AJ said women have too many emotions

Was this for me?

Those who seek my council trust that my perceptions are accurate because I have a reputation of being perceptive and past incidents have shown as such.

Michael the Great asks ~ "Not tolerate. AJ says that "women have l00 different emotions and he just doesn't get it or know what to do........He said it all drives him nuts..." If AJ is capable of empathy - that is, he is able to understand and experience the emotions of another - then why am I, the psychopath, better at understanding the motives and actions of the opposite sex than AJ, the non-psychopath? Why is it so hard for people who are capable of empathy to understand anyone at all? "

Michael,
Your talking about motives and actions, AJ is talking about 100 different emotions. His struggle is in that he feels there are so many he gets overwhelmed.

My opinion is that you don't express emotion,hense provoking emotion, you instead address women in a way that shows your considering what motivates them. And your bypassing the emotions by observing their actions in which you can read women's rituals. The fact that you are not emotional means that you don't absorb the passing of emotions as people that have emotionality often unconsciously and even consciously absorb and can be thus distrubed by someone who expresses a lot of emotionality.

Your whole demenor and goal is what motivates. Aj isn't thinking about motivating at all. It would be to his advantage if he were to learn what might motivate his girlfriend to choose to curb her emotionality. There is a lack in you, your like a mirror that doesn't reflect, but instead of not reflecting an image, it is emotionality that is not reflected. AJ on the other hand does absorb the emotionality and it makes him angry and impatient, which makes his girlfriend angry and impatient which leads to arguments.

That is part of your demenor that can (doesn't always) make some feel uncomfortable and cautious. However because you have learned to polish your skills in motivating you gain an advantage. And that is exactly why you can be dangerous, if you choose to so be.

I had told you somewhere in a post, that your imput can be useful in a support site, ah ha politicians do it all the time, and that is because you do bypass emotionality to motivation. Emotionality can reflect poorly on oneself, ruminating, depression, lack of motivation, even interrupting adaptation. Wouldn't it be something if you could sell someone to themselves by using your motivational skills.

Something to think about, remember I am resourseful by nature.

Now, if the quote you sited above was addressing you, it does have some merrit in that your perception is, in fact different from say, a man with emotionality. So your perception is not necessarily as correct as you think. However, your perception can serve as a means to part of the resolve for AJ. There is a fine line between war and peace. Remember wars are started by men. AJ and his girlfriend have taken up seperate countries (residence) and now only visit each other and that is not a solution that will unite them.

Open Eyes

radio flyer,
It is good that you talked about how you didn't display emotion in front of AJ while he was growing up. He is used to a seeing a woman who contains emotion. How long did he witness your husband's efforts to devalue and disrespect your needs?

At some point you should sit down with AJ and talk about what your life was like for you and just how much you had to contain displaying your emotions. You WERE ABUSED by AJ's father. I hope he didn't learn how to do some of that from your father unknowingly.
After all we are what we know.

No, you cannot interfere with AJ's relationships but you can have a mother son chat that may give him a different perspective on what he did see.

((((radio flyer)))) I am so sorry that you were married to a man that devalued and invalidated you so much.

Open Eyes

Thanks to all who corrected my feeble subject/tense disagreement. I feel better already. Mods, please delete if this gets in the way.

((((Elan)))),

If we all stand outside this thread and take another look at the opinions here we have to consider something else. We have to consider the landscape of where this question is taking place. The question comes from a woman that herself, lived in an abusive relationship with a male partner, along with her son who had witnessed some of this behavior. radio flyer is witnessing the fact that her son and his girlfriend are interacting in a manor that encourages anger and communications that serve to separate, instead of
join. So this scenario in itself displays some of the reasons for considering the individuals verses just an overall study of the differences between men and women.

