Mad in america

That's easy to say now after I have shown you how little value there was in your "Generalized Headache Disorder".

Sweet BudFox, it will not happen like that. Probably the doctor will say something like this: "Now when we have ruled out the possibility that you might suffer from Simple fobia, we can start to work with your anxiety (which is labeled so and so in the diagnostic manual if you want to know your diagnosis). Do you have any ideas where we can start"? In a lot of physical diseases the doctor tells the patient how to behave (included taking medication if necessary). With mental disorder we talk much more about cooperation between therapist and 'patient' over time (or 'client' if you like that term better).

I hope you are able to see that something then is accomplished!

You are mistaken! Social fobia (Social Anxiety Disorder) is not the same as SAD. SAD is Seasonal Affective Disorder. That's a disorder who affects the mood because of depression at special seasons in the year (some get it in the winters, others in the summer, while the two other seasons may be the worst for other people).

Social fobia, on the other hand is related to anxiety in social situations. No doctor tells her patient that she has Social fobia and then shows her the door. This is so ridiculous that it is almost unbelievable that I have to answer such questions. The patient will be taken care of in a good way. As with GAD, therapist and patient will work togheter as a team on the problems. Toghether they will explore and map out where to begin (people are differnt and what triggers social anxiety in one person does not have to do it in another). May be the patient will learn relaxation exersises, how to visualise the first difficult task too meet before trying it out in the real world and so on. ...

If you cannot see that something is accomplished, you must wear some really strange glasses!

It is normal to feel fear if you meet a bear in the street, - nearly fall down from a mountain, - are worried for not having knowledge enough to pass an exam, - are frightened when you understand that a loved one perhaps will die at the surgery table and so on ...

Nobody will force mental health patients to take medication unless they are hospitalized without free will. Nowadays that happens only when patients are a danger to herself or other.

Please be kind to not call normal fear for anxiety at a level that needs treatment! Respect those who need treatment!!

I want a benzo

There are individual differences and different types of depression. A person can always choose not to take medications at all and I don't think you can be compelled to take them. I will see what I can find later to answer properly re how much requires medications for life and if there is a position stand on this.

To simplify it and give a short answer doctors say is it depends on how frequently you become depressed. If its once every 5 years and your mood returns to 'normal' then you can taper off medications. But if you are chronically depressed then the advice is to continue to take the medications while they work. Please remember I have tried to give a brief answer to a complex topic

thanks....this is really good....the sharing of information...I am less depressed already

I think that is his MAIN argument -- that psych drugs are a significant factor in the dramatic rise of disabling mental illness -- and the primary conclusion of the book, which he arrived at through meticulous and exhaustive research, and supported by evidence, compelling personal narratives, and insider quotes. But you're entitled to your opinion.

Selective quoting? Who would know better that the editor of one of the oldest and most respected medical journals in the world?

Much of his book is about schizophrenia. Putting it in context, little turtle was asking specifically about depression and lonely and sad response was addressing that. Context is important, particularly when you take a quote don't you think? By the way, I think you will find that the editor of the Lancet does not agree with Robert Whitaker. Does that change your position on the Lancet? You are entitled to your opinion but I for one find it strange that you think Whitaker, a journalist has access to information that industry specialists do not.

I was talking about Dr Peter R Breggin and his attacks on Ritalin, the parents he blames for their child's ADHD and the psychiatric profession generally among others.

ok....now that we have trashed and defended certain persons we can get down to reality...
I am mad/angry and I live in America....I do not like the mental health care system
that I am in....we are treating all kinds of depression problems with drugs by our doctors who don't have time or don't take time to make a proper evaluation of what is going on..
it seems that the system will pay for QUICK treatments...I don't like that...I have the feeling that the patients needs are disregarded ....unless you have money...that makes me mad....and a lot of money is being made from depression....it seems to me that a lot more people are on meds for depression...I think a lot more people are depressed...

I think he his attacks are on the system that forces Ritalin on families and children, and on the basic ideology and pathological thinking that drives this practice. I believe he would argue that the child needs understanding and compassion rather than to have natural feelings and impulses medicalized and then drugged away.

