Try to not focus on the label, but instead the issues behind the label.

I do apologize if this post is too blunt for you...but I figured that since you are quite blunt yourself, you wouldn't mind. Take care.

[cboxpalace]

Originally Posted by melissa.recovering

As always, I don't believe that someone who bothers to make a thread has quit 100%. Otherwise, why would they have taken the time to post?

Disagree.....

It's venting and expressing what my beliefs are as they relate to me. Some may agree with my point of view, and others will disagree. Either is fine with me. No where am I asking for people to feel sorry for me or give me sympathy or agree with me, give me a pep talk or respond at all.. I really don't give a f**k what people think...which was also pointed out in my original post.

I also pointed out that dbt has been helpful in some areas, just not this one. <--- people seem to always miss this one about the dbt being helpful.

Others write posts in which to vent and express themselves. I "think" I'm afforded that same right! To express myself regardless of who agrees or disagrees. I wrote it for me and no one else. I'm not asking anyone to respond quite frankly.

But that's the thing - change requires work. If we constantly tell ourselves that our BPD symptoms are too much to handle, so we might as well accept it and be miserable...then it's likely we'll stay stuck in that mindset.

Amanda provided a useful link - MBT sounds fantastic for BPD. DBT and CBT are both good as well. I highly recommend attending therapy and working at change. Change does not happen to us - we cannot expect our symptoms to lessen in severity if we lay back and do nothing about it.

Again, we'll agree to disagree. To say that I HAVE NOT worked on these issues would be an error.... on your part. I gave 3 examples in a relatively short time period (less than 6 months), multiply that by 25 years. No where did I ever say, I believe this.. "just because". I gave a very specific rationale and that is... I believe that some things which are naturally learned as a child can't be learned as an adult.

I ALSO pointed out, unfortunately to often people seem to wanna overlook this, and that is.. DBT has helped to some degree with the daily stresses of life. I did not show up one day at dbt and was bestowed all knowledge of dbt, and therefore my stress of daily life just instaneously vanished. That took work and practice to get to that point, and I believe those types of changes are possible because they are repititive, and bills aren't going to leave me whether I want them to or not. So there is plenty of opportunity to correct dysfunctional habits and learn new coping techniques...

This is NOT the case with friendships. When we are children for the majority they naturally learn to develeop friendships and what it takes to maintain them. This occurs, in my opinion, because we're forced to be around them. You can't just quit school, you can't ask to be moved to another classroom, you can't just find another school etc. Children are in a position whether they like it or not they HAVE to be there, and one way or another they HAVE to interact with other children. There going to get LOTS of practice in leanring effective interpersonal skills and maintaining friendships or letting friendships go, and this is going to be repititive. The majority will learn these skills. This is NOT the case for adults, unlike school.. as adults we are NOT forced to be around people.

I also pointed out that in some instances the failures of these friendships are unknown, 2 out of the 3 to be exact. I also pointed out these are people where there's just a natural connection. It's almost effortless in getting to know them. I can't force them to tell me what happened. I can't force them to be around me until everything gets resolved. I can't force them to accept my apology or put in the effort to repair a damaged friendships. So with some of those friendships falling apart for unknown reasons, and some for known reasons. It puts me in a difficult position!!

Your preaching about "change requires work" is not only insulting, but factually incorrect in regards to what I wrote.

I do apologize if this post is too blunt for you...but I figured that since you are quite blunt yourself, you wouldn't mind. Take care.

It takes helluva lot more than what you wrote to piss me off, and there is nothing wrong with agreeing to disagree. In fact, I could careless whether you like me or not. At least you wrote something articulate and thought provoking, and didn't have to include cheap personal attacks, and kept your opinions to the topic in which I was writing about. You'll always get my respect for that!!

[Rosie23]

I understand. I can't count the times I have said **** it. I quit. Life can kiss my arse.

There are days when you are just done. It's too hard.

So get P***** Off and punch a wall or a door. I do. We all get angry at it all from time to time. You just voiced it is all.

Originally Posted by cboxpalace

Others write posts in which to vent and express themselves. I "think" I'm afforded that same right! To express myself regardless of who agrees or disagrees. I wrote it for me and no one else. I'm not asking anyone to respond quite frankly.

spot on cbox....thats what we do, thats what this set-up is about. ..and I believe you do want responses...(I am gonna agree with myself here).

