correlation cig.smoking and mental illness

sewerrats · Oct 12, 2011, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheByzantine

So then we are to believe progress is being made by allowing consumers to pick their poison?

We may choose to stay away from medications because there is some evidence placebos are more helpful than the real thing and without the side effects or worse.

Cigarettes help schizophrenics who chain smoke to feel better on their way to asthma, emphysema, oxygen tanks and cancer. Alcohol too provides a temporary respite on the way to cirrhosis of the liver, relationship and employment problems.

My epiphany for the day.

stoping smokeing after years useually lead,s to a massive weight increase, then killing you with a heart attack.

Oct 12, 2011, 01:09 PM

No weight gain. Just a lot healthier.

sewerrats · Oct 12, 2011, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheByzantine

No weight gain. Just a lot healthier.

you are very very lucky not to gain weight as your taste buds return.

Oct 12, 2011, 03:17 PM

Could be I payed attention to what I ate and exercised.

buddhablessd · Oct 12, 2011, 04:07 PM

I never said cigs were "The" cause of mental illness, just that the correlation is there and should be taken into account in the healthcare and personal setting. Clearly all psychological problems are not caused by any particular substance. And yes, substance abuse is more dominant in unstable people.

buddhablessd · Oct 12, 2011, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fresia

Buddhablessd,
I am so sorry to hear about your friend's situation. I don't know if you are still in contact but hope she is doing better now. I know how hard that is to watch someone go through and the support in invaluable but self-preservation is important too.

I am curious about the study you mentioned seeing. Cigs are toxic and addictive, no doubt. The tobacco companies count on it. As far as its connection with the percentage of the mental health population begin singled out for users vs the general population, I don't know about this connection being made and would have to see the studies. It is addictive for all of the population no matter.

----------------
In response to the other posts:

ANY substance, ANY!, put in the body can have harmful effects and why it is important to do your research, work closely with your physician, and monitor any changes that occur while on it.

Some substances have more addictive qualities than others changing neural pathways leaving an imprint, and a need for that substance. Nicotine is a primary example of this, it replaces the natural substances causing the brain to make less of its own. In time, leaving a deficit that only the stimulant can make up until a long period of absence can regenerate itself. AD's typically do not have this same permanent altering of the neural pathway, as the chemicals were not there to begin with, and why, though there may be an elimination/detoxifying period coming off of it, there are not the cravings for it afterward. In time, all of the pathways can be changed, even with addictions, and can be overcome to alter the the cravings and change the brain's chemistry, though not easy.

If there is a chemistry deficit to begin with such as with depression, then this is merely a need to compensate for what is already missing. This is not considered 'addiction'. AD's are not habit-forming and unless it is the wrong med for you, you are taking ag/ med advice, or illegally, but it is typically not harmful (unless it is the wrong one) until you find the right one and this takes time usually; but it is not addiction. Just because they are used regularly does make them habit-forming in this context; taking them daily is a habit that forms, but not a habit-forming need.

Definition of ADDICTION (Merriam -Webster)
1: the quality or state of being addicted <addiction to reading>
2: compulsive need for and use of a habit-forming substance (as heroin, nicotine, or alcohol) characterized by tolerance and by well-defined physiological symptoms upon withdrawal; broadly : persistent compulsive use of a substance known by the user to be harmful

Thanks for that. No I lost contact, and cannot remember the exact publication, which around 2000, but It make clear to me the correlation.

sewerrats · Oct 13, 2011, 03:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheByzantine

Could be I payed attention to what I ate and exercised.

Again that is cool you motivated yourself, but it is one of the main reason a lot of women smoke, they have a cig instead of food to stay slim.food the comforter an cigs the comforter, stop the cigs then food become the main comfort sorce, taste bud,s you never new you had return . The only problem with smokeing to stay slim, is your body an face age at a faster rate. look at top models like kate moss never has a cig out her mouth to kerb the hunger.

Oct 13, 2011, 04:00 AM

Quote:

The only problem with smokeing to stay slim, is your body an face age at a faster rate. look at top models like kate moss never has a cig out her mouth to kerb the hunger.

I doubt asthma, emphysema or lung cancer take into account the reasons for smoking.

sewerrats · Oct 13, 2011, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheByzantine

I doubt asthma, emphysema or lung cancer take into account the reasons for smoking.

