Living in self-hate

Blue..
I guess it is all about practice. The practice is hard but you're right.. the fact that I'm okay in my working environment does give me a glimmer of hope, with practice I'll be more comfortable. I was actually not a shy kid.. I was very outgoing until some bad things happened, then I withdrew and never came out. Maybe also that shows me that my "true" personality is not this shy persona.. that healing will come when I break out of my shell.

I'm glad to hear your 13 yo is doing so well, with practice. You're such a good and supportive mother, Blue.

I haven't read all the posts here, but it seems like there are TWO issues, self esteem and social anxiety. I am sure they are related somewhat but most people I know, even T's admit they feel uncomfortable a bit before social engagements. Even people who don't have low self esteem, many still like a little something to relax when in social situations. and yes wine helps and other people take other things.

I see nothing wrong with having a drink of wine to relax if it helps.

As far as the self esteem thing, that is something that therapy is good for.

I have not read through this entire thread, but have been experiencing recently what happens now that I've begun to let go of my feelings of low self-worth. It's more challenging than just knowing all that stuff you thought about yourself was just plain wrong. When you have to actually live it, accept it, allow it...it can be excruciatingly painful. I'm trying to grow into my new skin, but have to fight myself from wanting to latch onto my old comfort zone. Let go of the old painful thoughts and memories and allow the new, true ones in its place. Not easy!

For sure, many, many people experience nervousness and minor anxiety socially. For me the drinking isn't excessive or even problematic, it's just reflective of a larger problem. For example, I have had problems in the past with becoming so self-hating in social situations that I leave to self-harm because I 'messed up so bad.' Eep! Maybe what we're discussing is how social situations triggers larger self-esteem issues?

opps, I am sorry I meant to have said TWO issues, not NO issues. That was a typoo I am going to fix now.

My brain isn't working the greatest right now, I am sorry if anyone got offended by that, because that is certainly not what I meant to type.

I missed typed what I meant earlier. I think social anxiety can be a huge thing, I had it for a very long time before therapy. I felt like such a dork and fumbling idiot, I was so nervous I couldn't even speak in sentences that made any sense if I was at a party or something. I hated parties and would want to avoid them at all costs!

Then my first T said something early on therapy that we all experience some anxiety when we are first around people. He even took beta blockers to deal with his anxiety and he deals with people all the time, but mostly one on one. A party is much different.

So eventually, I don't know how it worked, but I just imagined everyone else in the room feeling as dumb and awkward as me and bam! All of sudden I am the talker of the century and if I mess up, I just laugh at myself in front of people. It seems when I relax, others around me do too. We are all feeling nervous.

But gosh before that happened, I just want to hide with shame of embarrassment.

So if you see a crazy nut at a holiday party or something this year, ask them if they are exotic flower, they just might be. lol If not, you can just laugh it off because most people don't really perceives us as bad as we perceive ourselves in those situations.

I see what you meant! I think we might have the same T lol. Mine also says he is nervous socially but okay one-on-one. I guess it's the same as me--I'm terribly shy, but in my role as a teacher? Downright flamboyant. It's being able to put on that hat, I guess.

This? Is awesome::
This is so true. While we are freaking out about how stupid we seem, so is everybody else!

Kiya- I think it has something to do with what Tree posted about abuse and neglect and the resulting shame. And then self-hate. The thing is, when I talk about it here, I feel less shame, less hatred for myself and the background that I have. I feel less shame for "my story". It just is my story. Not that I dont go back and forth between shame/self hate and confidence and liking myself, but it seem like less of a secret. I feel validated.

Deli- I realized also, it is more women I dont know well as opposed to women who are close to me. With men, I dont feel it as much. I feel more...something....not sure what. Hmmmm..
I understand what you mean about control. Maybe the drink allows me to let go of the control and relax about it. I dont mind being a tipsy Moon I also get tipsy on 1/2 glass LOL!
Its nice you'll be traveling with old friends And they get to see a drunken Deli, huh? Lucky them! Post video

Thanks, Jexa- It is VERY interesting that you werent a shy kid. Id imagine that you probably arent terribly shy, then. Im so sorry these things happened to you, and the way you feel about yourself from that. Im so sorry. I can so understand that. There are incidences in my life that cause me to feel that same kind of self-hate today, I imagine as I integrate them into my story, without judgement, I'll feel better about myself. But that's a huge job and will take a long time. Probably just acknowlefdging it is a step toward healing and more self-love. What do you think?

