[DespondentDaisy]

I know I could just send a private message to Doc John, but I'm curious about what everyone out there thinks about this -> the gently reminder about "no suicidal posts, please." I mean, I'm not suicidal at the moment, but if I was, I'd want to be able to write about it. I mean, in a way I can see some of these posts that I've read sort of suicidal anyways, just not explicit. I mean, isn't this what this page is for. People dealing with depression in all shapes and forms and degrees? I think suicidal posts should be allowed, otherwise someone might just kill themselves instead of post and perhaps get a response that might help them get through another dark night and seek help the next day or that night via a help line, etc. That's my stance, what's YOURS?

[Rapunzel]

There seems to be kind-of a fine line. There's a difference between posting about having suicidal thoughts or feelings and being willing to work through them, as opposed to posting suicidal intent. There are others who read here who can be vulnerable in lots of ways, from being at increased risk when they are triggered by reading a suicidal post, to being hurt when they try to offer help and support and it feels like a wasted effort if someone continues to be suicidal. There has been a history of people who posted continuously about suicide being the only option, and would reject any support anybody offered, disappear for a while after making a suicide threat, reappear and start the whole thing over again. That kind of stuff doesn't help anyone, including the person feeling suicidal. Basically, it just isn't fair to others to put responsibility on them for something so serious, when they are struggling too and not here to provide treatment or able to intervene. Someone who is in the moment feeling suicidal needs professional support, and this isn't an appropriate place to get it. It's a bit like someone who is having a heart attack posting on a message board instead of going to the ER. It's a serious problem, and that person does need help, but nobody here can really do them any good at that point.

[Charlie_J]

POSSIBLE TRIGGER AHEAD







There is a line, and a difference between discussion of suicidal thoughts/impulses and suicide in general, as opposed to posting about actively seeking to end your life. Discussion of suicide in general can aid our understanding of it, and sharing our experiences can help us by making us recognise the danger and seek help at the right time.

As someone who has lost others to suicide (my Dad and brother), it’s absolutely vital sometimes that I can talk about it. Suicide is still a taboo, and it’s not a subject most people are comfortable with, which I understand, but I can’t afford to be afraid. I have grief to work through and I don’t have the luxury of pretending it away. For instance, if I had lost them to a car accident, I couldn’t mourn them and never again mention car crashes. It exists; all the myriad threads of it are woven into the tapestry of my life and the picture can’t ever be the same.

One of those threads is self-recrimination, which doesn’t even begin to describe the magnitude of emotion involved. So many “if only’s,” and they all go on to be “if only I had…” because sometimes the human inside us doesn’t hold the lost to account, only ourselves.

I am finding that this place is a wonderful support network, but it’s not a rescue service. We each have a responsibility to be kind and considerate to each other, and to be as gentle as possible since we all have our own troubles to deal with.

Be fair to everyone, including yourself. Don’t put others in the way of the “if only’s.” Never put your life into the hands of someone who isn’t trained to handle it (unless of course there’s a global zombie apocalypse a la The Walking Dead).

Basically, if you’re making plans, then you shouldn’t be writing about it. You're asking the wrong people to save you. You should seek professional help, at your nearest hospital if necessary. Stay safe, get out of danger, then we can talk about it when you get back.

[dragonfly2]

I can also understand the fine line that exists here regarding suicide. It is a very emotionally charged topic. That being said, it is something that we may need to talk about, and there is a place for this. There is another forum: www.suicideforum.com . It is anonymous, like this one, and handles not only those who are suicidal, but also survivors of suicide. By supporting others, we can often be brought out of our own thoughts. It is also a place where those who are suicidal can hear stories about those they leave behind and see the effects we may not always consider. Use the site with caution, but it is there if you need it.

[DespondentDaisy]

All good points. I am feeling better today, I tend to be better one day, then more down the other. I was just feeling a bit more sensitive yesterday I guess. I do get though that there is a fine line, I, I don't know. I can't describe my mood exactly yesterday other than to say I was feeling frustrated by that gentle reminder, but I sort of understand it a bit more. I am not necessarily suicidal, I just think about 'what is I wasn't here anymore?" more oten some days- I would never actually want to kill myself. I would sooon distract myself by getting engrossed in a good computer game before I get serious about that. I know my life has had it's up's and downs, but I know I have a lot to be thankful about- there are many who are far less fortunate than I. I try to remind myself of that whenever I get too hard on myself and remain humble. Sleep helps too. Often time in the morning I feel better.