I mean ya' gonna get them anyway right?

I also believe you give a crap about what people think....(not the entire planet obviously...thats just crazy)...

and I am glad you do....thats the cbox I met a couple months ago.

you also have a unique quality of self assertion...which I am glad you have as well....but I am wondering that it gets confused with the "not giving a **** scenario?"

now....for a boring little bit about me!

I have discovered that caring what people think...(ya just need a few), this goes along way to helping them stick around....

and cbox buddy...(notice how I attempt to sweeten you up for this next bit?)

anyway....I agree with what was said up there somewhere about your theme. The theme you have selected and decide to keep runnin' with.

the king of borderlines....in Aussie slang we call that basically 'hamstringin' yourself!

to me it's as if I can say....."well I know I'm gonna take a crap likely everyday....so I'm gonna call myself the king of pooping!"

just how I see it cbox, I know it's what can be identified with....the label...the theme...but it's a hinderance yeh?

I no longer want to identify with what my illness has done to me...but what I'm gonna do to it!

[MDDBPDPTSD]

i feel the way u do about my spirit being broken. i am not giving up though. but i am wallow in my suffering and shame. finding it hard not to give up. but i must fight. lemme know how ur decision to give up helps or hinders u. ty

[amaviena]

MBT helps with interpersonal matters rather than intrapersonal. CBT has helped me a lot too, but not really so much with interpersonal matters. You should look into it, cbox. I think the King of Borderlines should be aware that there are other things out there...you can try...and if that fails...you can't say you didn't try.

[athena2011]

I had a discussion with my T today that reminded me of this thread Cbox. I've had a potential relationship turn into a doubtful one then turn into OMG somebody's trying to screw me over yet again. White-grey-black all in the span of three days. I told my T how disheartening it is and how I actually start to get suicidal over these things when I think there is no hope for change. After some discussion, he asked if I am feeling the need for somebody to 'complete' me. I said that, yah, he's probably right. Then he said it would be better if I stop trying to do that...

At which point I immediately thought he was asking me to "give up".

Because it all just takes me back to the main problem which was talked about in the first few sessions with him a little over a year ago - which is lack of self-esteem. I pretty much only get it from others. It is all externally generated. To consider generating it on my own, I immediately go to "OK, then I have to do something amazing, be something amazing, have exceptional abilities, talents, whatever." I just cannot conceive of accepting myself as I am. And to become an exceptional person takes energy and motivation and that's non existent when I feel like this. So it's kind of a chicken and egg scenario. How does one accept oneself if they already don't? Something has to change. But successful relationships require the change first. Becoming exceptional requires the change first. But I can't accept myself without one of those two happening first. So...chicken and egg...how do you get out of the vicious cycle?

[cboxpalace]

Hi Athena,

To some extent, I think, people are either missing the point, or maybe I'm doing a bad job explaining.

In your case it sounds like you're referring to romantic relationships in order to complete you, and that's not something I need or necessarily want right now. I have no desire to put in the effort. I can understand though how you may need/want a romantic relationship for self esteem or to fulfill you.. That I get..

What I write about is friendships, which have different dynamics than a romantic relationship, yet the purpose friendships represent for me is the same as you, and that's some self worth. I guess I should mention as disappointing as it is.. I don't get suicidal.

So, I'll give some examples of what I'm referring to. There was a girl I ment in dbt last May. We clicked almost immediately. She was super easy to get along, and fun to talk to. We go out for coffee in August, and we're there for 2 hours..Things are great, we different struggle for conversation. It was fun. It's coffee, not a 5 star restaurant. I can infer that she had a good time. I would think if she was having a bad time she wouldn't be there for 2hours, and I'm pretty sure I didn't handcuff her to the table. We didn't spend a lot of time talking about dbt, her issues, my issues.. We talked about random stuff. After that it came to end. Why? I don't know. I can't force her to tell me, I can't force her to be around me until it's resolved etc..Afterwards it hurt like hell for several weeks, because we did have so much fun prior and got along great, and I still miss her to this day.