The book Anatomy of an Epidemic covers all main areas of mental illness, depression included. Also anxiety, bipolar, ADHD, history of the biz, history of drug development, the marketing story, coverups, and more.

The Lancet quote speaks for itself.

Whitaker's book speaks for itself.

dear venusss--------what do think about me little turtle starting this thread....I wanted to bring up the dangers of all the drugging that is going on in America....I don't like it...and I am here for help and support even tho I am a medical doctor with a depression disorder...I think I belong here ...we need to work on this depression thing together with kindness...

Indeed. I wish me and others weren't called ignorant for havign a different approach to healing though. Or even a different perspective.

I get it, maybe some person would think twice about taking meds and may end up no taking them. But it wouldn't be a bad thing in many cases, would it? Mainstream psychiatry failed so many people that I refuse to defend it.

dear venusss---we need to work together...on this thread we need kindness and cooperation...as a doctor I have seen with myself and my patients the good and bad of drugs....they are both there...I am concerned mostly about young people being diagnosed early and medicated early....it looks dangerous to me...I am coming from what I saw with my own eyes...and venusss you see
from your experience...we really need RESPECT here...in the words that we use...

Just a reminder -- we are primarily a support community, not an advocacy or policy-making group. When we start down these other roads, we're going to have people disagree with our opinions, which can be done in a supportive or non-supportive manner. I would encourage you -- if you choose to engage in a thread of this nature -- to find a supportive way to couch your disagreement or criticism.

And remember, your disagreement, if you choose to express it, is always to be directed at another person's argument or opinion -- not the person themselves.

We're happy to keep this thread going as long as its participants can maintain the respect and civility we expect all of our members.

Thank you for your cooperation.

DocJohn

thanks docjohn

I am a person that is mad in America...I have a mental illness
I am angry about the way we are treated...
I do not like that every problem is solved with a drug..
either by the doctor or the druggie on the street
why are so many people getting depressed and killing themselves...
why are so people getting sick when they are young...
I DO NOT like the way our health care system is money oriented..
the persons that are angry also need help and support here..
it is time to start fixing some of these problems....

Very interesting thread indeed, thanks everyone. As a person who lives outside of America, Some of us are also Mad About America, We can also be Mad With America, seriously though, I'm just saying this without reading all the posts, kid bipolar, stuff like that. Good constructive criticism should be always welcome in any community to evolve and advance as a spices. Namaste, little turtle.

thanks takeshi--------good constructive criticism.....yes

before taking any anti-depressant YOU need to know the SIDE EFFECTS...

Hi Little Turtle,
Also, we may need to question the way society works because it may be generating a lot of our psychological issues. Perhaps the easy way is to label people and to give them drugs, accordingly but that is not a long term solution. But criticizing the status quo is not a job that many people (including those working in the mental health industry) are willing to do. Having said that I think we have to acknowledge that psychiatry is helping a lot of people, as well.

yes clara----and I was helped a lot by talking to a clinical psychologist who
really cared about me...

And Sometimes drugs help people. In my case, Prozac has been good as a starter. I mean, Prozac can get me out of depression when I am at the lowest point of depression. I get it for a more or less short period. Then, I continue with therapy only. This is the way it worked for me in the past. My expectation is that next time I am very low I will not need to use any drug. Hopefully I will cope just with therapy

Seems clear to me that dysfunction and sickness in society is going to manifest in individuals, especially the most sensitive, those with trauma, chronic stress, and so on.

"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.”
---Krishnamurti

I would just add that there are many other ways to cope. I saw an MD today who works with trauma and emotional issues (she is very very different from most docs and has abandoned conventional medicine). She does EMDR, color therapy, neural therapy, and incorporates spiritual practice into her work. She shared some simple tools for building skills around self-containment and discharge of difficult emotions and sensations. Reminds me that we can help heal ourselves and we don't always need external interventions to save us.

I find it extremely troubling that there is such an insistent drumbeat for drugs and therapy, to the exclusion of everything else much of the time.

That is true. Also, I use aromatherapy regularly and mindfulness although not in a regular way