True, but these illness,s are not just caused by smokeing, made worse i agree. Im not you typical smoker i dont smoke cigs , but when fishing twice a week i spark up a cigar or 2 of the minuture kind. Why??? because it just feel,s right an i enjoy them to a point of bliss. I have no addiction an dont even think about a cigar at any other time, it,s just one of life,s little pleasure,s to me like drinking. So long as you dont bathe in booze its fine by me. I dont use booze or smokes as a comfort blanket,ok they may kill me but im past worrying about any pleasures that are a risk. After years of meds an benzo,s ,numourous operation,s an hospital stays WTF

buddhablessd · Oct 13, 2011, 03:38 PM

nothing wrong with that man, as they say, Im not mad at you bro. BB

Oct 13, 2011, 04:40 PM

" A lot of people with SA or other mental illnesses ,"

sewerrats...are you using SA in referring to sexual abuse? if so i take offense...i am an abuse survivor...who by definition has a diagnosis of mental illness. the abuse itself was NOT a mental illness...i did not inflict it upon myself...

would you consider a child abuse victim mentally ill? rape victim?

if i misread your post then i apologize..but if i didn't i feel an explanation would be appreciated. there is enough stigma attatched to childhood sexual abuse without it being considered a mental illness.

stumpy

Caretaker Leo · Oct 13, 2011, 05:59 PM

buddhablessd,

Forgive me for being confused here and hope you will clarify.

You wrote that "(you)saw on the wall an article from the new england journal of med. of the findings of studies on tobacco users and mental illness. The statistics and chemical findings were indisputable."

What were the actual findings??? Could you provide the web address for the article so we can read it if we would like?

Did the NEJ find that people who suffer with MH issues are more likely to smoke - or that smoking causes MH issues?

There is a huge difference between saying smoking "causes" versus smoking is frequently the "result of" MH issues.

Thanks in advance.

sewerrats · Oct 14, 2011, 03:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stumpy

" A lot of people with SA or other mental illnesses ,"

sewerrats...are you using SA in referring to sexual abuse? if so i take offense...i am an abuse survivor...who by definition has a diagnosis of mental illness. the abuse itself was NOT a mental illness...i did not inflict it upon myself...

would you consider a child abuse victim mentally ill? rape victim?

if i misread your post then i apologize..but if i didn't i feel an explanation would be appreciated. there is enough stigma attatched to childhood sexual abuse without it being considered a mental illness.

stumpy

S A

social anxierty ,not sexual abuse

Oct 14, 2011, 10:11 AM

my bad...i apologize

stumpy

buddhablessd · Oct 14, 2011, 10:14 AM

This happened maybe 10 yrs. ago. The article, date, and exact publication eludes me, but I am sure, with research, (google etc) It can be found. Almost positive it was N.E.J.M.

BB

Oct 14, 2011, 11:49 AM

Smoking and Mental Illness — Breaking the Link

http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp1105248

Ygrec23 · Oct 14, 2011, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheByzantine

Smoking and Mental Illness — Breaking the Link

http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp1105248

Excellent article, Byz.

Caretaker Leo · Oct 14, 2011, 07:11 PM

Now that I've read the link Byz provided - the correlation is not that mental illness is caused by smoking, but rather, many people who have MH issues also smoke. In some cases those people have been told that smoking could actually help them; in others quitting is not the most important thing to be concerned about.

sewerrats · Oct 15, 2011, 05:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caretaker Leo

Now that I've read the link Byz provided - the correlation is not that mental illness is caused by smoking, but rather, many people who have MH issues also smoke. In some cases those people have been told that smoking could actually help them; in others quitting is not the most important thing to be concerned about.

To true in real mental illness , any relief is a blessing , your not bothered if it kills you , your aready feel dead in you mind state. Sparking up for some relief an getting the hit they need keeps them alive, take it away an what then , these people arent interested in exersise an healthy eating ,they want to feel chilled. Its always the one that have given up that bang on about the danger,s , something that slipped there mind when on 60 a day. Smokeing is popular in the mentally ill because its another crutch for there miserable lives , an why not i say, its no worse than the meds we take.

