Can therapy and the therapeutic relationship work without attachment to t ?

Please forgive me for being thick....but I really want to understand this attachment thing.

I understand that there are 3 or 4 attachment types in childhood, and I am still unclear which one I had.....most probably the most messed up one! What I don't understand is HOW you are supposed to find attachment with a T, and what exactly this looks like?

Can anyone explain this to me please?

There are also 4 attachment styles in adulthood, loosely based on the child attachment styles. I think you can not really control the attachment if you start to trust and speak to the T. It just happens. The attachment system is typically only activated when the relationship is threatened in some way. A disagreement can bring up distress, if it is a termination then you get thrown into a s***storm of uncontrollable emotions. I am going through this and started with a new T last week and am also terrified of becoming attached or more of the end of the relationship, as it will have to happen someday and I may not have a say when this is.

It will look different for every person and does depend on your attachment style as a child. But also it depends on the type of relationship ie how you relate to friends, family members, your children, males, females. You can find your attachment style by doing this questionnaire Relationship Structures

From there you read up more about your style and patterns in relationships. It's really good stuff to know.

It is possible to trust a T without being attached. Like me and Mr T.

But perhaps I have a narrow view of attachment.

Thanks Asia...that is really interesting! I am going to spend some time on the link you gave me, and will probably share the results with my T. Maybe I'll get him to let me know what he thinks first.

I think it is important to know.....then figure out what to do about it. My initial result from the test you linked to is Fearful attachment style. Not surprising really...........

I'm so with you on this one, Sweepy my love! I tried to do this with my T for a whole year with pretty good success (in that I succeeded in not becoming attached). I just reported stuff to her and we talked about it and that was that. I was very proud of myself for avoiding the whole attachment quagmire. I felt like this was evidence that I'd grown up a lot and made a lot of progress.

And then the freaking attachment snuck up on me and I was so devastated! My whole plan had been to keep therapy neat and not need her! Damn!

I'll tell you how it has made a difference in my therapy though. Before attachment happened I would just report some traumatic thing that had happened and not have a lot of feelings about it. I told her about some trauma and she seemed a lot more upset about it than I did. It was the session before she was going to be away for two weeks and she was all concerned that I'd have to be alone with it for that long. I thought it was sweet of her to be concerned but i wasn't at all concerned. I was like "oh well, no one's life is perfect and this kind of thing is super common so I'm not going to cry about it like a freakin baby--it's really not such a big deal." I didn't miss her or feel sorry that she wasn't there the following week.

After attachment I told her about the same trauma and felt just devastated about it. I felt all the shame and humiliation and anger that was associated with it. I felt the terribly sad for myself that I'd had to be so alone with such a big thing and that no one had helped me. I felt bewildered and betrayed that the adults in my life at the time hadn't seemed to care very much. For a long while I just felt gross and horrible all the time. I needed her constantly and it was a terribly uncomfortable and desperate feeling. (Full disclosure: unfortunately that needy feeling is still there but it's a bit less intense and I don't feel gross all of the time.)

But experiencing her care made a huge difference in helping me feel better about the trauma. She'd cared when I initially told her too, but I hadn't let myself really feel her care. Because I wasn't attached and was keeping her at arm's length. She explained to me that therapy works when you are able to re-experience some of the feelings associated with difficult periods in your life in a relationship that is supportive and non-shaming. It's like your brain is rewired to no longer associate your trauma with shame. You start to internalize T's compassion for you and feel compassion for yourself. And that's huge.

I don't know if you have much choice about attachment. It either happens or it doesn't. Like falling in love.

mine too Very high scores for fearful/anxious.

Attachment is a double-edged sword. It leads to high expectations which the T doesn't always meet. It is a recipe for disappointment.

This has been my experience at times.,,

Thats what i am saying, you can trust somebody without the attachment thing, I have done it irl, but in therapy somehow, something happens, and I am looking to avoid that with this new t, I am looking to approach this one differently next week is my second session, I want to be a step ahead of this attachment thing, of course I need to trust to work on things ( but I dont need the attachement thing)

thanks, but I am looking to avoid, that need, that part where, I miss her, or i think about her from session to session, or want to call her, or all of that. I dont want to go through that yet again, this attachment really does sneak up on you out of the blue, but I am looking to beat it, I am really focused on working on the relationship, building trust, but picking out the attachment, and I want to succeed at this, and I was going to ask her about this attachment thing, but I have changed my mind, because if I do, she will know I am looking to avoid it, and she will find a way to insert in there some how, right now she is so high strung on emotions and feelings, and it was our first session, she knows I have a hard time with those 2 things.

You have a secure attachment to Mr. T then. You don't doubt him or run from him or anything like that. You are attached, though.

Good luck. Therapists are wily.

I wanted to share that sometimes, we have a different attachment style with one person than another person. Like I am securely attached to my h. He knows me well, I trust him and feel safe with him. On the other hand, I have disorganized attachment with my t.

The difference is that most of my attachment trauma is related to my relationship with my mom growing up - combined with traumatic rejections in my adulthood by friends who were older women. So since the t relationship has some of the features of a parent - child dynamic (she's an older woman just a few years younger than my mom), those old longings, pains, and struggles show up in the therapy relationship.

It's interesting to me that although I had CSA as a child by a neighbor, it was the emotional neglect that resulted in the most damage. My t said, "The damage that was done to you wasn't so much because of the things that were done TO you, but the things that you needed so much that DID NOT happen.

