[dottie]

Has anyone here ever felt that they were being judged or viewed by our world (friends or family too) as morally deficient?

~Dottie

[kerria]

Yes. All the time- by my medical drs that are treating me for chronic pain, also in ERs almost every time that i have had to go with a bad migraine. They almost never believe me and think i'm seeking drugs.

It's morally wrong to go to therapy according to most of my family and persons at church- why i would never tell them.

Filing for SS disability was horrific, we've been waiting five years and am not looking forward to the hearing when and if it ever comes. i'm positive that they will make me look like the worst person that ever lived and i've never been arrested for anything in my life. As for a drug seeker, i've never been addicted to drugs of any kind and don't drink or smoke. It's the mental health diagnosis.

i hate to be me,
kerria

[dottie]

Yes...there really is a stigma placed upon us. E.R.: ohhhhh yeahhhhh!Now...if we had -say-a form of cancer...or any other health condition...it would most likely be different. It downright stinks!

~Dottie

[MacD]

I don't think there's a soul in this world who hasn't felt judged in a moral sense at one time or another....but what you know to be the truth is more important....unfortunately, those who consider themselves to be the most "moral" seem to forget that biblical verse.." Judge not that ye be not judged"...and they magically remember all other verses....love G

[krzyk101]

In my situation, the intolerance of my own family in regards to 'morals' in which they, especially the most important person in my life to date, my Mother, has added to my emotional illness and new emotional problems continue to date over her belief of sexuality.

I love my Mother more than everything in the world, only 16-years ago she made it very clear that my sexuality was 'one of the things we do not talk about'. The result of PTSD and Abuse never being able to speak of when occured years ago as well as all the aspects of my life 'not talked about' When I needed her, she has always been there with this exception. I can never be open and honest with my Mom, she has made that decision. Causing me to have years of supressed emotion's of distress.

[dottie]

Good post! That's so true.

~Dottie

[vanna123]

Difficult question! I know that some of the things I was forced to do as a young child were absolutely morally wrong.
I today struggle with those things I have done and know that if I could just forgive myself for them a lot of my current problems would dissipate.
the people who forced us to do such horrendous acts were evil people in my opinion but could they have been mentally ill as well?

[dottie]

I went thru the Social Socurity turnstile myself. Keep your hopes up. It will probably go thru following the meeting with the Aministrative Law Judge.

I got bad driving directions to the hearing office..& therefore was about 45 minutes late for the hearing. The judge was irrirated with me..however I had a good lawyer. I also called and said I would be late as i was lost.

It was like a mini-courtroom setting. Here are a few things that help ya win your case. Sticking with it & not giving in. Getting a high profile attorney. Any hospitalizations. Very important. I was hospitalized for suicidal ideation. I had a terrific migraine..went to ER. Demoral did nothing. however..they did get my vomitting stopped. But...I was sooo darn frustrated with the headaches and the total indiference of the staff. ( They thought I was faking.)~ Oh right!!!!!!!~I threatened to take my life..if the pain continued. I mean...I lost it!I also had 2 catscans. Plus...their own SSA Doctors were on my side..and said that I could not work any longer!

It's a circus. You just have to play the game. Seriously!

Good Luck to you!!!!

~Dottie

[Perzephone]

I think, especially in American society where there is a heavy emphasis placed on having a workaholic work ethic, anything that interferes w/a person's ability to be ultra-productive, be it chronic pain or depression or social anxiety, is looked down upon.

A lot of times I look down on myself because the depression has stripped me of all ambition & motivation. I can't formulate or achieve goals and a lot of days it's a major struggle just to take a shower, eat & force myself to go to work. I know in my heart-of-hearts that a sabbatical would probably be very healing for me, but I can't afford to take the time off. I also hate myself for being weak enough to seek outside help - I hate being needy.

My supervisors at work think I'm a slacker because when I have spare time at work, I'm not multi-tasking - they don't understand that on most nights, it's an almost physical effort to make myself simply stay at work. My in-laws think I'm stubborn and lazy because I 'refuse to improve myself'... but they don't understand that it's not because I don't want to improve myself, but because 90% of the time, I can't. I can't work more hours or three jobs, go to school and keep the house in pristine Martha Stewart condition all at the same time. My sisters think I'm selfish and self-centered as well as lazy because I can't work, go to school, keep my house clean and be a social butterfly/free babysitter... my friends think I don't love them anymore because I can't set my life aside to support them through pregnancies and marriage troubles... to all of them, there's nothing wrong with me except for my 'self-centeredness'. And none of them have the patience to listen to me on my dark nights of the soul - they'd rather call me & use me as a shoulder to cry on about their woes and what a lousy person I am...

[lalo53]

all the time

[demolitionlover]

My family think i'm lousy and lazy.