Oct 15, 2011, 06:07 AM

The myths:

Five prevailing myths have contributed to continuing tobacco use among people with mental illness. The first is that tobacco is necessary self-medication for the mentally ill. The tobacco industry has fostered this belief by funding research and presentations on the self-medication hypothesis, supporting opposition to the JCAHO smoking ban, publishing articles in the lay press, and marketing cigarettes to people with mental illness.2

Nicotine is a powerful reinforcing drug that transiently enhances concentration and attention, regardless of the smoker's mental health status. But it has proved ineffective as an adjunctive treatment for mental disorders (e.g., depression, schizophrenia, and attention-deficit disorder), possibly because of the rapid decrease in drug response with repeated exposure. The reality is that tobacco is another problem, not a solution.

Myth number two is that people with mental illness are not interested in quitting smoking. Research argues otherwise: studies involving patients recruited from outpatient and inpatient psychiatric settings suggest that they are about as likely as the general population to want to quit smoking.1 In the United States, 20 to 25% of smokers report that they intend to quit smoking in the next 30 days, and another 40% say they intend to do so in the next 6 months. Furthermore, among smokers with mental illness, readiness to quit appears to be unrelated to the psychiatric diagnosis, the severity of symptoms, or the coexistence of substance use.

The third myth is that mentally ill people cannot quit smoking. Although treating tobacco dependence is challenging, several randomized treatment trials and systematic reviews involving smokers with mental illness have documented that success is possible. With a stepped-care intervention tailored to depressed smokers' readiness to quit, a 25% abstinence rate at 18-month follow-up was achieved — a rate significantly higher than that in the group that received usual care (advice to quit and referrals for help doing so) and similar to cessation rates in the general population.1 A cessation intervention integrated into treatment for post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD) doubled patients' odds of quitting.3 And a meta-analysis of seven randomized controlled trials involving smokers with schizophrenia revealed a nearly threefold increase in abstinence rates 6 months after treatment among those who used bupropion.4

Fourth, many people believe that quitting smoking interferes with recovery from mental illness, eliminating a coping strategy and leading to decompensation in mental health functioning. Five randomized tobacco-treatment trials in patients concurrently receiving mental health treatment have found that smoking cessation did not exacerbate depression or PTSD symptoms or lead to psychiatric hospitalization or increased use of alcohol or illicit drugs.1

Finally, some argue that smoking, which is perceived as having distal effects, is the lowest-priority concern for patients with acute psychiatric symptoms. Yet people with psychiatric disorders are far more likely to die from tobacco-related diseases than from mental illness. Smokers know tobacco use has deadly consequences and expect health care professionals to intervene. Indeed, raising the issue of tobacco use with patients enhances the rapport between patients and clinicians.

There is growing evidence that smokers with mental illness are as ready to quit as other smokers and can do so without any threat to their mental health recovery. Evidence supports the use of most recommended cessation treatments in smokers with mental illness (see tableRecommended Treatments for Tobacco Dependence and the Evidence Base for Use in Smokers with Mental Illness.) http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp1105248

Downside of medications:

While taking medication for mental illness has plenty of positives, it can have negative aspects. The side effects associated with many of these medications can be excessive. Nausea, headaches, dry mouth, blurry vision, trembling, increased nightmares, and exhaustion are all relatively common when taking medication for mental illness. These drugs can also cause more serious health issues such as blurred vision, speech issues, hyperglycemia, diabetes, and recurring black-outs. Some antidepressants, antipsychotics, and mood stabilizers can also increase the tendency towards suicidal thoughts and actions. Anti-anxiety medications also pose the risk of dependency issues, making the close monitoring of their usage very important.

Especially when it comes to any type of antidepressant, medications for mental illness often do not work for those with mild cases. A study in 2006 found that those suffering from mild-to-moderate depression only received little more than a placebo effect from taking antidepressants. In fact, the study found that only 50% of these cases actually benefited from taking the drugs.