I met an online friend in November, and we got along great. We seemed to have a natural connection. We talked just about everyday, usually for several hours at a time. It wasn't a romantic relationship, we did flirt, but the majority of what we talked about were her issues, my issues, random ****. I write, and she'd question me on the meanings, and what I was trying to convey, and how they applied to my life. It was fun, it was stimulating to think about. Then it ended in December.. Why? I don't know. I can't force her to tell me, I can't make her be around me, etc. She doesn't have to do any of those things. I still miss those conversations to this day.

Then the more recent one..again a natural connection, a lot of fun. It ended, and I will accept some responsibility, but not all for that. The best I can do is infer as to what really happened. Regardless, it hurts like hell when their gone, because I miss the fun.

I'm talking about a relatively short period of time, multiply that by years... and it gets old, and frustrating, and tiring.. etc.

So, in some of these instances I know what the problem is, and in some I don't. What do I correct or change about myself.. I really don't know. I have an idea on some things, but certainly not all. DBT HAS been helpful with some things in regards to controlling some situations that relate to daily stress.. Many of things in daily living are not going to leave me no matter how much I may want them to, a bill for ie. These are repitious and I can get tons of practice because their ALWAYS going to be there, and I'm ALWAYS gonna have to deal with them.

A friend can leave anytime they want to, and I have no control over that. I can't force them to stay, I can't force them to tell me what's wrong, I can't make them resolve whatever conflict may exist. These are not repitious situations that I can deal with frequently enough to master. We're NOT talking about just 3 instances in my entire life. I'm giving 3 examples.

Whether I like it or not... I'm kind of ****ed. After so many years, I'm wore out, I'm tired of the pain, I'm out of ideas etc. My thread is NOT about being positve or negative... it's about accepting, it is what it is and whatever it is there must be something wrong with me, and it appears that I can't fix it. I'm tired of banging my head against a brick wall and getting nowhere. It's depressing, I'm tired, and no longer want to try.

If some people want to believe I haven't tried, or I should keep on trying or that I'm pathetic or whatever... That's cool and their opinion really doesn't mean anything to me.

[cboxpalace]

Hey Monkey,

It's good to hear from you, as always...

Originally Posted by dubblemonkey

spot on cbox....thats what we do, thats what this set-up is about. ..

I'm glad you agree with this..

I also believe you give a crap about what people think....(not the entire planet obviously...thats just crazy)...

I suppose that I do care, but it's not gonna make or break me what someone's viewpoint is.

you also have a unique quality of self assertion...which I am glad you have as well....but I am wondering that it gets confused with the "not giving a **** scenario?"

Maybe/maybe not... The self assertion can be good or bad. Some people like it, and some people hate it and the ones that hate it are probably going to think I'm a real ***hole, and in most cases these people really don't know me on a more personal level. If you're talking about when I offer some advice to people... I get to the point, cut out all the ********, and say what I have to say. It stops there and at that point if they want to agree that's fine and if not that's fine too. So, in some ways.. that's me saying I don't give a **** what they choose, and that's true. It doesn't matter to me. Not everyone is going to find what I say helpful, and that's ok with me. My intent is good, and that's what is most important. There are some here that I usually disagree with about 99% of the time, however even though I may disagree with their viewpoints their advice is just as relevent as mine. It's all about helping people or listening. If someone finds their advice more helpful then mine.. That's great! Others may find mine more helpful. If I respond to someone thread it's not to be an a**hole, it truly is because I care about their issues, and maybe something I say will hopefully help.

I guess if you're talking about people.. then it's ABSOLUTELY true, maybe not to the extent that I write it. Like your opinion matters to me, and we get on great. but their are people that I truly don't give a **** about or what they think about me for that matter .. For all I care they can print a copy of my pix and throw darts at it.

Am I understanding your question correctly?

I have discovered that caring what people think...(ya just need a few), this goes along way to helping them stick around....

Let's be serious for a moment... I care what you think.. that's really all that matters, right?

I miss talking to you... keep in touch...

[athena2011]

Originally Posted by cboxpalace

Hi Athena,

To some extent, I think, people are either missing the point, or maybe I'm doing a bad job explaining.

In your case it sounds like you're referring to romantic relationships in order to complete you, and that's not something I need or necessarily want right now. I have no desire to put in the effort. I can understand though how you may need/want a romantic relationship for self esteem or to fulfill you.. That I get..

