Walking out for the first time.

My T jokes around and says, "I know you don't want to hear this.... and I know you are thinking-- 'here goes my ****ing asshole therapist again'...." We have been working together for four years. I think some people here might be taking this in an extreme way-- like I said earlier, there is a difference between saying "**** you, "**** off," "asshole," or whatever-- and having a complete "temper tantrum."

To me "acting out" is an unfair label for individuals who just haven't yet learned how to ask for what they need-- and haven't yet learned how to effectively express anger. In some situations, I can effectively express my anger, and in others, I just need to say "**** you," or whatever else. One time I wrote a journal entry because I was so mad at my T and I wrote all these horrific things about him, and the things I wanted to call him, etc. He encouraged me to bring it in and read it-- and I did. And then we processed it.

I think that those who are using the term "abusing" our Ts are seeing it as a bit extreme. I see therapy as a place with no limits-- that, is as long as you don't start throwing furniture at your T.

Right-- perhaps that is your personal boundary, and the boundary of your T, maybe. But that is not for everyone.

Also, I never said anything about my therapist taking abuse from me or yelling at him. Besides, I despise yelling. It's about the most annoying thing anyone can do.

I've done a lot of acting out in therapy, too. For a long time, that was basically all I did, and I think my behavior was probably on the unacceptable side. (Or so other people have told me.) (Not screaming at her, but other things.) My T was extremely patient with me.

However, I have since realized that all that acting out was a necessary part of my therapy. When I started seeing her, I was so dissociated and so numb that I had no idea of what I was feeling and no idea of anything about myself.

I had very little self-awareness. But once I started acting out a bit, I could then see myself better. I could see, for example, that I was upset, which I had not truly realized before.

(It was like, 'well, I can't get out of bed, and I can't do anything, and I cut a lot, but I'm fine, really.')

When I first started therapy, it was like I needed to see my emotions exaggerated in order to notice them. They needed to be in large print, so to speak. So for me, I perceive that whole acting out period as very necessary for me, because it helped me to see who I was.

Of course everyone starts from a different place, with their own personal lesson to learn. So I wouldn't say that T's should automatically allow people to do what I did, and probably most wouldn't. But still, what my T was doing turned out to be right for me.

(I've walked out at times.) (She let me, and didn't get mad.) (She said it was OK, as long as we talked about it.) (She just said that she wanted to know what was going on with me.)

Pink your borderline is showing! I've watched your posts for a couple of years and I know that you are BPD as well as depressed.

I read this thread with great interest. It is interesting the reactions that this kind of thing elicits from us all.

My thoughts are: Pink and her therapist have been working together for a long time, I think 4 yrs is a long time, and they have the relationship that works theraputically for them. I really cant say whether her f*** you is disrespectful or part of the dynamic between them. Now, that said, I am a tantrum thrower and I can curse and be dramatic, but I have never cursed at either dt or ftt. I have cursed in therapy in the course of conversation and so had dt, but not said f*** you. Oh, how I wanted to. When I look back, I wished I had let her know how angry I was either directly or by walking out on her. And if I was to have said f you to her, it would VERY much depend on how I said it. She might have gotten pissed or she might have just looked at me and not responded. I have a feeling there would have been a certain amount of teaching me appropriateness in her response.

Now, that said, I had a therapist 16 yrs ago who I easily could have said that to. His take on things was that any expression of feelings was OK and to be encouraged. Nothing wrong with that, I learned from it, but it did have to be clear to me on some level that it was OK only with him in therapy! I was probably at a place where it was more important to "get it out" than get it out appropriately. And Im still learning how to appropriately express myself.....

To achieve a good result, the client and therapist need to trust each other and develop a good working relationship. The therapist has the right to set boundaries I may not agree with. I have the right to find another therapist with boundaries more conducive in my mind to bringing about a good result.

I ask my therapists a lot of questions about his approach to therapy, what I may expect from him or her and what is expected of me. Having to start anew with a different therapist is quite tedious. The questions are intended to minimize potential problems.

There are also boundaries established by codes of ethics. I try to familiarize myself with any code that may apply.

Ultimately for me, what my therapist and I establish as boundaries during therapy are of no concern to anyone else as long as the dictates of the code of ethics are met. I do not need a consensus of the mental health community or of any interlopers about the appropriateness of the boundaries mutually agreed upon. I am more interested in results.

well put. amen

I agree!!

Tree, to give credit where it's due...TheByzantine originally posted what I quoted.
(I don't know how to have my quote show " originally posted by...")

OH, I know...I was agreeing with you agreeing with TheByzantine!!!

lol, tree

SO, Pink - how'd monday go?
"knowing" you and your T, this seems way out of the ordinary. is he drawing a new boundary with you? my t is doing that and i HATE it. she even told me she'd be doing it and if i'd not been sobbing, i'd have walked out. but she accessed some small part of me who just broke down rather than the adult angry part of me that would have said **** you.

And like normal... the convo has shifted from what you wanted to tell us to many discussing the effectiveness of the interaction. *sigh*.

Sooooooooooo How Did Monday's Session Go???? (getting topic back on track)

kiya, this is an older post...Monday came and went LOL!

yeah but i didn't see any Pink Post about HOW it went. @_@
Pink - you ok out there?

yah. i haven't seen pink about since this thread totally derailed into judgements of what is/isn't acceptable in therapy.

it would be nice if pink was able to get what she wanted from this thread (or a new one, if a different place needs to be created to make it safe).

I think it's worthwhile to just take a break from PC and deal with our own issues. I'm, sure PINK has resolved whatever issues she has with T by now. If not she'll post when she is ready.