[Crypts_Of_The_Mind]

Explain to me - how is a person supposed to get better if the doctors and counselors aren't educated on how to treat BPD and refuse to educate you on what it is they do know? When they can only medicate the parts that bother us most rather than all the symptoms thereby leaving us times we will devolve into melt downs without correct guidance or treatment - how is one supposed to get better when whenever you ask questions about how to deal with it you are only answered with a look that says "don't yoy know?"

[dancinglady]

Originally Posted by Crypts_Of_The_Mind

Explain to me - how is a person supposed to get better if the doctors and counselors aren't educated on how to treat BPD and refuse to educate you on what it is they do know? When they can only medicate the parts that bother us most rather than all the symptoms thereby leaving us times we will devolve into melt downs without correct guidance or treatment - how is one supposed to get better when whenever you ask questions about how to deal with it you are only answered with a look that says "don't yoy know?"

This is what us old timers lived with for decades. How it worked for me is I bought books specifically Marsha Lineham book and did self study. You have the advantage of taking online therapy classes at your local library if you don't have a computer.

[Crypts_Of_The_Mind]

Originally Posted by dancinglady

This is what us old timers lived with for decades. How it worked for me is I bought books specifically Marsha Lineham book and did self study. You have the advantage of taking online therapy classes at your local library if you don't have a computer.

I have been doing that for a few years but there is only so much one can do for oneself as you cannot always recognize what it is that is "wrong" when it comes to yourself. I have been dealing with this (knowingly) for 16yrs- been doing the self help thing for about 3yrs now. I am frustrates with having to be the only one that is willing to do anything for me when I do not have the ability to heal everything about me. Even physicians cannot fully heal themselves for the simple reason they cannot admit things are wrong with them when it comes to major things or things they have always looked upon with some form of disdain. Same is true when it comes to emotional problems. I am 41, so I am not completely "young" either- just aggravated.

[dancinglady]

Originally Posted by Crypts_Of_The_Mind

I have been doing that for a few years but there is only so much one can do for oneself as you cannot always recognize what it is that is "wrong" when it comes to yourself. I have been dealing with this (knowingly) for 16yrs- been doing the self help thing for about 3yrs now. I am frustrates with having to be the only one that is willing to do anything for me when I do not have the ability to heal everything about me. Even physicians cannot fully heal themselves for the simple reason they cannot admit things are wrong with them when it comes to major things or things they have always looked upon with some form of disdain. Same is true when it comes to emotional problems. I am 41, so I am not completely "young" either- just aggravated.

Just staying my experience and things that helped me. I am old enough to be your Mom. You are young in my arena. Don't know how to help with your pDocs and T. Maybe start shopping til you find another. Are you near a big city or close to an university. What about the online therapy idea. It is done through video chatting. They see u u see them in real time.

[Crypts_Of_The_Mind]

Originally Posted by dancinglady

Just staying my experience and things that helped me. I am old enough to be your Mom. You are young in my arena. Don't know how to help with your pDocs and T. Maybe start shopping til you find another. Are you near a big city or close to an university. What about the online therapy idea. It is done through video chatting. They see u u see them in real time.

I am in a relatively good size city - not "big" but not "small" either. I cannot do the online thing bc I cannot afford it, I was going to once but it cost too much and my insurance will not cover any therapy online (I called and asked). I have been through all the docs here that my insurance allows and again I cannot afford to go without insurance or even as "out of nb network"

[dancinglady]

Looks like you have burnt too many bridges. Sorry about that, can you travel to. Another close city. I don't know what else to tell you. Good luck. I know this is hard. Maybe if possible it is a time for a move to another area and a fresh start. Oh maybe a new T and PDoc will move in and start a new practice. I guess you need to behave as best as you can and just say "it is what it is" or "everything is as it should be". You are where you are. These are two of the big DBT messages that everyone learns when stuck.