I gave the example of a romantic relationship, but the same applies to friends, it's just that it will take more than one friendship to 'complete you'. And thinking about what the word 'complete' means to me, it is to 'fill the void', whether it be romantic relationships or otherwise. Also, as you say...to provide some self-worth.

Originally Posted by cboxpalace

A friend can leave anytime they want to, and I have no control over that. I can't force them to stay, I can't force them to tell me what's wrong, I can't make them resolve whatever conflict may exist. These are not repitious situations that I can deal with frequently enough to master. We're NOT talking about just 3 instances in my entire life. I'm giving 3 examples.

How do you know they've left?

Originally Posted by cboxpalace

Whether I like it or not... I'm kind of ****ed. After so many years, I'm wore out, I'm tired of the pain, I'm out of ideas etc. My thread is NOT about being positve or negative... it's about accepting, it is what it is and whatever it is there must be something wrong with me, and it appears that I can't fix it. I'm tired of banging my head against a brick wall and getting nowhere. It's depressing, I'm tired, and no longer want to try.

Some people find a way to be happy on their own. Do you think that is possible for you?

[cboxpalace]

How do you know they've left?

I think it's a reasonable inference when we no longer talk, and in some cases it's been months. The door is always open for any of them to return, but I won't do anymore than what I've done..

Some people find a way to be happy on their own. Do you think that is possible for you?

No, not fully. I don't ever see myself having self worth/value, and I guess I have to be fine with that, and just accept it..

[athena2011]

Originally Posted by cboxpalace

I think it's a reasonable inference when we no longer talk, and in some cases it's been months. The door is always open for any of them to return, but I won't do anymore than what I've done..

I think it's always a good idea to give people the benefit of the doubt. If you contact them and they don't reply, sometimes it's because your e-mail got buried, or they're just disorganized, or they got busy and you slipped their mind, or nothing interesting is going on in their life and they just don't have a whole lot to say at the moment. I know, not good reasons - but all valid and all better than thinking they don't like you. Sometimes a second or third nudge is all it takes. And it shows them you are interested in being their friend in spite of their flakiness.

Originally Posted by cboxpalace

No, not fully. I don't ever see myself having self worth/value, and I guess I have to be fine with that, and just accept it..

Well, I guess this is the struggle we all have. Is it more painful to accept permanent unhappiness or is it more painful to keep trying but at least having some hope? It may only take one or two very different relationships to turn things around for you.

[cboxpalace]

They've all heard from me...Nothing more for me to do, nor will I..
Idk maybe I need a refresher course in inner baby therapy or maybe they do..Who knows!

....yeh I reckon you got the question pretty right there cbox.

and you care what I think, awesome....thats good enough for me!

....and I'm glad you sound much better today about things, not that it's a requirement for us to be agents of joy! but it's good anyway.

and such is life. ....up, down, inside out...and freaky sideways for us!

cool

[amaviena]

I found this in another thread:
"Success in not final; Failure is not fatal; It is the courage to continue that counts." Winston Churchill

[shipping]

Cbox and any interested: I had no friends for most of my childhood. I was outcast and told "you go play with the indians". I didn't know what that meant so I just stood by myself day after day. One day, a kind girl took me over to where the indians played. Then she left me there. The indians knew I was not one of them, so they didn't play with me either. As a young teen I was almost raped because some guy thought I was an indian. Because of these experiences (and many many more) I constantly feel compelled to scream,as I did during the rape attempt, "I am Mexican!"

On the other hand, when I was 7 I discovered and started reading and looking at porn. I was already a very sensual child so the porn drove me up. I was also psycho. So I began masturbating in public whenever I became nervous (which was a lot). It was lovely that my grandparents lived way out in the woods because there were plenty of smooth-limbed trees and privacy. But town and school were another story.

I was so lonely as a child that when I read a porn story (not so regulated back then) about a girl being fondled, I began to wish and fantasize that that would happen to me. That was around age 9.

One would think that with all the ****ed up stuff in my childhood, I wouldn't know much about friendship and I would have sexual dysfunction or relationship problems. I have a lot of problems...but sex isn't really one of them (only depending on what psych med I am on at the time). I also have many friends. I still get lonely because I need hugs and friends 24-7 and sometimes my friends need a break. So I try to quietly amuse myself until they are ready to come back to me. My daddy just died. My spirit is broken. No way in **** will I give up!

