[struggling2]

"Needy" vs. "strong"
Adult children of neglectful mothers often carry a powerful longing for nurturing and acknowledgement, along with an explosive cache of unexpressed grief and pain. There can be deep conflict between the "needy" young voice looking for mothering, and the "strong" older voice of self-protection and survival. Neither voice seems to hold the answer, since both vulnerable neediness and inauthentic façades lead to painful, chaotic relationships. It turns out that both voices hold parts of the answer. The needy voice is right about needing to learn the missing lessons of self-acceptance and emotional containment, in order to safely release that cache of emotions. The strong voice is right that adults need to maintain clear boundaries, rather than merge like infants.

I read this a few days ago (cant remember where) and wrote it down. Its so frustratingly relevant to how I feel. Argh!

I relate to this, I call them my 2 competing trains of thought. Little Lola and Big Lola. They don't play well together and I seem to jump from one to the other. I asked my T why I was so emotionally sensitive to others and he said I am not always that way, mater of fact sometimes I am polar opposite. That would be the ying and yang of me. It's frustrating to not have a happy well adjusted middle me.

[2or3things]

I consistently feel like the resolution to precisely this tension is the #1 thing I'm missing in my life, and the best hope I have for peace.

Anyone every worked this out successfully in therapy? Sounds like a few of us could use some tips.

Thanks for sharing, Struggling!

[struggling2]

Originally Posted by LolaCabanna

It's frustrating to not have a happy well adjusted middle me.

SO frustrating! I also thing there is a teenage struggling. She is rearing her bratty head right now. Little Struggling just wants to be held and loved and nurtured and taken care of. Teenage Struggling is really ticked off and angry and wants to break things and yell and scream and punch. Then there's big struggling who is going "WTF is going on?!?!?!?!?!"

ahhhhhh when will it end!

[Paige008]

I can SO relate to this too! I push and push and push people away and deny their affection, but, really, the one thing I want most is for someone to just hug me and tell me it's all okay. I want someone to care about me so bad that it hurts, but, at the same time, I can't and won't believe someone who says they do care. I'm so embarrassed by how I am, but I can't help wanting it and despising it at the same time.

Ick...how do we get over this one...?

Thank you for sharing this!

I have and still do the push pull thing sometimes. I think that comes from fear or abandonment. I want so much to be loved but I know that it will someday end and hurt like hell, so in essence I crave exactly what I fear.

[critterlady]

My T and I have been talking about this a lot lately. He said something that floored me in its simplicity - you can be both needy and strong. Everyone has needs. There's nothing wrong with having needs. Wanting to get those needs met does not mean you're weak.

[wheeler]

I'm usually just a lurker/reader/quiet suppporter but I have to chime in on this as well. It feels like if I could resolve this issue I would be nearly normal(nearly!).

Does talking,and talking about this with our therapist really help?

[ScrewedUpMe]

This is SO true to how I feel, Struggling. Hugs to you

[elliemay]

the thought of merging, even as an infant, makes my hair stand on end with revulsion.

That can't be a good sign.

[Dreamy01]

I relate to this so well too.

[Anne2.0]

Originally Posted by critterlady

There's nothing wrong with having needs. Wanting to get those needs met does not mean you're weak.

This makes me want to take a deep breath, release the tension in my shoulders (in a good way). Like, ahhhhh . . . .

Rings so true to me, yet I have such a hard time believing this-- or maybe, putting it into practice.

10yrs ago I too was of the opinion that being strong equalled doing things myself. I didn't need no one!!! Thank god I Amon longer that prisoner. I feel FREE. I adore the idea we need others too. That can take the form of just talking to a work colleague during break, her listening & responding, I feel refreshed. BUT I had to learn this first in a safe enviroment. In therapy with a T I learn to trust. Everything I am able to do now outside of therapy regardess relating and attachments is because of the attachment that grew in therapy. I am actually stronger because I am 'weaker'. Or put another way, I swooped dependence and self reliance for interdependence. That is a wonderful freeing place to be in.
I have a siren that goes of automatically now when I hear others still at the point of stubborn self reliance, it makes me smile quietly to myself thinking "that was me once". Fortunately my journey steered me right.

[Amyscience]

I so needed this thread right now.

[Ike McCaslin]

I needed it too, S2. thanks bunches. I think I'll show it to PDOC tomorrow.