[Crypts_Of_The_Mind]

Lol ... Nice ... Let's just assume it's me. No problem. Isn't that the "rule" of borderline personality disorder - "it's ALWAYS the person who has BPD at fault" (oh yea, by the way ... shh don't tell people with BPD that we [those without BPD] are allowed to use absolute words such as 'always' or 'never' or 'everyone' or 'nobody', etc - it's only them [those with BPD] that aren't allowed to use those words without being judged)

I realize atm I may sound to you as if I am irrational. That's fine. To be honest, your judgement of me only has impact when you have any clue about who I am or what it is going on in my life. For instance: how exactly have I behaved to my past doctors? How have they behaved toward me? What did we discuss? How many sessions have I had with my doctors? How many medications have I been on? Have I been compliant on those medications? Have I tried any other treatments? What exactly went on in my life that brought me to this place that I have psychological problems anyway? Are you entirely sure all blame should be mine to bear? Are you entirely sure doctors here are not corrupt in some way or abusive? These are a few questions you may want to consider before passing judgement on a thread such as this again. Take care now.

[dancinglady]

I'm sorry that I upset you. Honey I know these things because I have been where u are. Yes I dont know the docs don't know what brought u to this point. I just know from my own experience that sometimes we have exhausted our resources and it is time to move on. This is what I had to do several times. I wish you could get into DBT.

[Crypts_Of_The_Mind]

Originally Posted by dancinglady

I'm sorry that I upset you. Honey I know these things because I have been where u are. Yes I dont know the docs don't know what brought u to this point. I just know from my own experience that sometimes we have exhausted our resources and it is time to move on. This is what I had to do several times. I wish you could get into DBT.

No, you know YOUR experience because of what you went through. That doesn't mean mine is the same. Even though it may at first seem similar it may not be even remotely similar when you start talking about it.

Here is a very loose example:

A man and a woman are both sitting on a bench in a park, crying their eyes out. The woman happens to notice she is not alone in her misery before the man seems to, and looks over to him and says "I understand how you feel". The man says "my world was just ripped in two". The woman says "so was mine". They both cry a little more. The man looks up and tries to smile a little at her and says "it will be ok, one day you will be able to move on". The woman looks up and says "I don't know how, do you?" The man says "I guess we just have to keep trying to find happiness even if it's with someone else" The woman looks back up and says "I don't think I'll ever be happy again" The man says "yes you will - we both will, it will just take time but we will find someone else"
The woman looks back up and says "you don't understand" The man says "yes i do, my wife left me today" The woman looks back up and says "my son died in my arms today"

Initially - it looked entirely similar, when delving deeper its not similar at all - other than the outward emotion

[dancinglady]

Sorry I even answer your question. I might add I seem to the only one concerned enough to give you some hints and help you. It ended instead of you figuring out how to take care of your matter. It ended up you trashing any words I had to say. I can now see why you have the original problem. It must be very difficult to be your therapist. Maybe you need to thread these posts. Not all BPD sufferers/victims put their therapists to the test so these statements have not and would never be directed towards all BPDs. I do not generalize like that

Another DBT tool - when you ask a question or want some help you need to be open to people giving you the help. I seriously believe you need intensive DBT treatment. Good luck.

[dancinglady]

There are three DBT treatment centers in TN. Look them up on Behavioraltech.org. Call them and see what resources they offer in your area.

[Crypts_Of_The_Mind]

Originally Posted by dancinglady

There are three DBT treatment centers in TN. Look them up on Behavioraltech.org. Call them and see what resources they offer in your area.

You feel like paying a cab to drive 4-6hrs each way? Neither do I. I have looked them up long ago - TN is not a small state, I did not say "in my state", I said "in my area" - huge difference.

[dancinglady]

Sorry I am out of help. Good luck. Hopefully someone else will come on here and help you.

[dancinglady]

Wow your life seems to sliding downhill on a very icy mountain. Does not sound like you have a lot of hope of getting better. Sorry.