Some of my doctors have suggested hospital psych ward. This makes me angry. I have been depressed and suicidal since I was a child and I was ignored. Now because I am going through several traumas all at once, and I am being more demanding on my therapist and my doctors, they suddenly want to put me in a hospital? Where was someone to put me in a hospital when I was 10 and I set my nightgown on fire? I got through most of these years without much help. I'm not giving up.

[emerylost]

I have been in DBT since 2008. I feel worse now than I ever have in my life. I feel so broken and the pain and hurt never goes away. I don't trust anyone so I have no close friends. I give and give but i feel used all the time. I want to quit this too! But I can't. I have a daughter who is mentally retarded. All the energy I have goes to her. She is the only thing that keeps me alive. I get so tired of pretending but she deserves the best I can give. Sometimes I wish I was like her. She only sees love and happy things thats her world. The world I see is hell.

[cboxpalace]

I wrote this back around my birthday. What a ****** day that must of been for me to write this. Anyways, since everything and everyone is boring the **** out of me, I decided I'd revisit this and see where or if my perspectives on things have changed.

I'm really writing this for me!!

Originally Posted by cboxpalace

For me.. I’ve come to the conclusion that when the spirit has been broken, for me most likely back in 2008, that it’s difficult if not impossible to fix. For me.. I believe it’s impossible, and I also have come to the conclusion that I don’t think I can learn as an adult what should’ve been learned naturally as a child. For me… Their realizations that I have to accept, no matter how much I don’t want to.

This pretty much meets the definition of the DBT principle of Radical Acceptance. I'd change this slightly though. I pretty much agree with what is written although I can define it more now.

A life is composed of many parts, and it's those parts that define a person. For ie. one part might be a parent, another part might be a spouse, another part would be a work life, and yet another friends. Add up all the parts and you have a life of a person.

I am on disability, and have been for several years now. I have no desire for friendships in the "real" world or a significant other. It wasn't always like that. It's going on 2 years now since I've dated. At first I thought I was just burnt out on dating/relationships, and I thought it would pass. It hasn't!! If anything it's expanded into wanting friendships. I don't think I have the energy to fake an interest in someone even if I wanted to. I'm detached, and feel nothing towards this part of my life. I don't feel angry or sad. I don't feel anything, and that doesn't bother me in the slightest.

I'm a parent, and I can honestly say I'm a better than average father. My kids bring me happiness and they are my lifeline to this world. I live so they don't turn out like me. I don't want them haunted by their childhood when their adults. I coach my kids sports, and I'm good at it. I like it, but I am only 1/2 a person, because I don't allow any other aspect of my life to tarnish it.

When I was with my Psychiatrist today he said that I should think about slowly trying to integrate myself with others. There was a noticeable change in my body. It began to feel heavy and I was overcome with dread. That part of my life outside of my kids is such a chore. I don't have it in me to fake the slightest interest in people. I'm not interested in interacting with them, pretending that I care, going into details about my life so I'm forced to listen to their stupidity. I want nothing to do with them or that part of life. The thought of interacting with them makes me angry if anything, and other than that I feel nothing. It's in this world that bpd rules me, and the further away I am from that world the easier it is to not be ruled.

So... it's reasonable that there is a part of me which has quit or given up, and if that's true.... It doesn't bother me in the slightest. I don't care. I don't feel anything. I'm very matter-of-fact about this.

I guess what surprised me somewhat is that as far back as February, I was developing the idea of not being able to learn as an adult what should've developed naturally as a child.

I've been able to define this more here....http://forums.psychcentral.com/showthread.php?t=244296

I'm sure there's other **** that I could add to this, but I'm drawing a blank.

I kinda wonder if your frustration with making friends might have morphed your BPD over time into something closer resembling Antisocial Personality Disorder. I don't know....it's just a thought. I don't know enough about ASPD to give an opinion, but I can understand, regardless, how ANY of us can get cynical and in your shoes over time.