Other medication for mental illness may also have these drawbacks. For many patients, it can take months or even years to find the correct prescription and dosage for their specific issue. These medications have helped a large number of people improve their mental health, however. When prescribed by an experienced medical professional and monitored closely, these drugs can have a significant effect on a patient's life. http://www.wisegeek.com/what-are-the...al-illness.htm

I suppose some may view the choice as picking their poison. For me, the medications helped a lot more than the cigarettes, despite the side effects. What others do is their choice and we may agree to disagree.

sewerrats · 12:17 PM

WOW that was quite a post , but please let me blow most of that out the water. First i never thought of mental patient,s smokeing an being targeted by tabacco companies, i never seen posters saying if your nuts smoke it will help. Listen to this, in England smokeing is banned from hospitals an even the grounds they stand on, but for 1 exception, you got it the mental unit. They at my mental hospital have the own garden area where they can smoke all day,an there is no shortage of doctor,s an nurses willing to stand outside with a sectioned patient so they can grab a cig. When starting medication, they tell you not to drink alchol an you carnt drink in hospital, nobody say,s you carnt smoke. No doctor giveing meds to a metally ill patient will tell them to stop smokeing , FACT,the number of doctor,s an nurse,s that smoke are as great as mental patients, doctors are also well known to drink a lot to combat stress an have the highest suicide rates of all prosession,s FACT. All the people that say they want to quit , most dont FACT, you may have smoked a lot in you life i dont know i never have, only the odd cigar i can take or leave them , but there is a feel good factor i must admit. Now the difference over meds an cig,s , probuably more chance of meds killing you than cig,s, what with liver damage , organ faliure, obese, suicide an sex impotence, Yes the 2 main down sides of meds are enough to make anyone smoke an drink FACT,meds kill your sex drive an make you fat long term , people on meds for years will carry at least 20lbs of med weight, not all but most, FACT. sex goes out the window with your marriage if on a high dose of meds,just think your 25 year,s old an carnt have sex with your wife. cig,s decrease your sex to but not a massive degree like meds, an whats the first thing a couple who smoke do after sex???? you got it spark up a cig to carry on the feel good factor. Personally i think the are a lot of stressed up low leveled depressives out there that need cig,s to function, me myself who dont really smoke would love to think i could smoke 30 cig,s a day an get rid of all my shrink meds instead. The side effects of meds out weigh the side effects of smokeing FACT. They both end in death , but which kill,s you first is a lottery.

Oct 15, 2011, 11:45 AM

Your opinion is noted again. Opinions are not facts; just one person's subjective perception.

As I said, we can agree to disagree.

sewerrats · Oct 15, 2011, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheByzantine

Your opinion is noted again. Opinions are not facts; just one person's subjective perception.

As I said, we can agree to disagree.

correct i agree , opinion,s are varied but interesting, to discuss them is even more interesting

buddhablessd · Oct 15, 2011, 01:01 PM

thanks for that;

Not only insightfull, but funny as hell. BB correlation cig.smoking and mental illness

Travelinglady · Oct 15, 2011, 01:02 PM

Wow, I didn't anticipate such a debate when I clicked on this thread. I refuse to get into any "arguments" over the matters such as the nature of addiction, etc.

I can say from personal observation that most mentally-ill people I've ever been hospitalized with are smokers. I have always been a rare exception.

However, the last mental hospital I was in did NOT allow smoking. They would have allowed it, I was told, but since they were connected literally to a regular hospital with a "no smoking" policy, they also had to have it.

Patients were encouraged to use nicotine patches. Some of them availed themselves of this opportunity. I also know that Wellbutrin is sometimes given to help in the smoking cessation process, but I don't know if it was offered as well.

The smokers were NOT happy. In fact, someone was able to sneak cigarettes in and a lighter was stolen from the ward. Evidently an underground smoking group developed. One new patient told me she had been offered the chance for a few puffs. (She declined.) Of course, the smoke could be detected and the loss of the lighter was noted. The whole place was searched and all the patients were strip-searched. The lighter was found....

Of course, no one should smoke. I've had two dear friends who died of throat cancer, both only in their sixties. And, as the excellent articles provided here have pointed out, smoking is even worse on people with mental illness.

That said, here are people who are at crisis points in their disorders--having to have been hospitalized--and then they are also expected to give up smoking while there. Of course, it's an excellent time for them to do so, since they will be forced to quit. However, I fully believe that the hospitals MUST make bigger efforts to work with these people in their efforts to quit. What? Support groups maybe. Teaching alternatives to smoking that help to fulfill whatever needs smoking met. And so on. (Those of you who have quit would be able to suggest more concrete ideas than I can, since it's a non-issue for me.)

At any rate, that's my take on the deal. Yes, it's based on my own observations. But so be it.

An excellent thread topic! Thanks for it!

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