[kamikazebaby]

Originally Posted by dancinglady

Sorry I even answer your question. I might add I seem to the only one concerned enough to give you some hints and help you. It ended instead of you figuring out how to take care of your matter. It ended up you trashing any words I had to say. I can now see why you have the original problem. It must be very difficult to be your therapist. Maybe you need to thread these posts. Not all BPD sufferers/victims put their therapists to the test so these statements have not and would never be directed towards all BPDs. I do not generalize like that

Another DBT tool - when you ask a question or want some help you need to be open to people giving you the help. I seriously believe you need intensive DBT treatment. Good luck.

It's not true that no one else is concerned or cares to help her, nor does it mean that it's her fault. Why are you being so nasty? Totally uncalled for.

This is just a crappy, critical response to give her, especially when she is looking for help. I don't blame her for not being thrilled with the way you were speaking to her. You tend to come off as critical and condescending AT BEST, especially with regard to age and experience. Were you truly trying to help her, or just cruising for someone to take potshots at?

Its especially ironic that it's you telling her how much help she needs. Grown out of having BPD indeed!

[kamikazebaby]

Originally Posted by dancinglady

Sorry I am out of help. Good luck. Hopefully someone else will come on here and help you.

I think she can do without your brand of "help". Leave the poor girl alone already.

[dancinglady]

Well it took all of you long enough. I guess telling me how rotten I responded than helping her works Right? Whatever. I don't take criticism from people I don't respect. Guess who that might be. Yes I can get angry too notice? Whatever again

[Crypts_Of_The_Mind]

Originally Posted by dancinglady

Well it took all of you long enough. I guess telling me how rotten I responded than helping her works Right? Whatever. I don't take criticism from people I don't respect. Guess who that might be. Yes I can get angry too notice? Whatever again

Lol seems to me you DO have much the same reaction to ridicule as I do. Thing is, as I said before - you never asked about how my counselors treated me just assumed I treated them in the manner by which you treated yours or in the manner by which I was responding to you - however, you never once tried to come off in anything other than a ridiculing tone. In fact I think one of my first responses to you was something along the line of "it doesn't matter to me how others judge me unless they take the time to understand me" - pretty close to the response you just gave. And yes, it is VERY common for people with BPD to be treated in the ways I described, take a good look around this forum you will find many that say the same thing. By the way, my post was entitled "aggravation" for a reason - it isn't as much asking for help as it is venting or at the most perhaps getting clarification - so whether or not anyone commented was beside the point but you being more negative to me was more like just hammering in what the therapists already did. By the way, just in case you haven't read some of my other posts where I explained some of it better, here are a few of the things my therapists have told me:

"No wonder your husband treats you that way (brandishes weapons and starts to use them but stops just before contact, verbally abuses, etc) - look how you treat him (online internet affair at the time) - any man that respects himself would do the same"

"That (all my trauma that still affects me badly) was years ago, just get over it"

"It's not your fault, you just don't know how to treat people because you were never taught but you should never be around anyone and should live alone all your life"

Those are just a few things that have been said, but yea - let's continue with the idea that I am the one at complete and total fault here, ok?

Kudos to you for being oh so smart!

[Crypts_Of_The_Mind]

I am also beginning to wonder if you truly have BPD or are just on this forum in order to troll those who do - or maybe on the other spectrum you have BPD but its so out of control you don't even recognize it as being out of control. Either way, the fact remains it is you who has the control to decide whether or not to use those dbt skills you have learned and from what I saw in your responses both to me and kamikaze, I believe you are choosing not to use those skills or perhaps use them as a means to harm others rather than help you. Again, that is certainly a choice you can make - I will not try to tell you not to. I do not control you. Just as you do not control me. I control me. See, from everything I have been able to read about DBT, that is one of the most basic principles it teaches. "One cannot control anything or anyone other than one's self" From what I have learned of it through my readings, it further teaches one to look at each situation in a diverse set of views so one can understand how perhaps the initial reaction or emotion may have been over-reactive or was in fact a "legitimate" reaction. You say you have come a long way with DBT and that it has helped you to be able to handle things better. It is evident to me in some places this thread stressed you. I ask you to look back over this thread (for your own benefit) some time - just to see if your responses (while stressed) were better reactions than the responses I gave to you? I am asking you to do this simply because I don't want to come off sounding like I am just fluffing words to you when I tell you "You are no better than me or kamikaze or anyone else". You have your experiences, true - but we have ours too. We all have differing lives. They may only have small differences or may have a lot but either way they are all different and because we are different people we all deal with our experiences differently as well - therefore judging anyone negatively before you attempt to understand both that person n their set of circumstances is to have negative judgement passed upon you by yourself - and that negative self judgement will bleed outwardly to others around you making it very hard for others to not pass negative judgement upon you as well. That will be their choice of course, but its one that can be influenced by your own choice. The way I see things, it's best to give yourself the best opportunity with others. At least, that's what I try to do. You choose what you want - continue to judge people negatively the first chance you get (as you did with both I and kamikaze), or attempt to understand people and their circumstances before judging them and prior to that just accept them as the person they are. Take care now