[shadowdancer]

mine too for the most part. it varies though. my mom seems to think that meds will solve everything and 'fix' me back to being her perfect daughter....everyone else seems to act like it's some sort of disease you can catch just by thinking about it. so no one ever mentions shadow and her 'problems' i really can't stand small-minded people.

it's like one of my fav songs says, that i posted in psychotherapy forum:

"And when I talk about therapy, I know what people think
That it only makes you selfish and in love with your shrink
But oh how I loved everybody else
When I finally got to talk so much about myself"

so i just try to keep that in mind when they act like i'm some kind of social pariah for being in therapy and on meds. i know they think it is because i just won't 'get over it' and i want to 'be selfish' and all that... i just try to ignore them. anyone have any luck doing that? cause i'm not.

-shadow

[kerria]

(((((((shadow)))))))))

No, it's hard not to care about how our family feels about us. They are the only family that we have.

As if things weren't hard enough already.
Take care,
kerria

[dottie]

Hello! I, for one, feel so darn labeled, as a derelict, lazy,outta control individual. I am none of those things, however...I am being shut out of so much of society. The most hurtful thing in the world is being turned away by members of your own family because they fear that society will label THEM if they have anything to do with you. It's so medieval.

We are supposed to be such an "enlightened" country. Like I said, so many have medieval views of mental illness. (((big scream)))!!!!!!!!!!!!!

~Dottie

[h0kie]

I think depression is starting to be more accepted because it is being more frequently diagnosed. However, "other" mental illnesses still have the stigma, some worse than others.

I/we learned very quickly when a phsycian asked why my husband took Zoloft and Seroquel to say, "Depression". Never "depression and dissociation". The looks on their faces when I/we said dissociation made all his credibility fly right out the window. And these are DOCTORS. It is sad really.

[kerria]

i've found the stigma associated with dissociation/trauma disorders/DID so overwhemling also.

It makes me wonder if anything is worth it at all- if all the pain of therapy, losing credibility and the terrible isolation from our family, friends and society is worth surviving.
After everything we have to go through- there is nothing and no one left to get better for.

why we live with despair besides all these things.

Is the rejection worth it?
How do we live with it and not internalize the rejection- when we see what our 'illness' has done to divide us from our families and the loss of being a credible honest person in everyone else's eyes. How does anyone keep on?

i feel so bad about myself most of the time, it's so hard to receive support. Mental disorders definately become a moral issue - it's the only sin that people won't forgive us for, that we can't forgive ourselves for either.

kerria

[tequila3285]

My close family always assures me that I am a good person, but I have some holier than thou cousins that made a comment last summer at our family reunion when I was w/ my kids and husband. I am much more stable now that I am taking meds than when I was in my 20's and not, and one of them made a comment on how all of a sudden, I could be a perfect mother. He said it to be hurtful. There definately is a stigma that we can not function and can not do things that "normal" people do.

[dottie]

Good post. So very true!!!

[Dervish]

Stigmas are perpetuated mainly by HOLLYWOOD.
It is souly responsible for what is acceptable as
sociologically normal.Like the burning depiction of
what a psycho is,at the end of some thriller.
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</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
It is widely accepted now that if an authority figure proposes an invasive course of therapy for a patient like victimization or even torture then 95% of the subordinate employees would do as was ordered
to keep their vocation and salaries unfettered.

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">
Thomas Szasz

[kvinneakt]

2nd reply with the same answer: I have a HUGE issue with this! Someday I will write a dissertation.

The issue I have, in as few words as possible, is that too many people (doctors and patients) are treating "mentally ill" people as though they need to be "fixed" into something "normal." THAT is a moral issue.

I am trying to figure out what happened to a "mad lib" movement of times past. I think that our illnesses are sometimes treated immorally and we would all be sometimes better served by savoring, not smothering our differences.

[dottie]

Hello!

You make a good point here. Thanks!

[January]

Oh Perz,

Are we related? I know it all too well....

So sorry.

Jan

[bonaire]

Has anyone here ever felt that they were being judged or viewed by our world (friends or family too) as morally deficient?

I'm late to this thread. Do I feel this? Sure. I know it - since I do it. I learned to do it from parents, friends, society, tv, teachers, leaders, etc.

Our goal in becoming somewhat enlightened in life is simply - how to feel good with ourselves even if people judge us. As Wayne Dyer said in some of his books: "When you judge another, you do not define them, you define yourself. "

My thinking is: Morals - they are limits to actions of people in a structured society which has defined how people should act. There is no good or bad - just what we judge that to be. Everything is a state of good or "being".

Conundrum - Granny thinks the rock music you listen to is devil music and you are bad for listening to it. Turns out the rock music is by a spiritual band who speaks of the joys of God and life and growth. The moral problem here is that someone else has judged you, you can determine whether you let that sink in or let that be their own definition of themselves and not you.

Oh, it's hard. I have lived for years thinking my wife judged me. Started with my mom when I was younger. This year has been the first year that I've worked on trying to find ways to just let it slide. This is very hard to do - but doable if you intend to get to a point in your life of peace and true happiness.

Let them judge you - your morals are fine. Because they're yours.

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/qu...yer154401.html

[dottie]

You made some very good points.

~Dottie