Wow!! I can so relate to this right now, was talking with t about the same sort of thing this morning. Basically I'd been trying to end my therapy for a couple months now and she keeps encouraging me not to whenever I talk about it and I finally had the realization a couple weeks ago what is going on with me. I realized that I was getting something from t and our t relationship that I didn't get from my mother when i was growing up and it was going around in this big circle and I'd get pissed and think "Bah! I don't need HER and I don't want to need YOU!" [stomping feet]. I had sent her an email after having the realization but we didn't have an appointment til today to talk about it, thankfully I ended the email by asking her to remind me to talk about it. I was pretty nervous, but we talked about it and she said the same thing about it not making you weak to need someone, she said that not everyone is able to do this depth work that I am doing, a lot of people who start get overwhelmed and quit (like I tried to do, but she said she sensed my commitment to the process so wasn't going to let me quit easy) and that when doing this kind of depth work, you need someone to contain your process, I'm not sure I really grasp exactly what that means, but it made me feel better, and I was so glad that we talked about it. Tonite anyway, I am not worried about "needing" her. It's okay to need something that is healthy and helpful for me. And working with her definitely is.

[Ike McCaslin]

S2, where is this quote from?

[stopdog]

http://www.traumahealed.com/articles...mothering.html
scroll down to the heading needy v strong

[Ike McCaslin]

SD, you may appreciate this, I did not want to end my question with a preposition, but the best I could come up with was, "From whence does this quote originate?" So I just left 'from' at the end of the question.

[stopdog]

From whence is always a great way to start a question.

Great thread s2. If only we knew how to merge the adult and child into a healthier being. I wish I wasn't so needy but now I know why because my needs weren't met when I was younger, so if we get them met now will they go away??

[elliemay]

Originally Posted by button30

Great thread s2. If only we knew how to merge the adult and child into a healthier being. I wish I wasn't so needy but now I know why because my needs weren't met when I was younger, so if we get them met now will they go away??

In my opinion, no. This may sound bleak, but I do think we get one shot at a childhood and developing an innate sense of security and satiety.

If those needs are not met well enough, then they just aren't met.

I do NOT believe that means we are doomed to a crappy life, but it's a life we have to cultivate ourselves.

After many years of self reflection I've come to believe that a major source of upset for myself and perhaps a lot of people is that, in the absence of a "good enough" childhood, we *create* what we think it should have been like.

We then spend a lot of time pursuing our idea of what it should have been like. An idealized version of life, people, things, but it's an ideal version, not entirely anchored in reality.

The space between what *is* and what we think *should be* causes a never ending sense of longing and hurt.

But that doesn't mean that accepting *what is* is easy. It's been one of the hardest things I've ever done.

Call it ego strength, call it self-confidence, call it consolidation of identity and self, but developing it has been essential for me to move into the now.

It's kind of like the knowledge that "no matter what comes my way (disappointments etc..) I'm okay." I have roots.

Given that knowledge, the world kind of opens up a bit. I feel freer, less scared, more connected.

It's always a work in progress, of course, but I've come miles and miles down that road of giving up what is essentially a fantasy (albeit a good one) and embracing and loving my life, the people in it, and myself as is.

And, evidently I also embrace becoming preachy and long-winded. Sorry.

[feralkittymom]

Originally Posted by elliemay

In my opinion, no. This may sound bleak, but I do think we get one shot at a childhood and developing an innate sense of security and satiety.

If those needs are not met well enough, then they just aren't met.

I do NOT believe that means we are doomed to a crappy life, but it's a life we have to cultivate ourselves.

After many years of self reflection I've come to believe that a major source of upset for myself and perhaps a lot of people is that, in the absence of a "good enough" childhood, we *create* what we think it should have been like.

We then spend a lot of time pursuing our idea of what it should have been like. An idealized version of life, people, things, but it's an ideal version, not entirely anchored in reality.

The space between what *is* and what we think *should be* causes a never ending sense of longing and hurt.

But that doesn't mean that accepting *what is* is easy. It's been one of the hardest things I've ever done.

Call it ego strength, call it self-confidence, call it consolidation of identity and self, but developing it has been essential for me to move into the now.

It's kind of like the knowledge that "no matter what comes my way (disappointments etc..) I'm okay." I have roots.

Given that knowledge, the world kind of opens up a bit. I feel freer, less scared, more connected.

It's always a work in progress, of course, but I've come miles and miles down that road of giving up what is essentially a fantasy (albeit a good one) and embracing and loving my life, the people in it, and myself as is.

And, evidently I also embrace becoming preachy and long-winded. Sorry.

Not long-winded nor preachy--just wise.

But I would add that I think it is possible to internalize that missing quality from a T relationship, and that it can then serve as the impetus to providing your own foundation that includes the internalization, but grows beyond it, too.

[pachyderm]

Anyone here ever studied physics? The swinging back and forth between extreme states is characteristic of an oscillator that is less than optimally damped. Sometimes an external force (therapist) is needed to supply the damping -- just the right amount, not too much, not too little.

Sound anything like bipolar (manic-depressive) disorder?

Tells you something about what is happening with some internal system, I think.

OK, back to your regularly-scheduled life now...

[doyoutrustme]

Where did you find that?

I'm a child of borderline and I feel exactly like this. I sometimes literally split in two.