When we think of perceptions regarding the differences between men and women, here in this thread the majority of the replies are from women and the majority are from women who were abused by men. And what are the male responses? Well, one from someone who admittedly has no empathy and another male who is empathetic. A mirror with no reflection of empathy, verses another mirror that does reflect empathy and emotionality. And then we also have to factor in what the two men here are responding to, responding to a question and expresssing their perceptions and it is important to consider what communication skills were expressed to them when they were growing up observing father/mother relations.

radio flyer there is a lot to learn from here. And you have expressed your own difficulty in establishing ways to finally think about expressing your own emotionalities that you were denied in your own male/female relationship.
Everyone should think about this thread on a different level, a personal one.
radio flyer, I have read many of your thoughts and questions about what your observing in the relationship your son is participating in. So far you have maintained the position of an observer and you input has stayed on the level of quiet suggestions. And AJ does have some frustration when it comes to understanding what a productive relationship really entails.

As I have suggested, perhaps you can find a way to sit with AJ and talk about what he has seen and learned and what might be behind it. It can give him food for thought about why he struggles and gets frustrated. Something is missing for both of you, by addressing it you both can learn. If AJ is going to progress beyond just feeling anger and frustration, he has to consider what he knows and what he has yet to learn and that he can learn, he is not just set in stone, and neither are you radio flyer. None of us are unless we choose to be.

I am a parent too and struggled in my relationship as well, and I am wondering what my daughter took from that. And last night she happened to come over and we did touch on the relationship factor and her challenges and I present food for thought for her by adding in my own struggles. My hope was for her to rethink what she learned from observing her parents that may be presenting difficulties for her that she may not be aware of. There are challenges presented just based on the fact that the brains of men and women are different, yes research has addressed that. And on top of that we are all unique and base our perceptions of what we all observed in our own parental relations.

Open Eyes

This thread is about Radio Flyer, her son and his GF. I don't think its fair to invalidate someones opinion just because of their affliction or lack of ability to feel empathy. A person like this, does have a valuable opinion because they can see things from a logical viewpoint, whereas emotions cloud our objectivity and logic. If a member is a delusional schizophrenic who thinks they have a valid contribution - should we say "your opinions not valid because you're incapable of relating to this subject"? If this subject is triggering then its better to avoid it. I don't see any offensive posts here, besides the ones that invalidate someone else's opinion. In addition this thread is about a women having too many emotions, not about men.

This whole men and women are different is a complicated subject. Yes there's differences and I'm glad there is. There's also men and women who don't fit into the typical male verses female manner of expressing emotions. TBH I would have a hard time understanding and dealing with AJ's GF too. When it gets down to the problem in communication, it's the individual person which needs to be considered not just their gender - their ego and all the baggage they're lugging around.

Open Eyes. Thank you...

To answer your question on how long AJ witnessed his father's treatment towards me, guess the answer would be when he was around 9 or 10. Odd.. my memories sorta flew out the window just now... Think it was when AJ was 9 or 10 when the separation began.. Funny how some memories just "fly in" and others "fly out the window".. lol.............ANyway AJ has seen and heard more than he should have. A chat about the yesterdays with AJ might just be a good idea..I just have to be careful because I don't want AJ to hate or have ill feelings towards his father.

This is prob off topic a bit.. Just thought I share what AJ said this morning...

When I don't want to be the one to be part of a decision that AJ has to make, I'd say, "the ball is in your court, it is your decision on what you choose to do"...

Is so true that our kids pick up things from their parents... AJ said those very words to me this morning... The ball is in your court, mom, your choice in what you do with it.. what can I can... lol

AJ had all these parts to computers and laptops and computer cords/plugs, you name it, he had it.. Dumped in boxes.. It blows me away when cords are all tangled and it takes hours to pull them apart, just to get that one cord you need. So I woud separate them, wind them up and put them in little baggies. Organize the little screws in one bag and big screws in other baggie.. Now when you needed a part to whatever you could see it in a baggie and just grab it, ready to use.. AJ laughted at me for doing it........................... Wasn't too long ago, AJ was sitting on the floor, separating cords and parts and putting them in little baggies .. lol What can I say... grins

The reason I posted this is , it is true, kids pick up words and ideas, reactions, whatever, from their parents... They pick up not only the good ideas, but the bad ones too. Parenting is one hard job.