Brightheart- I think what you said about growing into new skin, allowing yourself to be there withour lapsing into the old comfort zone is very profound. I think a huge part of it is the I am COMFORTABLE not liking myself. Self-love feels, selfish, indulgent, vain, etc. I am actually more comnfortable in the unworthy place. Wow! Amazing insight Brightheart

Skeksi- When I read this my heart dropped. I had forgotten that as a teen, Id SI after social situations. What a self-loathing place to be in. I remember feeling so trapped with no way out. I wanted to be social, I liked people and friends, but felt too self-hating and unable to go after what I needed/wanted. It all triggered larger issues of how different I imagined I was from everyone around me. Sigh.....

Exotic- LOL! Im so late to my own thread that I didnt get to see the typo to be offended. But, you are right. These are 2 issues. And I think everyone probably experiences social anxiety and it probably is a matter of degree. I think, for me, it brings up larger issues of self-hate. In subtle ways, in ways that I a notice about myself and my feelings, but may not be apparent to anyone with me. I know these feelings are there, and a glass of wine seems to help me with these fears. Nothing wrong with the glass of wine, but Id like to not feel the deeper, sometimes subtle and sometimes not so subtle, feelings of hate and unworthiness in social situations. BUT! I went to a wedding last night, no wine. I had fun, danced up a storm, and talked to a lot of people I knew and some I didnt know so well, and although it was good, I STILL notice the very subtle self-worth issues in conversation when I socialize. Its not paralysing by any means, but I notice it there.

HI Bluemoon

Well you are one up on me! I can't dance at all in public, to me that is 100X worse than talking to people. and without any wine, you must be a whole lot more courageous than you think!

I do love the image off you dancing you butt off! I do wish I could let myself go. I am so NOT telling my T about this one, because she might make me do it! lol It is funny because I did tell my first T this and well he has the same issue when it comes to dancing, so he couldn't help me! He was like, yeah, I know what you mean.

I am reminded of the movie My Best Friends Wedding where this girlfriend of this guy sings karaoke and is so dreadfully bad that she is actually cute because you just goes for it. Now that is the confidence I wish I had, but then again it maybe is only in movies.

I am glad you had a great time!

Reading this reminded me of a dream I had last night, I was at a concert & dancing my BUTT OFF, just really letting go, like I would never, EVER do in real life (except alone in my apartment, lol!) and wow, it felt SO GOOD. I wish I could have the courage & lack of self-consciousness & embarrassment to ever do that in real life. It felt SO GOOD!

Too funny! After everything Im posting Im talking about dancing my butt off. I think I do have confidence, but I dont. I dont even know what I mean or how to describe it. I chat pretty freely, I go dance and I talk to people I dont know. At one point, my husband didnt want to dance and I STILL wanted to, so I said to him, "If you dont want to dance how about if I ask X (my husband's friend) to dance, you're not going to be jealous, are you?" LOL! So, he waved his hand at me and said, "Go ahead!" And I lef thim with the kiddies....I was on a roll!

What does it all mean? What I posted about difficulties with self-worth are all true. And the subtle self-hate thing. Maybe its sometimes true? maybe its a matter of degree? Maybe its who I am at the moment. This may be frighteningly true, it feels as if there are parts of me that are so dramatically different from each other...not in a dissociated way, but maybe it has some sort of relation to parts and dissociation...if that makes any sense....it makes some slight sense to me, but Im not completely sure what I mean.

It doesn't have to make sense, BlueMoon. You seem to be functioning pretty darned well without satisfactory answers to most of the above, so do you even need those answers? What happens if you try making up just any old answers? "Because the sky is blue."

I'd expect that if you just let yourself be and just watch, you'll eventually come up with lots of good answers of your own.

I never thought of these woman as my mother I just subconsciously thought they would feel towards me the same way that my mother did. My mother's treatment of me was narcissistic and the message that I got was that I wasn't too valuable. I subconsciously assumed that all women would look at me with the same beliefs - that I wasn't valuable............