[ncguynva]

Do PD's all of a sudden take over or is it a gradual thing? Or does it depend? I am asking more and more questions bc it seems my wife had some of the symptoms of HPD/NPD and then within a month or so it was full blown

[Sannah]

My thoughts... people with PD's do not have flexible problem solving skills so stressors would make things worse....

[ncguynva]

makes sense

[Kendyll]

Mine comes and goes. I can be fine, be fine, be fine, be a nut-bar, be fine...

[ncguynva]

is there a trigger or something for when your PD comes out? or dos it find its way out at different times?

[Kendyll]

My PD slips out in different ways for different reasons. Some expressions have a definitive trigger but there are others that still seems to come out of the blue. There may well be a trigger, but I haven't figured it out yet.

When I'm doing well - eating and sleeping regularly, taking my meds and doing my therapy stuff - I have far fewer outbreaks. When I get off-track with that stuff, it's much easier for me to flare up. The more off-balance I am, the more i react and the more off-balance I get, so I react more and get further off-balance...nasty little spin cycle there.

It can be hard to pick up on my triggers. I can get set off by things that a "normal" person wouldn't even notice. Fear of abandonment is a classic trigger, but i can feel "abandoned" by something as simple as you running up to the store without saying anything to me about it. Heck - even if you DO tell me you're running to the store - if you aren't home in a "reasonable" amount of time, I can think that you've already left me. My BF noticed when we started dating that I would follow him from room to room. Some of that (for me) was a "fear" that he wouldn't come back. That's an "object constancy" thing - if you aren't right here in front of me, then you weren't real to begin with.

Even to the same trigger, my reaction can vary from day to day. One day, I'll be angry. Another day, I'll be scared and crying. Another day, I won't even notice. The next day I'll be all sweet trying to make it up to you. After that I'll blow up some more. All valid responses, all genuine! But different responses depending on how the triggers hit me.

No, this doesn't make any sense. I can tell you about it and see how crazy this sounds, but this IS how my brain can work.
Abandonment is big.
Betrayal/dishonesty is big.
Attempts to control me are big.
Indifference can be big.
It's all about which threat my brain perceives today.

[Sannah]

Kendyll, it sounds like you have done a lot of work and that your ability to understand yourself more and more is what has brought more stability. Good work!

[Beth1957]

Originally Posted by Kendyll

<snip>
No, this doesn't make any sense. I can tell you about it and see how crazy this sounds, but this IS how my brain can work.
Abandonment is big.
Betrayal/dishonesty is big.
Attempts to control me are big.
Indifference can be big.
It's all about which threat my brain perceives today.

You've just about hit the nail on the head for me there too Kendyll. My adaptation to the abandonment issue is however very tied up with the object constancy thing, so I'll grieve/be angry very fiercely for a comparatively short time, then bottle it up & the "unreal-ness" of the person takes over in my mind, which helps me cope with the crippling emotions.
It's an odd one, because I can be seen as very uncaring...

[ncguynva]

Now I feel bad about what I am doing, bc it seems she is really afraid of being abandoned....but so many lies....alot of pain...and she doesnt want to talk about the lies bc it causes her to go into a panic attack. she claims she still loves me and that is what confuses the heck outta me.

[whoarewe]

The DSM IV states that pds generally become manifest in late adolescence or early twenties. My male family member with a pd was actually symptomatic his whole life.

[Kendyll]

One of the diagnostic criteria for BPD is

frantic efforts to avoid real or imagined abandonment.

I don't KNOW anything, but maybe...that could be what a lot of the lies are.I mean, if she tells you the truth, you might get angry and leave her. If she lies to you, maybe, maybe, maybe you won't find out and you'll stay. But if you want to talk about her lying, then "for sure" you're going to leave her(!) - so let's not even talk about that...

I can certainly believe that she loves you very much - to the best of her ability. I throw that part in there because for a long time I didn't really understand what love could be, and I wasn't very good at it. I meant it when I said it and I felt it wholeheartedly, but that love was all wrapped up in some twisted thinking, self-centered fear and all the other dysfunctions I lived every day.

Even harder if you aren't physically with her. If she's anything like me...y'know that "object constancy" idea? It's like Beth said - unrealness. As if you just aren't really real when you're not in contact. It's not about not CARING. It really is as if you don't exist or you're some story we made up or some half-dream, half-memory.

I'm not saying what's she's doing is right.
I'm not saying that she's got any "good excuse".
I'm not saying that you should tolerate it.

But in the context of a PD, it adds up to its own twisted kind of sense.

[ncguynva]

I told her not to hang out with guys until I can get comfortable with her doing it. Obviously I cannot do it while I am here in Iraq and she is there in VA. So I told her three things to do while I am here- 1. Continue School 2. Continue therapy 3. Stay away from guys (physically....calling....yahoo messenger/aim/ phone is ok but no physical contact)

If she was so scared about me leaving her.....why do what I asked her not to do?

Also it means that she cannot be a military wife. Nothing bad, not all women can do it though. It is hard enough on family's without PD's, let alone a young wife that possibly has one.

[Rapunzel]

The military is a hard life. I grew up in a military family and that might be part of why I have personality disorders.

Personality disorders are long-term, tending to show up by young adulthood and sometimes mellowing out in middle age. But they definitely can be triggered into showing up. Because we keep it under control when stressors are manageable, but can easily get pushed over that threshold where it gets out of control, and can be hard to get back under control when that happens.

[ncguynva]

Originally Posted by Rapunzel

Because we keep it under control when stressors are manageable, but can easily get pushed over that threshold where it gets out of control, and can be hard to get back under control when that happens.

How long can that take? generally speaking?

[Rapunzel]

How long it takes to get it back under control depends on so many things. If the stressors are ongoing, it probably will take some reduction in things causing stress. It also depends on the support and the skills for coping that each person has. Therapy for personality disorders can take several years for the person to learn to accept who they are, why they are that way, and learn how to change and manage symptoms even during the hard times.

Everybody is different. I tend to have crises that can last 1 week, 3 weeks, 6 weeks, etc. when triggered. For some people it blows over in an hour or less. I've been to eight different therapists, and have been with the current one for 4 years and have at least a year to go. I think I deal with things okay most of the time, but I just lost my job and I think it was mostly them, but they blame me and I'm not entirely sure.

So, depending on the person, it can take hours, weeks, years, depending on how thorough and how triggered and how much support and what coping skills they have.