[LyingSweetie]

I don't know about others, but it is so hard for me to deal with "I'm going to kill myself" posts because I feel so much pain for the suicidal person, being a bit suicidal myself sometimes, but I feel like no matter what I say, they continue to be suicidal and I feel so helpless and depressed, not to mention the suicide thing tends to rub off on me rather easily. :|

[Emotionally Dead]

Could be a trigger.

I am someone who has dealt with the suicidal feelings before. Someone who has, in varying degrees, attempted but failed. Generally because I just was too chicken to actually do it. Many times I have felt like life isn't worth living, but I have finally got better with it. I would love to be an advocate, someone who could talk to people who are having suicidal thoughts. Sometimes, all that person needs is a helping hand. I don't agree that when you are that close to suicide that someone on a forums can't help, because they can. I have felt so lonely before and the times where I nearly did actually go through with it I think that if someone would have just comforted me I wouldn't have even got that far.

So I do agree that the posts should be allowed. I like to try to talk to those in a PM after I see a post like that because I feel like I can help. I can say "I've been there" I know how it is and I know how it feels and I KNOW that most people do not REALLY want to do it, they just feel like it's the only option, and they need someone to tell them "No, I am here for you, it's not the only option". Obviously there are varying degrees of suicidal thoughts. Some people have them every day, and some have them every once in a while, and then some are so far gone that all they can think about is how to kill themselves. I don't agree with the rule completely because I am just so tender with that subject.

I know that it can hurt others and make others want to do it as well, but what if there are some lives it can save. What if two people who are that close meet through that form and all of a sudden start PM'ing, become friends, and get each other through that moment and then continue to keep each other up. You just never know with life. I don't want to see people who are attention seekers either do it, but the people who really feel that is the only option need help and there are people here that can say the right things even better than those hotlines they take you to. Someone who is that close knows that the person they are talking to is a trained professional, some hired and some volunteered, but to me it was always a little different than talking to someone who is not getting paid to do it and someone who just wants to be there to help. When I was in that zone I would much rather have had someone on here than one of those hotlines.

So I understand both sides but lean more to the fact that I wish it were allowed. I just feel like there are certain things that shouldn't be taken out. I myself had a post edited once for having "too much info" about a suicide attempt. I guess that someone could have taken that as a trigger but I felt like it would help others relate. There is a line but I would rather see it be allowed and then the threads be monitored rather than to just not allow it at all and then someone who may really need help feel like they can't get it here. I would just think that if you were that close, seeing that your thread on here for comfort was edited or deleted might just make things a lot worse. You just never know though, depends on the situation.

[Charlie_J]

POSSIBLE TRIGGERS AGAIN.....

Originally Posted by Emotionally Dead

I don't agree that when you are that close to suicide that someone on a forums can't help, because they can. I have felt so lonely before and the times where I nearly did actually go through with it I think that if someone would have just comforted me I wouldn't have even got that far.

I understand what you say about the need for comfort, and for all that you might be right about it being all someone needs, but really that has nothing to do with this. The reminder exists for others.

I’d like to make clear here that I am not talking about posts that involve suicide as a subject, previous suicide attempts, previous suicidal thoughts or various triggering subjects. Discussion of these may help any one of us in any number of ways. Even current vague suicidal feelings such as not wanting to live, or not seeing a reason to carry on – these are valid too. What I object to is posting about current suicidal intent as a cry for help.

Some people may not want the responsibility of someone else’s life on their conscience, for any number of reasons. If someone they read and respect on here suddenly makes an urgent post, ignoring pleas to seek professional help, shifting the responsibility for saving their life into the hands of the forum members, it’s inconsiderate at best, no matter how bad the person in question may feel.

It’s psychologically aggressive at worst, because it’s like taking yourself hostage, and how can a person refuse to be part of it? And if it all goes terribly wrong, what then? The weight of that kind of burden is something I can’t even begin to describe, and it’ll be on someone who never asked for it, expected it, or wanted it. No matter how close your friends may be, you can never expect that kind of sacrifice from anyone.

Lastly, in contrast to all other mental illnesses, suicide catches. And I don’t mean that talking about it inspires urges. I mean that a successful suicide can reverberate for decades around groups of people: families, friends, acquaintances. I deal with it myself, and the statistics bear me out. Given that we’re in a place where vulnerable people gather, it’s really not advisable.

Hence, the gentle reminder... No suicidal posts, please.