[jazrobinson]

So I'm currently in therapy for my emotional responses to certain situations and I've been seeing this therapist for a few months now and there's a question that we still haven't cracked the answer to. We discovered that the thing that is impacting my mental health the most is a cognitive behavioural pattern I have where I harbour guilt & shame extremely easily. Thoughts enter into my head that tear me down and basically shame me and I have a full body response whether that be intense crying or a panic attack. My therapist brought up the fact that I have two choices; to either have that negative response system or to counteract negative feedback with optimistic perspective. However, I don't do the the second option because I find it immensely difficult. She brought up that this means I'm benefiting from the negative response system in some way; that I have a reward system in place for the harbouring of immense shame and crying profusely. Basically, I'm trying to figure out what the benefit is and why I keep doing it. I know that there's past dysfunctional family circumstances that influenced the thought pattern, however, I'm trying to figure out what I'm benefiting from it as an adult. If anyone has any ideas for what they think it could be, that would be greatly appreciated. I've returned home twice this week bursting out into tears because of my program at university and begin to self deprecate and contemplate on my loneliness and sob...I can't figure out why I do it and why I can't get myself out of it.

[Agent Misty]

As someone who has the same issue as you, which also results in outbursts of tears as well as panic attacks, it is impossible for me to imagine you continue to do it because it benefits you.

For me, I was literally born this way. I have felt intense shame and self hatred.. it exists in my earliest memories. I recall when I was about 4 I hated the sight of my own face in our picture album so much that I was inconsolable until my mother glued cut out faces of models over my own face in the pictures. To this day they are still that way in the album. I remember I was told to be quiet once in kindergarden and I felt so worthless and ashamed of having spoke out of turn that I quietly sat there, tears rolling down my face. Mind you, people got told to be quiet every day in kindergarden. But ME, I should not have messed up.

I am a highly sensitive person. I cry over the smallest bad things that happen, as well as the smallest good things. My sensitivity makes me prone to having an intense reaction to every feeling, such as anger, excitement, joy, fear, shame, etc.

Currently I am trying to learn a different perspective than what came natural to me all this time, which is to love myself.

I personally believe now that I have a generalized expectation of myself to do something great, and be perfect.. Every time I am not perfect in front of someone, I become so terribly embarrassed and ashamed. Because no one can be perfect, I just hate myself and shame myself. I think the day I can truly accept not being perfect is when I can start moving on.

When I stop being afraid of looking stupid, weird, ugly, boring, lame, pathetic in front of people... I can start getting better.

Why am I saying all this? Well.. it's because it is hard to pin down exactly why someone feels shame excessively. I'm not saying that your therapist is dead wrong, but I'm saying not everything a person does and thinks is a response caused to benefit themselves.

For me, my shame and guilt is rooted in intense fear. The cycle is like this for me:

I do X thing, think I could mess up> I mess it up > shame and guilt
I am too afraid to do X because I'll fail or look stupid or embarrassing > Decide not to do X > feel shame or guilt of being weak and afraid
I look fat and ugly in the mirror, fear others will see it too > shame
I say something dumb even though I fear looking incompetant> shame

My cycles are generally rooted in fear of imperfection.


I don't know what yours is rooted in, but if you cannot even begin to fathom how your benefitting from being guilty and ashamed all the time.. Maybe it's because your not. only you can dig deep enough within to find out "why". Who knows, if you dig deep enough maybe you will find that you do it out of benefit, but you could find it is very well rooted in someting besides that. You don't seem to have any idea of a benefit to it.. So it's possible she is mistaken. Just keep trying to talk to her about and tell her anything new you may discover about your feelings.

Hi, your therapist should work on how you overturn feelings of shame, guilt and self deprecating thoughts and turn those into more positive, optimistic beliefs. From what I know about cognitive behavioral therapy, every time you have a negative thought or feeling about yourself, challenge it and ask why am I thinking or feeling this way? There is no basis for this in reality, there is nothing that supports it, so there is no reason for it and no way to benefit from it. It's called thought stopping -- then thought shifting to more positive thoughts that support reality and the reality as you want it to be. Hope this makes sense.... it takes effort to continually challenge your feelings and negative thought patterns, but it's well worth the effort. I hope your therapist continues to help you with this. (((((hugs))))))

[jazrobinson]

Originally Posted by Agent Misty

As someone who has the same issue as you, which also results in outbursts of tears as well as panic attacks, it is impossible for me to imagine you continue to do it because it benefits you.

For me, I was literally born this way. I have felt intense shame and self hatred.. it exists in my earliest memories. I recall when I was about 4 I hated the sight of my own face in our picture album so much that I was inconsolable until my mother glued cut out faces of models over my own face in the pictures. To this day they are still that way in the album. I remember I was told to be quiet once in kindergarden and I felt so worthless and ashamed of having spoke out of turn that I quietly sat there, tears rolling down my face. Mind you, people got told to be quiet every day in kindergarden. But ME, I should not have messed up.

I am a highly sensitive person. I cry over the smallest bad things that happen, as well as the smallest good things. My sensitivity makes me prone to having an intense reaction to every feeling, such as anger, excitement, joy, fear, shame, etc.

Currently I am trying to learn a different perspective than what came natural to me all this time, which is to love myself.

I personally believe now that I have a generalized expectation of myself to do something great, and be perfect.. Every time I am not perfect in front of someone, I become so terribly embarrassed and ashamed. Because no one can be perfect, I just hate myself and shame myself. I think the day I can truly accept not being perfect is when I can start moving on.

When I stop being afraid of looking stupid, weird, ugly, boring, lame, pathetic in front of people... I can start getting better.

Why am I saying all this? Well.. it's because it is hard to pin down exactly why someone feels shame excessively. I'm not saying that your therapist is dead wrong, but I'm saying not everything a person does and thinks is a response caused to benefit themselves.

For me, my shame and guilt is rooted in intense fear. The cycle is like this for me:

I do X thing, think I could mess up> I mess it up > shame and guilt
I am too afraid to do X because I'll fail or look stupid or embarrassing > Decide not to do X > feel shame or guilt of being weak and afraid
I look fat and ugly in the mirror, fear others will see it too > shame
I say something dumb even though I fear looking incompetant> shame

My cycles are generally rooted in fear of imperfection.


I don't know what yours is rooted in, but if you cannot even begin to fathom how your benefitting from being guilty and ashamed all the time.. Maybe it's because your not. only you can dig deep enough within to find out "why". Who knows, if you dig deep enough maybe you will find that you do it out of benefit, but you could find it is very well rooted in someting besides that. You don't seem to have any idea of a benefit to it.. So it's possible she is mistaken. Just keep trying to talk to her about and tell her anything new you may discover about your feelings.

Thank you so much for sharing your personal story; I relate to it so much. I think that's why sometimes I feel so defeated when I leave counselling. She asks me what is the benefit and asks if I feel better after I cry. And she'll try and figure out if that is the root cause for why I choose to think negatively...but I feel like I didn't choose this. Sometimes I feel like I don't have a choice it just happens. I just start remembering every awful thing about me. I feel then awful afterwards because she says "well no, you do have a choice" and maybe it's true I do but then I feel even more ashamed because I think well then what kind of a person am I that I choose this? I think yeah I will speak with her more.

[Sunflower123]

Good luck in getting to the bottom of it. It sounds like your therapist could be more helpful in this besides delving into why you are doing this and what the benefit is. That sounds very difficult if not impossible to define. I agree with the above posters that the why may not be as important as the how to thought shift. Best wishes.