[kamikazebaby]

Originally Posted by Crypts_Of_The_Mind

I am also beginning to wonder if you truly have BPD or are just on this forum in order to troll those who do - or maybe on the other spectrum you have BPD but its so out of control you don't even recognize it as being out of control. Either way, the fact remains it is you who has the control to decide whether or not to use those dbt skills you have learned and from what I saw in your responses both to me and kamikaze, I believe you are choosing not to use those skills or perhaps use them as a means to harm others rather than help you. Again, that is certainly a choice you can make - I will not try to tell you not to. I do not control you. Just as you do not control me. I control me. See, from everything I have been able to read about DBT, that is one of the most basic principles it teaches. "One cannot control anything or anyone other than one's self" From what I have learned of it through my readings, it further teaches one to look at each situation in a diverse set of views so one can understand how perhaps the initial reaction or emotion may have been over-reactive or was in fact a "legitimate" reaction. You say you have come a long way with DBT and that it has helped you to be able to handle things better. It is evident to me in some places this thread stressed you. I ask you to look back over this thread (for your own benefit) some time - just to see if your responses (while stressed) were better reactions than the responses I gave to you? I am asking you to do this simply because I don't want to come off sounding like I am just fluffing words to you when I tell you "You are no better than me or kamikaze or anyone else". You have your experiences, true - but we have ours too. We all have differing lives. They may only have small differences or may have a lot but either way they are all different and because we are different people we all deal with our experiences differently as well - therefore judging anyone negatively before you attempt to understand both that person n their set of circumstances is to have negative judgement passed upon you by yourself - and that negative self judgement will bleed outwardly to others around you making it very hard for others to not pass negative judgement upon you as well. That will be their choice of course, but its one that can be influenced by your own choice. The way I see things, it's best to give yourself the best opportunity with others. At least, that's what I try to do. You choose what you want - continue to judge people negatively the first chance you get (as you did with both I and kamikaze), or attempt to understand people and their circumstances before judging them and prior to that just accept them as the person they are. Take care now

Excellent post. You actually sound like you've had way more DBT than dancinglady! Your responses to her remained very calm and reasonable, especially considering how provocative hers were.

I do think DL may have some other issue. Giving the benefit of the doubt that this tendency to bully others is some variety of acting out and associated with BPD makes me feel like I have to apologize to the BPD community, because most of us are not like that, and I don't want anyone thinking that I think they are. I have met many more kind, sweet people with BPD than I have malignant ones (and she is one of the latter, at the very least).

No worries, she can judge me. I've seen how she thinks about the world and other people, and I don't care about the opinion of someone like her. I do care when she is being horrible to others, however. I can't stand that.

[Crypts_Of_The_Mind]

Originally Posted by kamikazebaby

Excellent post. You actually sound like you've had way more DBT than dancinglady! Your responses to her remained very calm and reasonable, especially considering how provocative hers were.

I do think DL may have some other issue. Giving the benefit of the doubt that this tendency to bully others is some variety of acting out and associated with BPD makes me feel like I have to apologize to the BPD community, because most of us are not like that, and I don't want anyone thinking that I think they are. I have met many more kind, sweet people with BPD than I have malignant ones (and she is one of the latter, at the very least).