(((((((((((((Radioflyer))))))))))))

Emotions are one of the many things which motivate someone to act.

I do express emotion, even when I don't experience said emotion.

My job is to determine how someone will act (and often manipulate them to act in a certain way). If I'm merely observing their actions, they've already acted, and I haven't done my job.

I don't get what you mean by that.

My demeanour and goal motivates whom?

A mirror that doesn't reflect? ... I do reflect emotion quite well when I choose to. I just can't "absorb" it; that is, take it into myself and vicariously experience it. But I do clearly understand how that emotion will affect the actions of another and how I could use that emotion for whatever purpose. You see... I have cognitive empathy (understanding by logical deduction). It's affective empathy which I lack (sharing the emotions of another and caring about them). AJ doesn't seem to be able to absorb the emotion either because he isn't empathizing or sympathizing with his girlfriend, nor does he seem to understand why she is emotional or how her emotions will affect her decisions and actions.

Again, how could I understand the motivations of another without understanding, if only on a superficial level, their emotions? Think about it... If you have absolutely no idea what someone is feeling, how could you deduce what actions they're going to take or what motivates them to take said actions?

Arguably, better.

If my perceptions were incorrect, I wouldn't be of much use at all in resolving their conflict.

Radio_flyer... Off topic, but is that in reference to the film?

Anyway... If you're interested, I think it might help AJ if you got him interested in People Watching. For the most part, it's just a fun hobby. But it's a way for someone to observe others and try to guess what they're feeling, the relationship between two or more people, or try to get a sense of their personality... It compels one to think outside oneself, and it allows one to explore the emotions of another. It might be good for him to also do this in his personal relationships; that is, take a step back and observe why the other person is doing what they're doing and what they're feeling.

Actually, I recommend this to all men who have trouble understanding women or dealing with emotions.

I also recommend listening to This Guy who is a genius among men. And he has a nice accent, which certainly doesn't hurt.

Thanks Michael the Great... The video on How TO Win Any Argument With Her is great. I'm going to email it to AJ.

Interesting idea, people watching and trying to guess what they are feeling. I will mention it to AJ.. I like the idea as in thinking outside oneself and ex ploring emotions of others..

Just to note that one eveing AJ came downstairs. He was rather proud of himself on one hand that he didn't "react" to his g/f's outbursts for 2 whole hours. Then he said he couldn't take it any longer and told her to "shut up". Which didn't make matters better. Told him telling her to "shut up" wasn't a good idea. This is where the video you posted would have helped AJ...
Thanks again

I think Dr. Frd. said something like: "Who can figure out a women." My wife would say the same thing about men.LOL

" I just can't "absorb" it; that is, take it into myself and vicariously experience it."~quote Michael the great.

Yes, that is exactly what I mean about the mirror. I was thinking about the mirror as absorbing emotion, not just mirroring affect of emotion.

The video you presented is exactly what I was trying to convey to you about how, no you don't absorb emotion. Whereas someone who is emotional does absorb the emotions just as discribed in this video. And if you noticed that man in the video is not talking about the actual meaning of the outbust of emotion. All he does is give possibles, but what he does do is exactly what I saying you do, he talked about "motivating" the woman into calming down and he offered some suggestions of calm wordage that "may" allow the woman to express the root of her outburst. Emotional capacity or not, we often have no way of knowing the route of emotional outbursts.

As a matter of fact no one knows why AJ's girlfriend is so emotional, I don't even think "she" knows why she is so emotional.

I have to say that I have outbusts with my husband, and my husband clearly absorbs my emotion and he reacts with the loudest body language I have ever seen in anyone, LOL even my therapist can see how loud his body language is. And when my husband reacts, body language and all it triggers me and makes me worse. Unfortunately for me that goes way back to when I was young and witnessed some very emotional, loud, disturbing body language between my brother and father and it did escalate to being physical and today that interaction would truely be considered child abuse.