As for difficulty maintaining friendships and the stuff you talked about towards the beginning of this thread, I agree that it sucks to not be able to have or maintain friends. I used to gain and lose friends but I stopped that routine many years ago....it just hurt too much, as you said earlier, and it just got to the point where it wasn't worth trying. It's better than to be alone and somewhat sane than to constantly go up and down in an attempt to feel wanted or to be a friend with someone. I haven't gotten to the point where you are, C-Box, but it's not hard for me to understand. My last "friend" is the reason why I am here. I was okay without any friends for a long time, and when I let someone it, after probably 15 years or so, and it finally fell apart, I fell apart with it. Lesson learned, I guess.

As for the different type of therapies and their effectiveness, I agree that DBT helps with everyday stresses and difficulties, but I don't think anything can magically show you how to gain, keep, and maintain a valid friendship. It is something that you learn in childhood that we didn't get for our individual reasons. I don't know much about MBT but am going to check it out. Can't hurt to look. I, like you, can't afford friendships. I haven't gotten to the "I don't care, I'd rather just be alone" mindset yet....maybe I will, maybe I won't. I wish I would. I logically know I can't afford friendships, but my heart still wants to try.... Friendships hurt too much and are just not worth it. On that point we can agree.

C -

"I don't think I have the energy to fake an interest in someone even if I wanted to. I'm detached, and feel nothing towards this part of my life. I don't feel angry or sad. I don't feel anything, and that doesn't bother me in the slightest.

I'm a parent, and I can honestly say I'm a better than average father. My kids bring me happiness and they are my lifeline to this world."

If you're unphased by not having friendships and not being social, it doesn't matter, you have your kids. Kids bring more joy than frivolous and tedious friendships anyway...Truth is, friendships take a lot of work, who wants to put in that work as well as as working on themselves and being a good parent at the same time? It's exhausting...

Do you feel, C, that you have black-and-white thinking around friendships? You say "I don't give a **** if I have friends." Does this also move to the other end of the spectrum of "I want friends more than anything."?? Just wondering if you do this the same way I do...You say now you don't care, but have you done this in the past? Does it happen occasionally?

"I guess what surprised me somewhat is that as far back as February, I was developing the idea of not being able to learn as an adult what should've developed naturally as a child."

My theory as of late revolves around validation...It is impossible to receive validation (or as much as I need as someone with BPD) from the external world as an adult. Our need for validation being unfullfilled (or another type of trauma) somehow deformed our development and thinking patterns. Now we're left as adults without core 'pieces' ...'pieces' that come naturally to 'healthy' people...Although, our peers (other adults) are not going to validate us...It is already ASSUMED that we have had enough validation as children..it is already assumed we have healthy coping skills, it is already assumed we know how to live and be in the world...many peers are taken aback at my lack of skills and 'deformed thinking.' How then do we fit those necessary pieces 'in'?
Our social skills are formed along with our 'personalities' (I hate that word, but I won't get into why)...If I'm lacking important 'pieces', I probably can't even relate to someone who has those pieces naturally...My thinking and behavior is considered unhealthy, but how would I even be friends with someone who is 'healthy' without exhausting them? Their end of the friendship will inevitably require more work than mine. < This is why I don't have many friends? Why people eventually 'leave'? I can easily fall into despair about missing those pieces...Fundamental qualities that are easily obtained by others and so foreign to me...It's good you're accepting of this, I am not there. I can work DBT as far as interpersonal relations go, and fail many times, fall into despair, rinse and repeat. This is only going to put me through the same cycle...over and over..further torturing myself. If I can't have healthy relationships, I should not have them, period.

I was talking to someone yesterday about feeling socially 'deprived', I don't have that many real-life friends...then again, relationships bring up even more BPD-related problems...So it's a catch-22...I want to have friends, but many people bore me, I don't relate to a lot of people and the task seems daunting...I want people to like me, but I don't want to care if they do or not...I want to be self-validated (which goes along with not caring) , but I want friends for validation? Wtf?

My personal needs as someone with BPD will never be fullfilled via other people, so other people, and friendships, could be more a liability to me than helpful anyway. And if you dont care then no loss anyway lol. I haven't gotten to the point of 'not caring', but hey you never know, I actually would prefer to care less than obsess about it. I wish for apathy sometimes, it seems healthier to me than my current self-defeating behavior. Maybe this is growth on your part?