No worries, she can judge me. I've seen how she thinks about the world and other people, and I don't care about the opinion of someone like her. I do care when she is being horrible to others, however. I can't stand that.

Thank you for your compliments *hugs* - and I do agree most BPD are not malignant, although I will say when BPD gets out of control our words can at times be harmful to others so (assuming bpd is present here) dancinglady may perhaps be out of control atm, I don't know.

[dancinglady]

Originally Posted by Crypts_Of_The_Mind

Lol seems to me you DO have much the same reaction to ridicule as I do. Thing is, as I said before - you never asked about how my counselors treated me just assumed I treated them in the manner by which you treated yours or in the manner by which I was responding to you - however, you never once tried to come off in anything other than a ridiculing tone. In fact I think one of my first responses to you was something along the line of "it doesn't matter to me how others judge me unless they take the time to understand me" - pretty close to the response you just gave. And yes, it is VERY common for people with BPD to be treated in the ways I described, take a good look around this forum you will find many that say the same thing. By the way, my post was entitled "aggravation" for a reason - it isn't as much asking for help as it is venting or at the most perhaps getting clarification - so whether or not anyone commented was beside the point but you being more negative to me was more like just hammering in what the therapists already did. By the way, just in case you haven't read some of my other posts where I explained some of it better, here are a few of the things my therapists have told me:

"No wonder your husband treats you that way (brandishes weapons and starts to use them but stops just before contact, verbally abuses, etc) - look how you treat him (online internet affair at the time) - any man that respects himself would do the same"

"That (all my trauma that still affects me badly) was years ago, just get over it"

"It's not your fault, you just don't know how to treat people because you were never taught but you should never be around anyone and should live alone all your life"

Those are just a few things that have been said, but yea - let's continue with the idea that I am the one at complete and total fault here, ok?

Kudos to you for being oh so smart!

Thanks for comparing me to your therapists. I think you took things out of context but that is ok. I will re-read the posts and correct what I need to do.

What about all the resources I gave you? You are right and I overstepped the line. I can't control you I guess I overstepped the line between helping and controlling you in your and k opinion.

[Crypts_Of_The_Mind]

Originally Posted by dancinglady

Thanks for comparing me to your therapists. I think you took things out of context but that is ok. I will re-read the posts and correct what I need to do.

What about all the resources I gave you? You are right and I overstepped the line. I can't control you I guess I overstepped the line between helping and controlling you in your and k opinion.

The resources you gave me were good suggestions. The problem was- I have honestly tried those things in the past. I live in the very norteastern tip of Tennessee and the nearest DBT counselor is seriously that far away and I am not even sure if any of them would take my insurance. I do not own a car and take a taxi, community bus or walk everywhere I go. I am on disability so have a very limited income and no real money to spare. I have once tried the online thing and he was going to try to charge it to my insurance but my insurance was unwilling to do it and when I called to ask why they said simply they do not cover online therapy. I have read as much of the DBT as I can not by purchasing books but rather by going to the book store and reading it there. I am doing the best I can with what I have but the counselors I am able to get through my insurance and location and funds simply do not make matters any easier so venting is sometimes needed. Thank you for acknowledging over stepping a bit. I was not ignoring you I was simply trying to explain my situation but not feeling I was being given a chance. I am sorry if I came across incorrectly. *hugs*

P.S. When I said you assumed I treated my therapists as you treated yours or how I spoke to you - I was not comparing you to my therapists (though I can understand how you interpreted it that way), I was meaning them as two separate scenarios.

[dancinglady]

I am sorry for you. Next time I will assume people are just venting. So what are u going to do now? What options do you have left. I think if you are on Medicaid that they have to transport free to you to an appropriate facility. I know a person with cancer getting flown to another state for treatment. Will you PDoc right a specific prescription for DBT.

[dancinglady]

I understand your P S clarification but some of those statements I have to agree with. Are u still in the relationship with the abusive husband??