I do get triggered when I see men fight because I witnessed so much of it and it was based on total misperceptions. While I am not sure, I believe my brother had ADHD and he was just considered a child with a behavior problem that needed to be addressed with constant punishment, which was physical, even in school. It had a devestating effect on him and a lot of built up stress was taken out on me. And when my brother got much bigger it didn't get any better he began fighting back, even provoking and I thought my father and brother were going to kill each other. I can see my brother throwing my father down the stairs like it was yesterday and that terror still haunts me in ways I could not have imagined.

You presented a solution here just as I had said you could.

Yes some women are emotional with motives, example, if I get upset he will give in and give me that dress I wanted to buy. But AJ doesn't do that as up until he was about 9 or 10 he never saw his father do that. He saw something completely different, constant invalidation of his mother and any emotions she could not hide. And he needs to know that on a conscious level so he can understand his difficulty with tolerating a very emotional woman. That is why I suggested radio flyer have some sit downs with AJ and discuss what he saw and even what it meant to her. And she agreed but remarked that it will have to be done carefully as to not disturb AJ's relationship with his father. That is a difficult scenario because if AJ gets it, he may begin to recognize his father's short comings anyway.

Now my only concern about the advice in that video is as I said there is a fine line between war and peace. Because if the actions suggested by that man are not done carefully, a woman my learn that an outburst will provide her with a dinner out. Then the outbursts would become a motive for the woman instead of an outburst that has a real root to a deeper problem. So AJ will have to learn that as well.

Open Eyes

Any time.

People watching is just a stepping stone to understand body language and that, however. If he does get interested, he might find books on body language helpful. They helped me quite a bit in poker games and interrogations.

By "didn't react," do you mean ignoring or stepping away from the argument? If so, I only recommend this if one absolutely cannot respond without flipping a b****. It could be taken as "silent treatment," which is a form of manipulation. A lot of the anti-psychopath and anti-narcissist gurus will tell you that "no contact" or "silent treatment" is thee absolute best way to react to outbursts or any type of negative behaviour. However, it usually only succeeds in pissing off whomever experiences it and worsening the relationship. And, just to clarify, I'm not implying that AJ's girlfriend is a narcissist. It was just the anti-narcissist gurus who coined the term "no contact," and it is now use it incessantly and applied to a number of dating tips. Actually, I think it was Sam Vaknin who coined it. Sam, who is, ironically, a narcissist.

He didn't react, meaning he pretty much tried to "ignore" her, ""the silent treatment" which in his eyes, he was stepping away from the situation. ANd you are right, it only pissed her off more and she kept going until she got a reaction.. On the other hand, she never lets it go. She just keeps going on and on and on and on and on.. Sometimes right up in his face.. Then he flips.... SO it would be wise in this type of situation for AJ to learn how to defuse her...or just leave the house for a few hours...

When AJ flips out for whatever reason, he can get pretty nasty and loud.. So they both have anger issues... AND an important step for both of them would be anger management therapy...I found a T close to when they both work.. Next step is making the appointment.. Guess somebody needs to make that appointment...

Does AJ's girlfriend have a therapist to talk to? If they both have anger issues then each of them should take an anger management course. They can also calmly discuss when they're not upset, how to diffuse arguments when things get out of hand. He can tell her he's not ignoring her when he's not reacting....but he just doesn't want to make it worse and is probably confused on what to do. Another good tip is they can both agree to taking a 'time out' - this doesn't mean walking out in a huff but agreeing to calm down and then talk. You can give them some 'fighting fairly' tips and these are good for anyone. It works best if they both follow them. Here's a link:

http://psychcentral.com/search/?Matc...airly&x=17&y=9

(((((radio flyer)))))

When I read your comments in the tread Daily comments, I can so relate to your frustration. I had to address a very similar scenario with my daughter and her boyfriend.
I even had to bear witness to my daughter struggling with her boyfriend when he was drunk and they argued and he wanted to drive away drunk. His keys to his car were missing and he was blaming her for taking them and she hadnt taken them but was searching for them all over the house in hopes he wouldn't find them and drive away drunk. I had to see my daughter so frightened and upset that she was shaking and throwing up. This situation just interrupted my evening very late, I had to work the next day, and it was out of hand, and in my face. And this is my daughter and the two of them were telling me to stay out of it but it was a bad situation involving my daughter. And it also triggered me severely because I had to deal with a drunken man (my husband) in my past and it was something I never wanted my daughter to deal with and I had tried to make her aware of staying away from that kind of man.