I think its good that you put out there all this stuff running thru your mind. Because otherwise if you just keep it in and are afraid to say it to anyone, it just festers inside and holds up your therapy. My t guessed my big secret this week - that i was going to therapy for him, not for me. Talk about ugly transference. We all discussed here in other threads, about how my mother kept me close, but just to lie to me and pinch me. But i still felt safe. It wasnt a good attachment. You cant have it both ways, i think - reenact your bad attachment with your mother with your t, AND get good advice etc from your t. It wont "take" - like the rain on the too-dry soil.

That sounds really deep, I acknowledge that I had a bad attachment growing up, and maybe that is why I have or fear attachment now, sort of like push and pull in therapy and real life, either I attach too much or attach and pull away, either way I dont know how to attach and leave normally, and of course with 2 therapists leaving in the middle of my therapy has not really helped any, and my attachment fears have grown, maybe that is why I am looking to avoid it, and of course this new t is most aware of this, she acknowledged it in one of our transition sessions, saying that even a person without attachment or abandonment issues, would likely have a problem with 2 therapists leaving in the middle of deep work. really (sarcastic)

I think you really need to define what your idea of attachment is. I have never felt or wanted to be "attached to my T. My association is simply a business association. I do not need to be in love with my T but I do need to feel that T and I can communicate on the same level. I have always felt that my T needs to "listen" to what I am saying and not dismiss my feelings as I express them. She can challenge my thinking process but it is my choice if I am willing to change. Just like T needs to "listen" to me I also need to "listen" to what she says and try keep an open mind to her point of view.

Think of your T relationship as you would a teacher. You are there to learn from the teacher but at the end of the class you are moving on to a different class and a different teacher.

by attachment i mean that feeling of building a relationship, and then getting that feeling where you are so comfortable with this person that you become dependent and, start missing them, and think about them between sessions, and when in distress you need to call them, or are looking foward to your next session, or start idealizing them, or liking them. I want to avoid that. I want it to be like a dr patient relationship, i go i talk, they talk back, i agree or disagree, the hour ends , i go home, not think about her till I see her again, if she is out, or cancels or goes on vacation, I will not miss her, If i am in distress, I will call my crisis team , not her come to my mind first. if she tells me 6 months down the line that she is leaving, I will say ok, have a nice life. if she tells me i need to refer you to someone else , I will say fine.I can cancel , without thinking about it twice, or thinking about how she feels about why I cancelled. I want to be like teflon.

I think it is possible.

I really hope so stopdog, thanks for the encouragement I am for sure going to give it a shot, I think its healthy, sometimes I wonder if this dependancy they create may harm the client in some way, or maybe i am not thinking rationally, not to say that this attachment is unhealthy for everybody, because this works for lots of clients, but for me its rubbing me the wrong way.

for many clients they need this attachment in order to heal properly and i respect them for wanting that attachment.

Again, who is this for? We dont attach FOR the t's sake. I think its like, our bad attachment was a tree with rotten or shallow roots. We now attach to the ground with good roots by working with t. Then we can withstand any bad winds without being blown away. Its about becoming a good strong tree. The t is just fertilizer!

I bolded the part of your post that caught my eye. I don't see that description as healthy, secure attachment. The question probably is: are you capable of developing a healthy, secure attachment with a therapist? That may not be within your skill-set right now; I don't know. In fact, just thinking you must worry and fight the "attachment" is probably a strong indicator that you won't have much success in avoiding some sort of attachment issues, even if in a very negative way, because you are placing so much emphasis on it. It's like saying "I won't think about cows; I won't think about cows." You're going to think about cows.

Your description of what you "want" (teflon) from the therapy relationship is also not realistic. Parts of it are, but all of it? Probably not.

I've never liked the word "attachment" much. I never heard it used in this context until I came to PC. To me, an attachment is a device I put on my vacuum cleaner when I need to clean between the seat cushions, OR it is the kind of almost sacred bond that exists between parent and child. My therapist is not a vacuum cleaner, and I certainly don't have that kind of parent/child dynamic either.

I prefer to say that my T and I are quite compatible. We get along well. He "gets" me and my issues. I do think about our sessions some between them, but I don't obsess over them. I have no problem missing a session now and then for vacations, etc., but it is nice to get back and talk when he's back. I do call him when I am in a crisis; I'd detest calling some crisis team. Yuck! But I don't call him when I'm not in crisis. When he retires in the next few years, I will be sad because we've shared a great deal over the years, but I will be able to move on.

It isn't about teflon. It is just about growing a healthy, trusting relationship based in the reality of the circumstance. You can have a healthy relationship and be able to manage your feelings and actions, manage separations, and manage the inevitable end of that relationship. No one's therapy relationship is going to last forever. Someone is going to move or retire or heal or something eventually. You can't teflon your way out of relationships in life. Well, I suppose you could, but what a sad existence that would be.

I think it really depends on the person. For some people attachment is the issue, they have intimacy problems, not a lot of human connectedness, depression, etc. I think for those people that are in a talking kind of therapy attachment is part of the deal. On the other hand I could see someone who is maybe OCD or has a phobia and goes to see a CBT shrink not needing to attach to benefit. I'm thinking that because CBT just focuses on specific problems as opposed to the whole person.