I can understand your challenge because this is your home and these issues are pretty much thrown into your environment and you have to watch. It is almost like another abuse on you because it is being in an upsetting environment like what you lived along with a message that you somehow had to ignore your emotions about it.

Radio, it is almost like your son is with a partner just like you were that has deep anger issues and takes it out on others. The more you describe this young woman the more it looks like she is abusing, and I think she has to get to the bottom of where this is all coming from. And I am concerned that AJ may be learning what you had to live through, find ways to surpress his feelings when she acts up and as you describe, she doesn't stop and goes on and on and on.

Do you see AJ provoking it or is he just struggling to deal with her? It is one thing to work on anger in a relationship, but if one partner is truely disturbed and has some deep underlying issue, than it is not fair for AJ to have to manage her. If your own marriage relationship has taught you anything, actually both of you, it is not fair or healthy for anyone to have to be a punching bag because of someone else's deep issues or some kind of disorder. And my feelings on this matter are for you and AJ and getting to the truth rather than finding ways to service or behave around someone who has issues and is an abusive person.

Open Eyes

Hi Lynn... It can get a tad confusing around here. I suggested to both of them when the arguments start to get out of hand to either leave the house for awhile or she could go to her parents or even sleep in the spare room. A few times AJ did leave the house for several hours and it did work.. But that was when she started things. She won't leave the house when he starts things.. When either thinks they are right, they won't budge an inch.. Not sure if they even have "calmly discuss" in their vocabulary... They both expect the other to always apologize. Gosh, they'd be apologizing l0 times a day...

EXample... Last night they went shopping after the basketball game..Guess when they were paying for their items, his g/f was chatten with the check out girl.. She commented on that AJ bought his mother something on Craigslist and I guess the way she said it, AJ "felt" it made him look cheap.. ANd he told her just that... ANd she went off... like WHAT! Insisting she didn't make him look cheap... yadayada yada...And she said she didn't understand why he'd think that... SO when AJ said it made him feel bad what she said, she got all pissy.... Thing is "she makes 2 1/2 times more money than AJ, She can shop and does shop without ever looking at the price... Whereas AJ is always shopping for good deals.. He isn't cheap.. But he doesn't blow his money away like she does...

Think what the underline problem here is... OH I wasn't at the store with them,...AJ told me what happened... AJ buys things for me when he sees something he thinks I might need esp when it is at a super great price.. And it seems she gets upset when he buys things for me.. Don't want to say that nasty word "jealous" but there it is.. AJ said it seems she gets jealous when he buys things for me.....Is odd because she makes tons of money that it doesn't even make sense she'd be upset that AJ would buy anything for me... But she does get a bit "pissy" when he does..

Thanks for the reply radio flyer. Since she's been living at the house for a while now, normally she would be expected to help out with the house expenses. If she's living there for free and has money, she should help out. Good thing AJ's not a spender like she is - they would both be in debt lol. I agree she shouldn't really discuss that AJ bought you something on Craigslist. She also shouldn't be jealous of him buying you anything.

House e xpenses is another one.. lol.... She doesn't like paying part of the utilities.. During the summer, at night she'd turn the ac down to 65 degrees and the electric bill was high.. She'd fuss over the electric bill.. A few times she paid part of the bill, but the way she sees it, she pays alll the bills .. which is in her dreams... She is good at making herself look good...She is very good with words, as she should be, because she writes proposals for a living.......I don't think she likes paying utilities as she has made comments to me that her last boyfriend paid everything and she wasn't used to paying utilities.. Told her she has come to the wrong place because AJ just started working and he isn't in the position to be paying all their expenses.. She'd say her last boyfriend bought her diamonds.. I told her it will be awhile before AJ could afford to be buying her diamonds.. Seemed like she was hinting she wanted e xpensive gifts.. lol Told her she was looking at the wrong person, being AJ, because he is just starting out...

((((((((open eyes )))))))) ummm AJ is no angel either.. even in his mama's eyes.. smile ... Guess the bottom line is AJ has "anger issues" and his g/f has "issues".. They both could benefit from therapy......

AJ's dad, I don't think he had anger issues. He was just controlling.. He controlled everything and we had to walk his way. Everything was always "his" way....His abusive ways towards me was a way to control me and everything around him.. I don't know if that is anger or just controlling?

AM sorry you experienced abuse in your past relationship. Guess that is why you seem to understand me...You are even going through a lot now and yet you can still reach out to others.. Big hugs to you... Kind of sounds like your daughter's b/f is like AJ when they drink..?? Isn't good at all... and your daughter should not have to go through those traumatic events when he drinks.. I've said the very same thing to AJ's g/f...

When AJ drinks hard alcohol he is a total jerk.. He is the type of person that should never drink the hard stuff.. He is ok and mellow with beer and wine, but give him vodka or whisky and he becomes a different person... And recently they have been going to the clubs on weekends.. Which means AJ has been drinking the hard alcohol, which means this is another issue on top of all the other issues they both have.. For 5 months there was no alcohol involved.. Is starting again and I mentioned to both of them that they should find other things for entertainment than going to clubs...

Sounds like a big mess here.. doesn't it.. The calm at this point is AJ's g/f doesn't stay here during the week. She has dinner or goes to the gym with AJ every night and goes home. Weekends she stays here... Which is working out really great..

THEY both need thera py....I found a T that works with couples and anger managemnt. Maybe I should just make the appointment for them...

OH.. I should add... AJ has come a long way since he's been working. He has grown in many ways. And since his g/f doesn't stay here during the week, it seems she and aj are less stressed. The argument at the store was just a petty one.. hurt feelings and a few harsh words.. it didn't escalate into a big fight... It would have if she stayed here last night tho... The issues aren't being solved with her going home through the week.. Just gives them space. And again, they both have "issues" and they can't solve their issues on their own...Talking about therapy doesn't help... Guess we need to put some action into our words..

wow.. i can't believe i wrote/said all of the above.. i surprise even myself..

(((radio flyer)))

You didn't say too much, your just thinking, that is ok. You have a lot going on and it can be hard to know how much you can get involved. I can see your trying to bite your tongue, it must be hard.

Well there were a lot of suggestions in your thread, hope it helped and gave you some ideas. Hope you don't feel so alone with this now.

Sigh, some of our children just have to learn the hard way. That is what my husband keeps telling me. My daughter moved out of the house and her and her boyfriend live together in a house her boyfriend has bought. My daughter doesn't have her name on the house and reminds him that she can leave and he would be stuck with all the bills. She actually stopped over to check on the pony and we got to talk. Sigh, I listened to her making efforts to the relationship, I at least got to plant some seeds for thought and tell her I hope she learned from the good I did and my mistakes as well. I worked very hard at my marriage, did my best to keep my family together, her father did a lot of growing up. I hope I didn't teach her that is what she is supposed to do too. It seems your dammed if you do and dammed if you dont.

I have been thinking about having my husband watch that link that Michael posted. I do get angry, but I don't have motives, I am just triggered to rage sometimes. My husband kinda provokes me and makes it worse, but that is when I get to see where the root is, the rage gets bad and the root pops out and surprises me. I had no idea I had some of these issues locked so deep inside me. That is why I asked some probing questions I was just wondering where some of the anger your seeing is coming from.

Hope your son can get to the anger management therapy. Let us know how you make out.

Open Eyes